Flying Cheap

[DG]

Thursday 9 February 2010 10:00PM.

Frontline just aired their documentary on the regional airline pilots.

"Flying Cheap."

The entire program is available for viewing on PBS.org.

Do yourself a Big favor and watch it, and Recommend it to your friends and family.

[heliodoc]

Yep

Watching it right now

The word "flying cheaper" sure reminds me of another outfit

Knew this stuff 15 yrs ago while I was MXing helos..this stuff is really not new

Just a rehash of management not meeting training standards and would any of management sleep in a crash pad with 10 other pilots?? 

Probably not... Lot of those management issues, eh?

Corporate culture now being mentioned....something like CAP with its newer upstart safety program in the last year...should have been the LAST 68 years

Can these training issues be related in the way CAP run  the G1000 is ran as a program in general through out this organization? 

It's ALL in the "management" of a program whether one is flying CAP or 121 operations...but 121 operators are not falling all over themselves this week over 70 and 80 year old aviators....they got bigger fish to fry!!!

[heliodoc]

Hey  I got an idea for CAP

Since we can do "stuff" more cheaply than others in SAR and whatnot.  We could do some mooooore stuff cheaply like

How about we contract out to Colgan, Pinnnacle, etc for all the ground instruction..

Just think of it....CAP could be teaching ground instruction, maybe some Sim training for those CAPers who could donate their skills to the cause in at least maintaining some semblance of currency to alll the pilots that are currently laid off...  helping the ailing regional and major airlines out.  How about it CAP?

JUST THINK OF IT!!!  Contributing at least some single engine time to ALLL laid off pilots to maintain some kind of currency.

ISN"T that what we are all about...helping our aviation brothers out!  Come on CAP!  A NEW Mission...

Doing something 'cuz CAP can do it cheaper than lets say UND, Embry Riddle, you know the deal!!

YAAAAAAY!!

[DG]

Hey  I got an idea for CAP

Since we can do "stuff" more cheaply than others in SAR and whatnot.  We could do some mooooore stuff cheaply like

How about we contract out to Colgan, Pinnnacle, etc for all the ground instruction..

Just think of it....CAP could be teaching ground instruction, maybe some Sim training for those CAPers who could donate their skills to the cause in at least maintaining some semblance of currency to alll the pilots that are currently laid off...  helping the ailing regional and major airlines out.  How about it CAP?

JUST THINK OF IT!!!  Contributing at least some single engine time to ALLL laid off pilots to maintain some kind of currency.

ISN"T that what we are all about...helping our aviation brothers out!  Come on CAP!  A NEW Mission...

Doing something 'cuz CAP can do it cheaper than lets say UND, Embry Riddle, you know the deal!!

YAAAAAAY!!

Brilliant thinking!

[DG]

Here's a snippet a friend sent to me.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cL3QV5XK4g8

[DG]

In this morning's paper (Associated Press), NTSB Chairwoman Debbie Herzman is criticizing FAA Chief Randy Babbit

for pushing for only 750 hours to be required instead of the previously agreed to increase from 250 (current) to 1500 hours (proposed) to be a pilot or first officer on a FAR Part 121 airline flight.

She says the airlines and the flight schools are behind it.

She says the regional airlines have lobbied Babbit to reduce the number from 1500 to 750 so that they can hire pilots with less experience like the ones they hire with only 250 hours who will work for cheap.

The FAR Part 141 flight schools want to continue to attract and charge the new student pilots a lot of money and tell them they can fly for an airline with only 250 hours.

[flyguy06]

I dont know how many pilots or airline pilots aspirants visit CapTalk, butthis has been a discussion in the airline pilot world for months. Most of us are against the idea of raising the requirements to 1500. Non pilots seem to think skill has to do with hours and it doesnt.

A guy could have 2000 hours of flying straigh and level in VFR conditions. That doent make hm a better pilot that the 500 hour pilot that flies in hard IMC down to minimums every night.

Skill has to do with experience. Think about the 25o hour brandnew USAF 2nd Lt. He gets a lot of experience flying high performance aircraft in all kinds of configurations. The 1200 hour CFI that flies C-172's doent have anything on him.Heck the 1200 hour CFI doesnt even fly, we watch the guy in the left seat fly and critique him.

The ay inthe airline industry stinks and many pilots are disgruntled about it. $23K for entry level pilot. thats crazy. If they do pass the law where you have to have 1500 hours what 1500 hour pilot is going to take a job that pays $23K? he is going to go fly corporate or fractionals. The airlines need to step up and pay pilots what they are worth.

[Thrashed]

The fact is the airlines were hiring 500 hour pilots with NO experience in anything.  I was an airline check airman when this was happening, so I know first hand.  Pilots hired with less than 500 total and 50 multi. Never been in the clouds. Never been over 18K. Never shot an approach to or near mins.  They did these with me on IOE.  It's supply and demand.  It's also about money.  If the airlines can pay less, they can make more.

[flyguy06]

A check Airman doesn't need to be a flight instructor. The new FO needs to come to the table with some skills. However they can't know evetrything. Thats the whole purpose of IOE. so I agreee with you.

[Thrashed]

I was doing basic flight instruction.  Crosswind, flying an ILS, how to talk on a radio, etc. Good thing I was a CFI. 

[CASH172]

Something that the flight department chair of my school said, showed me how others think, "Why can't your college just change your curriculum from 140 to 1500 hrs?"  Apparently, that was what a congressional staffer asked. 

People can discuss it here and at pilot forums all they want, but the reality is that those who make this stuff law need to be exposed to what these numbers really mean. 

[flyguy06]

Something that the flight department chair of my school said, showed me how others think, "Why can't your college just change your curriculum from 140 to 1500 hrs?"  Apparently, that was what a congressional staffer asked. 

People can discuss it here and at pilot forums all they want, but the reality is that those who make this stuff law need to be exposed to what these numbers really mean.

Very True

[brasda91]

My AE guy is looking at a FAA certified simulator.  Working some grants now.  I'll post some pics when we take possesion.  He said to run it, it costs about $1.00/hr.

[SARDOC]

My AE guy is looking at a FAA certified simulator.  Working some grants now.  I'll post some pics when we take possesion.  He said to run it, it costs about $1.00/hr.

That's awesome...way to go

[PhotogPilot]

Something that the flight department chair of my school said, showed me how others think, "Why can't your college just change your curriculum from 140 to 1500 hrs?"  Apparently, that was what a congressional staffer asked. 

People can discuss it here and at pilot forums all they want, but the reality is that those who make this stuff law need to be exposed to what these numbers really mean.

Must have been a staffer of Rep Hank Johnson:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zNZczIgVXjg&feature=related