GTM3 training

[notaNCO forever]

 I was just wondering how long everyone on CAP Talk thinks it should take to get the basic GT badge. I know you can get all the training done in one weekend bivouac, but how many training weekends do you all think it takes until someone is ready to go on a real GT mission. Obviously it varies from each person, but their must be an average length of time.

[Senior]

That is a very good question.  I thinks it all depends.  Don't you hate it when someone starts out a conversation that way? Seriously, though I would start with the age and/or maturity of of the members on the GT.  If you have young and small stature cadets I don't think they can handle hard work in the field without incurring injuries.  I can't imagine a 13 year old that weighs 90 lbs carrying heavy loads over uneven terrain for very long.  One, they realize this is hard work and it is easier to stay home and play XBox.  Two, they don't have the experience to know how their bodies will respond to soreness, fatigue, sleep deprivation while trying to pay attention on a real mission.  Do they have the ability to learn, retain and apply all the information they are learning in a timely manner?I would also focus on the training.  Do you as the GTL have experience from past missions, prior military service or the Scouts on how to teach, motivate, and supervise a GT or a group?  Did you read the task straight from the manual(anybody can do that), or can you share your experience to really teach and educate the members?Finally, achieving the GTM status is just the start of being proficient and useful in a real mission.  I am going to throw several practice missions at the cadets after they receive the GT Badge to start bonding them as a team.  Also throw in (safe) scenarios, that would never really happen, but gets them thinking beyond finding the practice ELT.  I would start with a simple practice mission with little or no surprises. Evaluate the performce of the team and individuals.  Attempt a second mission focusing on the weaknesses from the first mission.  Use a crawl, walk, run training mentality.  Success will motivate them to keep trying when more and more surprises come up. Some safe scenarios  1.  The van "breaks" down and you have to walk a distance to the "target"2.  A member "twist an ankle" you have to carry him in an improvised      manner3.  A member can't carry his load anymore, you have to help him and carry   his gear.4.  The GPS unit breaks so you have to use the compass.   5.  Strap an  8' 2x4 to a ammo can or card board box.  They have to carry it without touching the 2x4 or box also you can't take the 2x4 off the box.6.  Put the ranking cadet in charge (the GTL is their of course) that will put some stress on them with a real leadership situation.7.  Put some other cadet in charge.8.  Pull  a cadet out and make them "unaccounted for" or "lost then ask      the team why they weren't keeping an eye on each other.  This works        well when a cadet is in charge. It helps them to think about the team      and develops Situational AwarenessI hope this helps

[Eclipse]

Senior - you might want to at least try to imagine a scenario where not all GT's are cadets.

From a training standpoint, the above is fine, I suppose, but in most cases above the team would simply be recalled to base and anyone injured picked up by a vehicle.

As to the length of time it takes for the training - there's two pieces, training and tasking.  They should not be done at the same time, or by the same person (when practical).

I don't see how anyone could go into 1 weekend as a slick-sleeve with nothing signed off and no skills and come out on Sunday as a GT3.  Even trying to do it in a week (i.e. NESA) is pushing it.

Its much more likely that you're looking at a 6+ month process depending on the engagement level of those being trained, however they can become operational in less than that time by completing the fam/prep expediently.

What generally delays these things is getting mission credit, which can be managed by running self funded missions and/or leveraging your monthly aircraft B-Missions by getting yourself involved in the air-to-ground coordination sorties that an aircrew is running.

[notaNCO forever]

 Thanks for the input some of the stuff I already do for training there is a few new things to me on there that I will have to try. Have one of the members on the "team" get lost is one of my favorite things to do; I notice after you do that the GTL in training always pays more attention to the GT members. Having to carry another members gear for them is something I'm going to try out for sure. Unfortunately most of the people I will be training are still young, but I figure if they start learning now in a few years they will be top notch and ready to go.

[Eclipse]

A lot of the tasks can be done on meeting nights, and/or cross-task other qualifications, especially UDF.

My route is generally to get the newbs UDF fam/prepped first - with some mapping gear and a phone tree signed off they can then start going out on missions.

With that ability, getting both experience for the other stuff as well as sign-offs becomes a lot easier, and they are truly "operational assets".

[Duke Dillio]

Depends on age and experience level.  People who have lots of time in the woods who can learn how to operate a DF unit fairly quickly take less time than someone who's never stepped out of the house before.  I have also seen different opinions on when the GT badge is actually awarded.  For example, I met some people in a different wing who felt that the badge should not be awarded until the member had achieved the level of GTM-1.  I'm not saying that this is right or wrong, just something that I have observed.

