Airborne Law Enforcement Assoc. article-CAP

Flying Pig · June 02, 2009, 01:29:12 AM

In this months issue of the Air Beat Magazine, which is the Airborne Law Enforcement Associations magazine, they featured CAP when they were discussing considering the Airvan for units that might be looking for new aircraft on the market. Not really an article on CAP, but good coverage on our mission as a by product. This is an international magazine and sits on the desk of police chiefs and Sheriffs across the country. Who knows what may come of it.

Flying Pig · June 02, 2009, 01:29:55 AM

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wingnut55 · June 02, 2009, 09:57:19 AM

Remarkably Inexpensive. (same price as a 206)

Exceedingly Slow ( 172 speed with a 206 engine)

Needlessly Uncomfortable ( 3 hour Airvan ASS)

Fly's Great with 8 Aborigines' (3-4 Fat American Guys)

Guy's over 6 feet BEWARE

[admin: stop with the large fonts! if you can't see, wear glasses or adjust your monitor resolution]

AlphaSigOU · June 02, 2009, 12:33:00 PM

Quote from: wingnut55 on June 02, 2009, 09:57:19 AM
Remarkably Inexpensive. (same price as a 206)

Exceedingly Slow ( 172 speed with a 206 engine)

Needlessly Uncomfortable ( 3 hour Airvan ASS)

Fly's Great with 8 Aborigines' (3-4 Fat American Guys)
Guy's over 6 feet BEWARE

All true statements, except that should be 1-hour rather than 3-hour [butt]. MEL on N614CP is an additional seat cushion under each seat to reduce 'Airvan [butt]'!

Flying Pig · June 02, 2009, 01:56:00 PM

So CAP made a bad choice? Ive never even seen one up close. Well, except for that time on the Fossett search where it came right across my grid without any radio calls.

AlphaSigOU · June 02, 2009, 02:31:26 PM

Quote from: Flying Pig on June 02, 2009, 01:56:00 PM
So CAP made a bad choice? Ive never even seen one up close. Well, except for that time on the Fossett search where it came right across my grid without any radio calls.

I don't think so. It's not a bad airplane, but those who are accustomed to the more comfortable seats in a Cessna 172/182 are not going to like the GA-8 seats. Short of reupholstering them (ain't never gonna happen!) it doesn't take very long before one's posterior becomes numb. For ARCHER, it's a relatively stable platform. No autopilot, and no rudder trim - you'll get one of your legs a workout applying opposite rudder to compensate for engine torque.

ARCHER can be a temperamental beast at times but when it works it works like a champ. Our Airvan (N614CP) has the most hours in the fleet, and it gets plenty of workouts within Texas Wing.

Flying Pig · June 02, 2009, 05:46:02 PM

No Auto Pilot and no Rudder Trim?

Auto Pilot isnt to bad, but NO RUDDER TRIM?

I was looking at this for purchase by my law enforcement agency, however, theres no way I am going to spend the next 20 yrs doing a 6 hrs a day on a surveillance orbit without a rudder trim. May sound like I am whining, but there it is.

AlphaSigOU · June 02, 2009, 06:41:48 PM

Quote from: Flying Pig on June 02, 2009, 05:46:02 PM
No Auto Pilot and no Rudder Trim? Auto Pilot isnt to bad, but NO RUDDER TRIM?

I was looking at this for purchase by my law enforcement agency, however, theres no way I am going to spend the next 20 yrs doing a 6 hrs a day on a surveillance orbit without a rudder trim. May sound like I am whining, but there it is.

Unless you can convince Gippsland to include them.

FW · June 02, 2009, 07:26:00 PM

During the NERSARCOMP, I had the privilige of flying as copilot in an Airvan for just over 2.5 hours. It was the most uncomfortable flying machine I've ever been in. It did fly well though but, I was so cramped, I'm still stiff after 2 weeks. And, what's with that GNS480?

WT · June 02, 2009, 07:36:54 PM

I agree totally about the Airvan. That's why it's the only aircraft in the CAP fleet in which I have not yet received a Form 5. And you should try flying in the back, it's even worse, if you can believe that!

Flying Pig · June 02, 2009, 09:28:22 PM

I have been told the pilot seat does not adjust. Is that the case? Sort of a one size fits all deal?

dbaran · June 02, 2009, 11:54:20 PM

The front seats doesn't go back much (if at all) because Gipps put a structural post right behind them. I'm over 6 feet tall and can't fit.

Thankfully, I'm an ARCHER operator so I get to sit in the back instead - you get two rows of seats removed in front of you so you've got plenty of legroom if you sit next to the door and lean across to the console.

wingnut55 · June 03, 2009, 02:30:33 AM

Oh well I see ARCHER butt is a fair name.

[admin: stop with the large fonts! if you can't see, wear glasses or adjust your monitor resolution]

This is for ADMIN: You guys are like old women, Guys have huge POMPASS decorations on EVERY one of their entrys yet you have the GAUL to give me grief OVER FONT!!.

Please try your thought police stuff someplace else.

[b]I WAS MAKING A STATEMENT[/b]

IF YOU DON'T WANT US TO MAKE OUR OWN FONTS why have it available?

