Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?
February 17, 2019, 07:28:38 AM
Home Help Login Register
News:

CAP Talk  |  General Discussion  |  Membership  |  Topic: Why are Cadet Crossover Members so Rare?
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
Pages: 1 ... 3 4 [5]  All Print
Author Topic: Why are Cadet Crossover Members so Rare?  (Read 15108 times)
Cool Mace
Seasoned Member

Posts: 351

« Reply #80 on: December 17, 2012, 04:45:46 PM »

So do you think that cadets turning senior should be a case by case situation when it comes to how "hand on" they can be?

I'd also be in favor of discussions that simply ended the cadet program at 18 for anyone not in Phase 4, and set
senior membership at 21 period.

:TOPIC DRIFT:

I've talked with a few other members about this, or least, along those lines.

At 18, they would hold senior status and be treated as a senior. But they would hold their cadet rank to have a shot at the Spaatz award. Since 18 is legal age in the US, it becomes sort of a "limbo" for those cadets. CPPT applies to them, but then they are told to share bucks, and shower time with the rest of cadets.

It puts them in a weird position.
Logged
CAP is what you make of it. If you don't put anything in to it, you won't get anything out of it.
Eaker #2250
C/Lt Col, Ret.
The cookies and donuts were a lie.
Eclipse
Too Much Free Time Award

Posts: 29,527

« Reply #81 on: December 17, 2012, 04:51:23 PM »

Limbo members would make things worse.

Cadets are served by the program, seniors serve the program.  A hybrid of that would not be functional in any meaningful way
that makes a difference over today's rules.
Logged


a2capt
300,000th Post Author
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 5,089
Unit: pǝʇɹǝʌuı

« Reply #82 on: December 17, 2012, 04:58:15 PM »

..and then there certainly is the argument that some people would be unfairly penalized because of that rule. Provision it so that there can be variances, or the individual in an assistant role somehow.

I've seen it way more often than not, that a prior cadet can't seem to separate themselves though the ability to do it seems to be better for those who reach Spaatz vs. the ones that didn't, timed out or turned early.
Logged
Cool Mace
Seasoned Member

Posts: 351

« Reply #83 on: December 17, 2012, 04:59:08 PM »

We were seeing it as a "best of both worlds" in a sense.

Since cadets over 18 have to be careful do to legal issues, and have to watch their back. This would eliminate all that. But they would still be able to achieve the Spaatz.
Again, just an idea that would/will never go anywhere.
Logged
CAP is what you make of it. If you don't put anything in to it, you won't get anything out of it.
Eaker #2250
C/Lt Col, Ret.
The cookies and donuts were a lie.
Eclipse
Too Much Free Time Award

Posts: 29,527

« Reply #84 on: December 17, 2012, 05:15:06 PM »

We were seeing it as a "best of both worlds" in a sense.

Since cadets over 18 have to be careful do to legal issues, and have to watch their back. This would eliminate all that. But they would still be able to achieve the Spaatz.
Again, just an idea that would/will never go anywhere.

What "legal issues" do cadets over 18 have to deal with?  Within the program they are not considered adults, anything else is external
and CAP has no control over it.
Logged


Cool Mace
Seasoned Member

Posts: 351

« Reply #85 on: December 17, 2012, 05:23:37 PM »

We were seeing it as a "best of both worlds" in a sense.

Since cadets over 18 have to be careful do to legal issues, and have to watch their back. This would eliminate all that. But they would still be able to achieve the Spaatz.
Again, just an idea that would/will never go anywhere.

What "legal issues" do cadets over 18 have to deal with?  Within the program they are not considered adults, anything else is external
and CAP has no control over it.

My point exactly. Those cadets aren't covered under CAP.

Say at encampment. Open bay showers, and they have staff shower time. A 19 year old cadet has to shower with a 14 year old staff member. If for some reason the 14 year old says 19 year old looked at him the wrong way, and there goes the 19 year old's life. CAP won't cover that cadet for anything, since they already had CPPT. When it comes to something like this. The reality of it is guilty until proven innocent.
Logged
CAP is what you make of it. If you don't put anything in to it, you won't get anything out of it.
Eaker #2250
C/Lt Col, Ret.
The cookies and donuts were a lie.
a2capt
300,000th Post Author
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 5,089
Unit: pǝʇɹǝʌuı

« Reply #86 on: December 17, 2012, 05:28:54 PM »

Since 18 is legal age in the US, it becomes sort of a "limbo" for those cadets. CPPT applies to them, but then they are told to share bunks, and shower time with the rest of cadets.

It puts them in a weird position.
I share bucks with cadets pretty often .. and I'm many years from having been near the age that could have been a cadet.

I suspect you meant .. bunks.

But yes, that is an interesting point. Though I'd have to bet that 18+ year olds sleeping adjacent to a 12 year old is pretty rare to hardly occurring in the program. By that age they're cadet staff, and of course there is the rare 18 year old basic at encampment. They're probably going to keep to themselves just to get it the heck over the week.  Though they are Cadet Members, and not Senior Members. There is a separation. Muddle it, and your going to have problems.
Logged
Eclipse
Too Much Free Time Award

Posts: 29,527

« Reply #87 on: December 17, 2012, 05:49:30 PM »

Cool Mace, That's a pretty big leap.
Logged


Cool Mace
Seasoned Member

Posts: 351

« Reply #88 on: December 17, 2012, 05:51:16 PM »

Cool Mace, That's a pretty big leap.