Maturity level plays a huge role in whether or not the person is ready for a real mission.  I have had cadets in the past, and some seniors as well, who I didn't feel were serious enough for a real mission even though they were qualified.  I didn't stop them from going but I did take the time to explain the seriousness of the mission prior to departure and they did all right.

My personal opinion, not that anyone really wants it, is that there should be no time table to determine qualifications.  Putting a time requirement to any of these tasks simply creates more shortages of people for several different reasons.  For one, people will quit rather than wait for such a qualification.  The time requirement does not allow flexibility for putting teams together in cases where you have over-qualified people (such as members of the local law enforcement SAR team, NASAR qualified personnel, etc.)  The choice in qualification should come from a determination of whether the person can successfully work with the team and do their job versus a specific amount of time in training.  Consider that there are people who go to NESA with a 101T and leave as a GTM-1 and it is only a week long...

[Eclipse]

I have also seen different opinions on when the GT badge is actually awarded.  For example, I met some people in a different wing who felt that the badge should not be awarded until the member had achieved the level of GTM-1.  I'm not saying that this is right or wrong, just something that I have observed.

Let me help - that's wrong, at least in as much as the program specifies.  I'd be willing to be that these are Ye Olde Schoolers who resent the (not so) recent change to the award criteria.

I wasn't excited about the way they split things up either, but this idea that people just make up their own rules, "because".

[Phil Hirons, Jr.]

A lot of the tasks can be done on meeting nights, and/or cross-task other qualifications, especially UDF.

My route is generally to get the newbs UDF fam/prepped first - with some mapping gear and a phone tree signed off they can then start going out on missions.

With that ability, getting both experience for the other stuff as well as sign-offs becomes a lot easier, and they are truly "operational assets".

+ 100

I know what we need in RIWG right now is UDFs. We get a LOT more ELT/EPIRB (Ocean State  ) missions than missing people or AC

[RiverAux]

Depending on how many people you're trying to train and the number of support staff you've got helping you do it, I think 2 field weekends would be sufficient for GTM3 ASSUMING you've got a fairly good training plan that you stick to. 

Now, if you're just waiting around for SAREX's or actual missions to happen, it could easily take you 6 months to have the opportunity to get the training and to be tested on the field skills.  You should be able to knock out the Fam and Prep tasks on meeting nights. 

[MikeD]

Depending on how many people you're trying to train and the number of support staff you've got helping you do it, I think 2 field weekends would be sufficient for GTM3 ASSUMING you've got a fairly good training plan that you stick to. 

Now, if you're just waiting around for SAREX's or actual missions to happen, it could easily take you 6 months to have the opportunity to get the training and to be tested on the field skills.  You should be able to knock out the Fam and Prep tasks on meeting nights. 

2 field weekends?  Is 1 or 2 days on the weekend?  And is that assuming starting from scratch, or starting from having some sign-offs completed first?  I'm either missing or misunderstanding something here...

[isuhawkeye]

In my experience a person with no prior experience can complete GTM 3 requirements with about 30 contact hours of instruction.  This instruction is a mix of classroom, and field skills.  This also assumes that these individuals have already completed the self study ICS courses, and any required first aid training. 

Just my experience

[husker]

Consider that there are people who go to NESA with a 101T and leave as a GTM-1 and it is only a week long...

Not quite true.  The NESA GSAR Basic student will only qualify as a GTM3 in one week (this also assumes prior completion of GES and self study ICS).  That is almost 75 hours of instruction and field time, and that is really pushing it to get it done.  Not all students make it. 

NESA GSAR Advanced qualifies one as GTM2 and GTM1, but a student must be a rated GTM 3 first.

[RiverAux]

Depending on how many people you're trying to train and the number of support staff you've got helping you do it, I think 2 field weekends would be sufficient for GTM3 ASSUMING you've got a fairly good training plan that you stick to. 

Now, if you're just waiting around for SAREX's or actual missions to happen, it could easily take you 6 months to have the opportunity to get the training and to be tested on the field skills.  You should be able to knock out the Fam and Prep tasks on meeting nights. 

2 field weekends?  Is 1 or 2 days on the weekend?  And is that assuming starting from scratch, or starting from having some sign-offs completed first?  I'm either missing or misunderstanding something here...

4 full days.  But, if you only had a few people it could probably be done faster.  The bigger the group the harder it will be to test them on the field activities in a reasonable period of time.