??

SJFedor · June 03, 2009, 03:12:37 AM

It's an alright aircraft. I helped do some MS training up in INWg this past weekend and it's good for loading a bunch of people up and putting eyes outside, but for an extended period of time, it's not a lot of fun.

Me, I'm 6', 34" inseam, and I have the seat all the way back, and I'm probably about as tall as you can get without having your legs wrapped around your head.

That's correct, no rudder trim. Depending on the aircraft, some require more leg push then others to keep the ball centered in flight. The one I flew this past weekend (606CP) actually stayed a lot more centered then the one I normally fly (471CP).

They've also got a weird fuel system, where you can't select a tank, just on or off, and a lot of time it ends up feeding more from one tank then the other, causing a bit of a lateral imbalance and requiring more rudder. And because it's got that weird fuel system, you actually do the opposite of what you'd normally do to get the fuel to feed from the heavy tank.

One thing I do like about it, I think it's a pretty stable instrument platform. I've been in IMC with that aircraft for a total of probably 6-7 hours, and it's actually a very nice IMC bird, even without the autopilot.

Rob, I know CAWg has one, last I heard they kept it at Van Nuys. Go take a ride/fly out there and take a look, sit in it, and get a feel for it.

And yes, extra seat cushions are a must with this aircraft if you're gonna be in it for more than 1-2 hours.

PHall · June 03, 2009, 03:37:38 AM

Quote from: wingnut55 on June 03, 2009, 02:30:33 AM
[admin: stop with the large fonts! if you can't see, wear glasses or adjust your monitor resolution]

This is for ADMIN: You guys are like old women, Guys have huge POMPASS decorations on EVERY one of their entrys yet you have the GAUL to give me grief OVER FONT!!.

Please try your thought police stuff someplace else.

[b]I WAS MAKING A STATEMENT[/b]

IF YOU DON'T WANT US TO MAKE OUR OWN FONTS why have it available???

It's their playground. You don't like the rules. See Ya!

Flying Pig · June 03, 2009, 03:43:42 AM

Yeah, its at Wing HQ at Van Nuys. Its about a 5 hr drive. Maybe if my work travels take me that direction Ill set something up. Im maybe coming into some funding and would like a new platform in the future. A Caravan 675 would be my #1. After that, who knows. Maybe a Silver Eagle P210 or something like the Airvan. We'd like something that burns Jet A to drop our 100LL purchase off of the budget and have something we can haul butt in if VIPs need to get somewhere. I cant have it all, so Im trying to find a happy medium if I cant have the #1 choice. Maybe even using our current TC206H for a trade in. Its in plan for the future, not something anytime soon. The Lt. told me to do the research. So I want to be ready. If it comes to that, maybe I can arrange for CAP to fly the Airvan up to Fresno on the counties dime for a demo? Like I said.....waaaaaaaaay in the future. But its fun to talk about.

MikeD · June 03, 2009, 05:00:32 AM

Quote from: Flying Pig on June 03, 2009, 03:43:42 AM
Yeah, its at Wing HQ at Van Nuys. Its about a 5 hr drive. Maybe if my work travels take me that direction Ill set something up. Im maybe coming into some funding and would like a new platform in the future. A Caravan 675 would be my #1. After that, who knows. Maybe a Silver Eagle P210 or something like the Airvan. We'd like something that burns Jet A to drop our 100LL purchase off of the budget and have something we can haul butt in if VIPs need to get somewhere. I cant have it all, so Im trying to find a happy medium if I cant have the #1 choice. Maybe even using our current TC206H for a trade in. Its in plan for the future, not something anytime soon. The Lt. told me to do the research. So I want to be ready. If it comes to that, maybe I can arrange for CAP to fly the Airvan up to Fresno on the counties dime for a demo? Like I said.....waaaaaaaaay in the future. But its fun to talk about.

If you head down that way let me know, and I can try to get you into work on the way if you want. Getting you in a flight isn't going to happen

but it's definitely worth a side trip.

whatevah · June 03, 2009, 05:57:34 AM

Quote from: wingnut55 on June 03, 2009, 02:30:33 AM
Oh well I see ARCHER butt is a fair name.

[admin: stop with the large fonts! if you can't see, wear glasses or adjust your monitor resolution]

This is for ADMIN: You guys are like old women, Guys have huge POMPASS decorations on EVERY one of their entrys yet you have the GAUL to give me grief OVER FONT!!.

Please try your thought police stuff someplace else.

[b]I WAS MAKING A STATEMENT[/b]

IF YOU DON'T WANT US TO MAKE OUR OWN FONTS why have it available???

Wow....

You're banned for 3 days. Enjoy the time off.

bosshawk · June 03, 2009, 04:02:49 PM

Rob: the Airvan will be at the upcoming Overflight School, so you will have a chance to see it and, probably, fly it. I have seen enough of the monster to never want to see it again, but that's a personal opinion.

Flying Pig · June 03, 2009, 09:38:43 PM

Oh...outstanding. Youve seen my operation, what are your thoughts on that as a platform for what I do if I took the guts of my plane and bolted it to the Airvan?