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CAP Talk  |  General Discussion  |  Uniforms & Awards  |  Topic: The proper wear of CAP ribbons
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Author Topic: The proper wear of CAP ribbons  (Read 129860 times)
PWK-GT
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« Reply #160 on: April 28, 2010, 05:44:21 AM »

I disagree.  The only way to get folks to wear their uniforms correctly is person-to-person training called an inspection.  Inspections are teaching tools.  There's too many out there who are frightened to stand a bunch of folks in line and show them where they're making mistakes. 

Reading regulations?  That's an exercise in folly.  Heck, I've got 35 years experience and I can't decipher what the regulation says on uniforms occasionally.  Positive leadership, not passive ("Here, read this.  There's something wrong with your uniform") leadership is what is needed.  C'mon folks.  Train your people.  What are you afraid of?

+1 :clap:
« Last Edit: April 28, 2010, 01:53:59 PM by MIKE » Report to moderator   Logged
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Slim
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« Reply #161 on: April 29, 2010, 04:25:43 AM »

(1.) Although I don't dispute that Coast Guard Auxiliary ribbons can't be worn on the CAP uniform, some of the ribbons/medals earned by the Coast Guard Auxiliary are federal or are U.S. Department of Transportaton-related. Are those still worn?

This is one of those gray areas where regs seem to contradict themselves.  CAPM 39-1 states:

Quote from: CAPM 39-1, Para 5-4
5-4. Military Service Awards. Military service ribbons may be worn on the CAP AF-style uniform provided they were awarded in writing by competent military authority. Awards of the Air Force, Army, Navy, Marine Corps, or Coast Guard will be worn in the order prescribed by the awarding service, subject to the following: In all cases of relative priority, Air Force awards will take precedence.
See Table 5-3. Awards for wars, campaigns, expeditions etc., will be worn in chronological sequence.

While CAPR 39-3 says:

Quote from: CAPR 39-3, Sec A, para 3b"
b. Decorations, ribbons, and badges authorized for wear on the U.S. Air Force uniform may be worn on the CAP AF-style uniform when earned through qualification and awarded by competent authority to a member for service performed in any branch of the Armed Forces of the United States or its allies. (Foreign decorations, ribbons, badges, etc., awarded in writing to a member not in the Armed Forces of the United States may also be worn if approved by National Headquarters.) Aeronautical badges, emblems, insignia, ribbons, etc., given by a foreign government, or agency, as souvenirs or emblems of friendship do not qualify as earned awards and will not be worn on the CAP uniform. All cases where doubt exists as to the propriety of a badge, medal or other device being worn will be referred to National Headquarters for decision.

So, while the uniform reg says they can be worn, the 39-3 specifies that the award has to be earned for service performed while a member of any branch of the military.  Since Coast Guard Auxiliarists are also civilians, there is a shadow of doubt as to whether Coast Guard awards earned by them can be worn on the uniform.

As someone who earned two Coast Guard Unit Commendations and the Coast Guard Special Operations ribbon while in the CGAux, the hassle of wearing them on a CAP uniform (when I could) just wasn't worth it to me.
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Slim
manfredvonrichthofen
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« Reply #162 on: May 20, 2010, 04:11:14 AM »

to my understanding of the 39-1 RM badgessuch as Combat Infantry Badge and Air Assault Pathfinder and such are auth along with the RM Ribbons on USAF type uniform only
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PHall
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« Reply #163 on: May 20, 2010, 04:28:59 AM »

to my understanding of the 39-1 RM badgessuch as Combat Infantry Badge and Air Assault Pathfinder and such are auth along with the RM Ribbons on USAF type uniform only

You are correct, military badges can only be worn on the "military" uniforms.
No military badges allowed on any of the "corperate" uniforms.
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manfredvonrichthofen
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« Reply #164 on: May 20, 2010, 04:38:30 AM »

I would love to see what they actually mean by skill badges from the army such as i have a combat infantry badge an air assault badge and a pathfinder badge i want to see a picture of what they mean by how they are worn on the USAF style service uniform and BDUs
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wacapgh
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« Reply #165 on: May 20, 2010, 07:33:16 PM »

Well, here's the rub. 39-1 hasn't been updated to match current USAF policy.

When it was last revised in 2005, 39-1 was based on the 2004 USAF manuals (called Air Force Instructions or AFI),  that were current.

In 2006, the USAF revised the dress and appearance AFI.  Part of the changes was restricting the wear of "sister service" badges - CIB, Air Assault, tabs, rockers, combat patches, etc. - to only when permanently assigned to an Army, USMC, Navy, USCG, etc. unit (TDY does not count). Once you PCS back to a USAF unit, they all come off.

Both 39-1 and 39-3 both state that only the military badges, decorations, and ribbons authorized for wear on the USAF uniform are authorized on the USAF-Style uniforms. The list of badges in the 39-1 was accurate when it was created in 2005, bu no longer matches current USAF policy as defined in the 2006 AFI.

So, absent clarification from NHQ we are in a situation where one part of our regulations says Yes you can wear it, but part of the same regulation and another regulation says that we follow USAF policy so No you can't.  :-\
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manfredvonrichthofen
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« Reply #166 on: May 20, 2010, 08:02:26 PM »

Well im personally very proud of my CIB Air Assault and Pathfinder badges so I will continue to wear then the best I can according to the 39-1 until it is changed... God willing never. Now I know I can only wear two of them at a time so I will stick with the CIB and AASLT badges. they look like they fit the best on the uniforms.
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Custer
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« Reply #167 on: June 04, 2010, 10:37:20 PM »

I'd be curious to know where this member is going to put them on the shirt anyway.
Resting on, but not over, the top edge of the pocket.   :)
Which is the same place they go on that bright red shirt with the Cessna on it
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jimmydeanno
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« Reply #168 on: June 04, 2010, 10:45:52 PM »

I'd be curious to know where this member is going to put them on the shirt anyway.
Resting on, but not over, the top edge of the pocket.   :)
Which is the same place they go on that bright red shirt with the Cessna on it

I think you forgot the [sarcasm] tags...


