Air Force Outstanding Unit Award

[AirDX]

I'm a USAF civilian employee, and my unit just got awarded an Air Force Outstanding Unit Award.  Can I wear it with my CAP ribbons?  I think I know the answer, but I just thought I'd throw it out.  I rarely (like never) wear ribbons anyway.

[lordmonar]

Good question....depends on you you interpret 39-1.

[Stonewall]

PERSONALLY I say yes.  But that's my opinion because I feel that you are a part of the total force and contributed to the award.  You support the war fighter!  Good on you!

From experience, I knew someone in CAP who was in the same boat and wore her unit award (JMUC, I think).  She never served in the military, but wore the ribbon (with frame) on top of her CAP ribbons.  She ended up being wing commander and still did it.  No one seemed to care at any level, even NHQ.

[Eclipse]

Is it listed in 39-1?
Is it approved for wear on the USAF uniform?

If not then you're supposes to call NHQ.

[The CyBorg is destroyed]

If you have it in writing that you can wear the ribbon, I see no reason why you shouldn't, but of course only on the AF-type uniform.

When I was a CG Auxiliarist, the COMDT awarded the Coast Guard Outstanding Unit Award with "O" (Operational) device to the entire Auxiliary, and I can wear that on my uniform.



The jury is out on whether I can wear Auxiliary ribbons, though...I've seen dual-status CAP/CGAUX who do, and others who don't.

[RiverAux]

Actually we have two conflicting regulations on whether military awards earned as a civilian can be worn on the uniform.  IIRC, 39-1 is the one that says that they can be worn and since it is supposedly the only reg that matters in regards to uniform wear, I believe it to be document.  Of course, the reg relating to awards says that you couldn't in this situation. 

In reality, since there is some ambiguity, I'd wear it (assuming I have something in writing that individually identifies me as someone that has earned this award). 

[Garibaldi]

Actually we have two conflicting regulations on whether military awards earned as a civilian can be worn on the uniform.  IIRC, 39-1 is the one that says that they can be worn and since it is supposedly the only reg that matters in regards to uniform wear, I believe it to be document.  Of course, the reg relating to awards says that you couldn't in this situation. 

In reality, since there is some ambiguity, I'd wear it (assuming I have something in writing that individually identifies me as someone that has earned this award).

Personally, I'd wear it until someone told me I couldn't. Put a copy of the award in your file for reference.

[lordmonar]

b. Decorations, ribbons, and badges authorized for wear on the U.S. Air Force uniform may be worn on the CAP AF-style uniform when earned through qualification and awarded by competent authority to a member for service performed in any branch of the Armed Forces of the United States or its allies as outlined in CAPM 39-1.

5-4. Military Service Awards. Military service ribbons may be worn on the CAP AF-style uniform
provided they were awarded in writing by competent military authority. Awards of the Air Force,
Army, Navy, Marine Corps, or Coast Guard will be worn in the order prescribed by the awarding
service, subject to the following: In all cases of relative priority, Air Force awards will take precedence.
See Table 5-3. Awards for wars, campaigns, expeditions etc., will be worn in chronological sequence.
a. Three JROTC/ROTC ribbons awarded by military departments may be worn following all other
ribbons (except foreign ribbons) while the member concerned is participating in the JROTC/ROTC
program. When the member is no longer participating in the JROTC/ROTC program, JROTC/ROTC
ribbons will be removed.
b. Foreign decorations are so many and so varied, the number and combinations that may be worn
will not be prescribed; however, good taste and judgment should prevail. Only those decorations that
have been duly approved by Congress for acceptance and wear by the individual may be worn.

39-3 suggests that you must be a member of the military to wear the military ribbons....but references to 39-1 which only states that they are awarded in writing.

Now...the USAF does not do PA or anything like that to justify individuals are authorised to wear specific unit awards.  If you got a good Orderly Room they will take care of all the current members of the unit.....but all the old members have to go to their local MPF with some sort of proof that they were members of the unit during the effective period.  This is usually in the form of orders or some such.

In your case....a letter from your military unit commander stateing that you were assigned to the unit the unit as a civilain during the effective dates and a copy of the unit citation order.....in my book would be plenty of justification.

[AirDX]

In your case....a letter from your military unit commander stateing that you were assigned to the unit the unit as a civilain during the effective dates and a copy of the unit citation order.....in my book would be plenty of justification.

I won't need that, we've been told to report to our "servicing Civilian Personnel Section to have the award documented in the Defense Civilian Personnel Data System, and receive the appropriate lapel pin."  Which means I'll have it in writing with my name on it.  That and the citation in my file and I should be good to go.

[lordmonar]

In your case....a letter from your military unit commander stateing that you were assigned to the unit the unit as a civilain during the effective dates and a copy of the unit citation order.....in my book would be plenty of justification.

I won't need that, we've been told to report to our "servicing Civilian Personnel Section to have the award documented in the Defense Civilian Personnel Data System, and receive the appropriate lapel pin."  Which means I'll have it in writing with my name on it.  That and the citation in my file and I should be good to go.

By my read of the regulations....yes.