Yes and no.

The situation for this has happened before. Thankfully nothing like that accusation did happen though.
Logged
CAP is what you make of it. If you don't put anything in to it, you won't get anything out of it.
Eaker #2250
C/Lt Col, Ret.
The cookies and donuts were a lie.
Майор Хаткевич
200,000th Post Author
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 6,062
Unit: GLR-IL-049

« Reply #89 on: December 17, 2012, 08:02:09 PM »

IIRC at Spring Encampment we had 18+ year olds shower after underage cadets.
Logged
Cool Mace
Seasoned Member

Posts: 351

« Reply #90 on: December 17, 2012, 08:04:22 PM »

Time isn't always on your side at encampment, regrettably.
Logged
CAP is what you make of it. If you don't put anything in to it, you won't get anything out of it.
Eaker #2250
C/Lt Col, Ret.
The cookies and donuts were a lie.
Майор Хаткевич
200,000th Post Author
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 6,062
Unit: GLR-IL-049

« Reply #91 on: December 17, 2012, 08:10:53 PM »

We managed this at a weekend encampment. I'm sure a week long summer event can find the time to group showers by age.
Logged
Cool Mace
Seasoned Member

Posts: 351

« Reply #92 on: December 17, 2012, 08:14:56 PM »

We did are best, don't get me wrong.

But after the basics students lights out, there's only so much time for staff cadre to get through. Along with last minute tasks they have to take care of.
Logged
CAP is what you make of it. If you don't put anything in to it, you won't get anything out of it.
Eaker #2250
C/Lt Col, Ret.
The cookies and donuts were a lie.
Pylon
Administrator

Posts: 5,136
Unit: NER-NH-038

Michael Kieloch, Marketing Communications & PR Leadership
« Reply #93 on: December 17, 2012, 08:34:20 PM »

We did are best, don't get me wrong.

But after the basics students lights out, there's only so much time for staff cadre to get through. Along with last minute tasks they have to take care of.

Why wait until cadet basic lights-out for the staff to do everything they need to get done?  That's why a flight has a flight commander and a flight sergeant and a TAC officer.  The flight sergeant can go shower and ready-up for the night while the flight commander helps supervise cadet basic free-time (or whatever late evening session you have scheduled after hygiene) and then switch off when the other cadet staff has showered.  It shouldn't take a cadet staff member more than 15 min to hygiene.  Both cadet staff could shower and hygiene in just 30-40 minutes, while the flight is doing evening-time stuff.  Heck, even the TAC could temporarily relieve both cadet staff if the flight was in some sort of "evening free time."
Logged
Michael F. Kieloch, Maj, CAP
Concord Composite Squadron, NH       
a2capt
300,000th Post Author
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 5,089
Unit: pǝʇɹǝʌuı

« Reply #94 on: December 17, 2012, 08:46:08 PM »

A fringe benefit when with Encampment on Oahu, it's held in 4 man rooms, that's the facility that can be gotten, that's where it's held. This avoids a lot of the funny business with showers because they each have a one per four, or two if TACs, and other staff vary. But it's all separated that way.  Open bay sure helps the situation, but it's becoming a rarity.
Logged
Eclipse
Too Much Free Time Award

Posts: 29,527

« Reply #95 on: December 17, 2012, 09:03:19 PM »

A fringe benefit when with Encampment on Oahu...

...is that it's on Oahu!

Back to the drift, my experience, especially with CAP activities, has been that time management and good planning
are usually in inverse proportion to the actual amount of time available.

Anyone saying you can't accomplish in 7-10 full days what other activities can do in 5 needs to buy a watch, a calendar, and
a notebook.  Any activity that goes a full week has more "flight time" in one day then a weekend encampment gets in
the entire event, not to mention 1/2 the in/out processing overhead, plus most week+ activities have at least
one full day of prep time before cadets start showing up.
Logged


NC Hokie
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 921
Unit: MER-NC-057

« Reply #96 on: December 18, 2012, 05:56:48 PM »

I'd prefer to have new converts barred from CP staff appointments and other major interaction with cadets for a calendar year -
have them spend the time becoming senior members and then, if they are still interested, they can be considered for
staff appointments and other participation with cadets.  For starters it would keep those whose progression has stalled
but still want to be "in charge" from taking that route - it might also help encourage cadets to stay in the program.

You should write that up and send it up the chain.
Logged
NC Hokie, Lt Col, CAP

Graduated Squadron Commander
All Around Good Guy
commando1
Forum Regular

Posts: 129

« Reply #97 on: December 18, 2012, 07:15:32 PM »

I'm an 18 year old Flight Officer that was a C/2dLT in the cadet program. I decided to go senior because I was in college at the time and am now waiting to ship out to Marine Corps basic training. I love the cadet program and still devote a decent amount of time to its needs. I feel as a SM I can more effectively get things done, I have the credibility of my years of experience in CP and the age needed to be reliable.  YMMV   
Logged
Non Timebo Mala
Pages: 1 ... 3 4 [5]  All Print 
CAP Talk  |  General Discussion  |  Membership  |  Topic: Why are Cadet Crossover Members so Rare?
 


Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP SMF 2.0.14 | SMF © 2017, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!
Page created in 0.058 seconds with 25 queries.