I hope
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If you have ten thousand regulations you destroy all respect for the law. - Winston Churchill
Check Pilot/Tow Pilot
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« Reply #169 on: June 04, 2010, 10:54:42 PM »

That's where I put them on my red Cessna 182RG Shirt...
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RVT
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« Reply #170 on: June 20, 2010, 09:27:33 PM »

Has anybody seen anything in CAP channels to figure out what ribbons NOT to wear in order to keep the top of my wings below the notch of the collar?  If I wear everything authorized by the AF and CAP, it comes to a total of 46 ribbons.  Aside from looking like a Peruvian Admiral, the top of my wings end up under my epaulet.

This would be solved through the use of miniature ribbons - however I do not know of anyone who makes CAP ribbons of that type.  39-3 doesn't even address the existence of miniature ribbons so it may be a moot point.

There is an alternative solution.  Regarding full size ribbons, there is a phrase in 39-1 that reads "wear all or some" on Page 16 (with that really young looking full colonel on it) that does not go on to specify any criteria - so you can apparently leave off whatever you think isn't important.  An example would be a CAP Major wearing a membership ribbon.  Sort of redundant, as it is a prerequisite for having any rank at all.
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Eclipse
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« Reply #171 on: June 20, 2010, 09:41:21 PM »

There's also the option of wearing only CAP ribbons, or concentrating the space on those and limiting the military ones, since in this context those are the ones most important to the people reading your resume.
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PHall
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« Reply #172 on: June 20, 2010, 10:15:06 PM »

Actually, in CAPR 50-17, the Senior Member Professional Development reg, it does state that if you do need to reduce the number of ribbons worn, you can just wear your highest Senior Member Training Level ribbon, i.e. if you have completed Level IV, you only need to wear your Garber Ribbon and you can ditch the ribbons for levels I, II and III.

You can also wear just some of your military ribbons. I just wear the four individual awards that have been awarded.
(Meritorious Service Medal, Aerial Achievement Medal, AF Commendation Medal and AF Achievement Medal)
Everything else I've been awarded was pretty much the same BTDT stuff everybody else gets so I felt no burning need to wear them on my CAP uniform.
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Old Timer
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« Reply #173 on: June 20, 2010, 10:26:52 PM »

You guys ever seen pictures of General Carl Spaatz? 

You remember the famed wartime leader of the AAF and later a National Commander in CAP.  Think there is an award named after the man somewhere in CAP?

Five ribbons and his wings. That's all.

Don't know why, but I would tend to think that the commanding officer of the "Question Mark" earned a few more than just five ribbons in his storied career.

Yet, all you see on his uniform are five ribbons and his wings on his "Class A's" (remember, it was still the U.S. Army at the time)   

Maybe you can wear your Wilson, Spaatz, Crossfield, command service, disaster service and red service (of course if you earned them) and one badge. 

Says it all, and a bit more Spaatz-like.
« Last Edit: June 20, 2010, 11:06:57 PM by Old Timer » Report to moderator   Logged
Eclipse
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« Reply #174 on: June 21, 2010, 03:01:03 AM »

You guys ever seen pictures of General Carl Spaatz? 

You remember the famed wartime leader of the AAF and later a National Commander in CAP.  Think there is an award named after the man somewhere in CAP?

Five ribbons and his wings. That's all.

Don't know why, but I would tend to think that the commanding officer of the "Question Mark" earned a few more than just five ribbons in his storied career.

Yet, all you see on his uniform are five ribbons and his wings on his "Class A's" (remember, it was still the U.S. Army at the time)   

Maybe you can wear your Wilson, Spaatz, Crossfield, command service, disaster service and red service (of course if you earned them) and one badge. 

Says it all, and a bit more Spaatz-like.





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DakRadz
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« Reply #175 on: June 22, 2010, 07:43:26 PM »

Top picture is broken- besides, if you're meeting the POTUS, you're probably going to be a bit dressier. So.. YMMV.
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Eclipse
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« Reply #176 on: June 22, 2010, 09:03:41 PM »

Top pic displays fine for me, hit refresh, its off the Spaatz org site. - lots more where those came from all over.

Bottom line, the assertion he never wore more than five is false, in fact, I could only find one photo that showed him with five. Hint - the more stars he got, the more ribbons he wore, even on his Ike jacket.
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DakRadz
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« Reply #177 on: June 23, 2010, 05:05:43 AM »

Top pic displays fine for me, hit refresh, its off the Spaatz org site. - lots more where those came from all over.

Bottom line, the assertion he never wore more than five is false, in fact, I could only find one photo that showed him with five. Hint - the more stars he got, the more ribbons he wore, even on his Ike jacket.

Ah, I see now- the more they paid his aide, the more ribbons he was willing to position for his general!
Or, he got more vain as he earned more rank- heck, happens to me all the time.
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GTCommando
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« Reply #178 on: September 12, 2010, 04:52:12 PM »

I don't have time to read through the whole thread, but concerning the original pdf posted by AlphaSigOU, Bravo! It will make things easier for a semi-old-timer like me, let alone a newbie to CAP. Keep up the good work.  :clap:
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HGjunkie
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« Reply #179 on: September 12, 2010, 04:59:09 PM »







Ah, the days when you stitched your ribbons to the service coat. Wonder if that would ever come back up...  >:D
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CAP Talk  |  General Discussion  |  Uniforms & Awards  |  Topic: The proper wear of CAP ribbons
 


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