[Hawk200]

From Civil Air Patrol regulation 39-3, page 4, para 3 b. : "Decorations, ribbons, and badges authorized for wear on the U.S. Air Force uniform may be worn on the CAP AF-style uniform when earned through qualification and awarded by competent authority to a member for service performed in any branch of the Armed Forces of the United States or its allies as outlined in CAPM 39-1.

Officially, by strictest reading of the reg, I'd have to say "No" on it being authorized.

On a personal level, I think the pub needs changing. I base this on how many civilians I saw in Iraq wearing ACU's and body armor, chewing the same sand, sweating from the same heat I did. I personally think that anyone that wears the uniform (whether military or civilian) and earns any kind of decoration from the DOD should be permitted to wear it on the CAP uniform. They earned it.

39-1 and 39-3 aren't even letter to letter on things. The table in 39-1 says "Military service ribbons may be worn on the CAP AF-style uniform provided they were awarded in writing by competent military authority." 39-3 even contradicts itself in the sentence quoted above, as there are decorations that are authorized for wear on an Air Force uniform, but in keeping in the letter of 39-3 would not be authorized on a CAP uniform. (I'm referencing the part of "...to a member for service performed in any branch of the Armed Forces of the United States or its allies..." Check 36-2903 to find the decs I'm referring to.) This, I have problem with.

Whether military ID or not, if the government awards it, I don't see why it shouldn't be authorized. Many of those civilian decs have a standard military size ribbon/medal/mini medal. My only stipulation is that you have some kind of proof that you're entitled to it. (In other words, "Paperwork, or it didn't happen.") I don't think that's too much to ask. (As to the OP, the documentation mentioned would be more than enough.)

PM with any questions. There are some answers I can't officially give on a public board.

[RiverAux]

Since 39-1 is the dominant regulation (it claims it is) in regards to what may be worn on the uniform, it is my contention that it supercedes what is in 39-3.  The statement in 39-3 needs to be removed since it actually doesn't have anything to do with CAP awards (which is what that reg is about). 

[Garibaldi]

Since 39-1 is the dominant regulation (it claims it is) in regards to what may be worn on the uniform, it is my contention that it supercedes what is in 39-3.  The statement in 39-3 needs to be removed since it actually doesn't have anything to do with CAP awards (which is what that reg is about).

39-1 is a manual. 39-3 is a reg. We now return you to your regularly scheduled non-pedantic debate.

Wow...no wonder no one wants to talk to me, since I keep correcting them!

[Flying Pig]

I believe there was a civilian OSI special agent who was awarded the BSM w/V device.  So why not.  I would.  It would look odd because its your only mil ribbon. 

[AirDX]

It's actually not - I could wear an NDSM and the ASR from long ago.

[RiverAux]

39-1 is a manual. 39-3 is a reg. We now return you to your regularly scheduled non-pedantic debate.

Great, I can wear whatever I want since it is a manual.  Thanks for pointing that out. 

The distinction between manual and regulation is meaningless in CAP. 

[flyboy53]

I'm a USAF civilian employee, and my unit just got awarded an Air Force Outstanding Unit Award.  Can I wear it with my CAP ribbons?  I think I know the answer, but I just thought I'd throw it out.  I rarely (like never) wear ribbons anyway.

The answer is yes and don't let these guys tell you, you can't. The governing regulation is AFI 36-2803. It is an Air Force Award presented for Air Force service even though your are a DAFC. It is a unit award equal to an individual award of the Legion of Merit.

Make sure that a copy of the document that goes in your DAFC personnel file is also provided for your CAP files for verification...or you can go as far as getting a letter from the AF unit commander to verify entitlement of the AFOUA for you CAP files.

Remember, however, that you can't wear it with the aviator shirt uniform.

It works both ways. My wife was a CAP officer twice formally attached to an Air Force Reserve unit. Not only did she receive/earn the priviledge of wearing the AFOUA (earned during her period of service with that wing), that unit commander, a brigadier general, also signed her nomination for the CAP Commander's Commendation Award.

[lordmonar]

39-1 is a manual. 39-3 is a reg. We now return you to your regularly scheduled non-pedantic debate.

Great, I can wear whatever I want since it is a manual.  Thanks for pointing that out. 

The distinction between manual and regulation is meaningless in CAP.

That was not his point.  He was not saying we could do what we want and ignore instructions from on high......just pointing out that it is a manual not a reg.

[Garibaldi]

39-1 is a manual. 39-3 is a reg. We now return you to your regularly scheduled non-pedantic debate.

Great, I can wear whatever I want since it is a manual.  Thanks for pointing that out. 

The distinction between manual and regulation is meaningless in CAP.

That was not his point.  He was not saying we could do what we want and ignore instructions from on high......just pointing out that it is a manual not a reg.

Just me being me...being pedantic and nit-picky. One of my bad habits, and I do have many.

[Private Investigator]

I believe there was a civilian OSI special agent who was awarded the BSM w/V device.  So why not.  I would.  It would look odd because its your only mil ribbon.

I know a Vietnamese man who has a BSM w/V and a PUC. I am sure he has a lot of others but those are his only US awards. I know a policeman who has a SS and a BSM w/V and most people do not ask, "you got anything else?"