COMM Related Critical Thinking Exercise

[KyCAP]

Now, before we burn down the house.


The scenario is...

The disaster event occurs, before Air Force Assigned missions are authorized (to support State EM and FEMA) the Wing Commander issues a C911 mission symbol and mission #.  CAP members are tasked through local MOU's to support Command Staff functions (Comm and Comm Unit Leaders for the purpose of our discussion).

They end up at the EOC and local EMA says.. We have three Amateur Radio Stations licenses to the EOC and an operator from ARES here.  We need two more bodies to man your Net Controls on these other communications nets.

Do you say, AYE AYE or do you say (Hrm?)

1)   If a licensed AMATEUR is available for the station to act as the operator during its use can a CAP member be tasked to act as a "supporting" operator to handle NON-CAP generated traffic (not welfare traffic either).
2)   If there were no ARES operator and the CAP MEMBER HOLDS the license and is tasked as part of the mission to handle NON-CAP traffic and act as the station operator can they do this?

[RADIOMAN015]

I don't think CAP would be expected in most instances to operate amateur radios at EOC's (but IF one is (amateur) licensed to operate on the appropriate I see no problem in running the radio for non CAP related mission support OR for that matter for CAP support IF CAP comm don't work).  Generally there's already a plan in most places with local RACES & ARES programs, to provide communications support.  This was evident earlier this year in Oregon, where the amateur radio community did a great "when all else fails" communications support.  CAP was not a player in this comm support.

I don't think CAP overall should be using amateur radio for its' primary comm support mission, HOWEVER, I also think that it's a good idea to encourage your ES types to get amateur radio licenses & buy relatively "inexpensive" radios for "backup" communication incase there's problems with our COMM system.  We allow our personnel to use cellphones during missions as a "tool" and amateur radio is also a "tool". 

RADIOMAN015     

[Eclipse]

I don't believe there is any issue with properly authorized CAP people operating any other radio equipment, the issue is non-CAP people operating ours, or programming CAP equipment to operate on non-CAP frequencies.

[lordmonar]

First.......

If it is NOT a CAP net...then it is NOT a CAP issue.  The net owner is resonsible for their own rules.

If the CAP net is the EOC's net based on the MOA...then only CAP users can use that net.

If the NET is on common ham freqs under ARES then you would fall uner ARES rules (i.e. must have an ham license or be under the direct supervision of a ham IIRC).

Second.....

If this is a real emergency situation then all rules are off.   If the net is being set up to saves lives...then both CAP and FCC rules go by the wayside.

[desertengineer1]

The new 100-1 should address this kind of issue (as posted on the DC list).

However, the voting choice of "neither" should be added.

It is dependant on what role you are under.  If you are CAP signed into the mission under an IC,  the station is operating under a amateur radio control station and (most importantly) you are NOT passing CAP related traffic, then it shouldn't be a problem because you are under part 97 and within 100-1.

However, if at any time the IC says no, then you are to cease.  You can sign out of the CAP mission, take the uniform off, and operate as a disastor volunteer under whomever at that point - just not CAP.

It get's a little complicated.  And as lordmonar said, it's highly dependant on what net and what traffic you are passing.

If it is a CAP net, using CAP radios, you are operating on AF Frequencies, and it must be CAP or CAP deemed/approved mission critical traffic - and only the qualified CAP member signed into the mission can accomplish this.

If it is not a CAP net (i.e. amateur radio) and CAP traffic will be passed, that is outlawed by 100-1.

If it is not a CAP net, and the traffic is not CAP, but normal mission information relating to the EOC, then it falls into the grey area, defined by our MOU with that organization, and whatever the IC says you can do.  I don't see much of a problem here, because you're most likely under part 97 control station rules. 

Yes, gray areas get us into trouble sometimes, but they also allow us to do great work with other agencies.  The IC needs to have SA over what all of the members are doing to make sure we stay away from trouble. 

[KyCAP]

All,

I have closed the poll. 

I have had in depth discussions with the comm leadership and I have rejected a DoD/FEMA training mission request to support ARES based on the current position of the leadership.

At NO TIME shall CAP mission radio operators operate on Amateur Frequencies in order to avoid the perception of encroachment of CAP into the Amateur Spectrum as outlined in CAPR 100-1 and the CAP / ARRL MOU.  This means that whether you are a HAM yourself or not and operating in the presence of a HAM not in CAP (as allowed by FCC) you as a CAP member are PROHIBITED.  Period.

Spread the word.

[RRLE]

I just read the MOA Between ARRL and CAP. One paragraph in there answered your question.

Recognitions

The parties to this memorandum recognize the following points about their mutual missions and relationship:

3. It is further recognized that persons acting as CAP members are required to operate on frequencies reserved for the federal government pursuant to a license granted by a federal agency. These frequencies are for official use only by CAP members and may not be disclosed to unauthorized personnel, i.e. Amateur Radio operators. CAP members have no special authority to operate on Amateur Radio frequencies by reason of their membership in CAP. Therefore, use of Amateur Radio while acting as a CAP member is inconsistent with Federal Communications Commission (FCC) Regulations, including 47 CFR §97.113(a)(3) and §97.113(a)(5) and the U.S. Government Table of Frequency Allocations contained in the NTIA Manual of Regulations and Procedures for Federal Radio Frequency Management (47 CFR 300). CAP regulations specify that Amateur Radio frequencies shall not be used to conduct the regular business of CAP.

But always remember this:

4. It is further recognized that licensed radio stations may make use of any means of radio communication available to provide essential communications to protect the immediate safety of human life and to provide the immediate protection of property when normal communication systems are not available. (See FCC Part 97, Subpart E and NTIA Manual Section 7).

[isuhawkeye]

That position is rather disappointing.  I'll have to keep it in mind

[desertengineer1]

I just read the MOA Between ARRL and CAP. One paragraph in there answered your question.

Recognitions

The parties to this memorandum recognize the following points about their mutual missions and relationship:

3. It is further recognized that persons acting as CAP members are required to operate on frequencies reserved for the federal government pursuant to a license granted by a federal agency. These frequencies are for official use only by CAP members and may not be disclosed to unauthorized personnel, i.e. Amateur Radio operators. CAP members have no special authority to operate on Amateur Radio frequencies by reason of their membership in CAP. Therefore, use of Amateur Radio while acting as a CAP member is inconsistent with Federal Communications Commission (FCC) Regulations, including 47 CFR §97.113(a)(3) and §97.113(a)(5) and the U.S. Government Table of Frequency Allocations contained in the NTIA Manual of Regulations and Procedures for Federal Radio Frequency Management (47 CFR 300). CAP regulations specify that Amateur Radio frequencies shall not be used to conduct the regular business of CAP.

But always remember this:

4. It is further recognized that licensed radio stations may make use of any means of radio communication available to provide essential communications to protect the immediate safety of human life and to provide the immediate protection of property when normal communication systems are not available. (See FCC Part 97, Subpart E and NTIA Manual Section 7).

This one made a lot of noise on the DC list.  I do not agree with the automatic assumption that any CAP member using an amateur radio is passing CAP traffic just because they are in uniform.  Only the act of doing CAP business/traffic is specifically outlawed by 100-1 and 97.  If a CAP member passes ham traffic (i.e. NON CAP) on a ham frequency as part of volunteer duties in an EOC, he/she is within the rules of part 97 under the control station privileges.

Some folks are doing a great job of taking yet another step to destroy the minute interoperability we have.  We worked really hard to get there these past 20 years, enduring severe scoldings by everyone level from the president to city council member levels. 

WHAT PART OF INTEROPERABILITY DO YOU PEOPLE NOT UNDERSTAND?