Bill Payment

[Eclipse]

^That can't be right, at least in regards to any effect Wing Banker would have on it - this report is for a year that predates the WBP, and as of today there are still units not fully implemented.

[BlackKnight]

^That can't be right, at least in regards to any effect Wing Banker would have on it - this report is for a year that predates the WBP, and as of today there are still units not fully implemented.

You might want to reverse your course on this one.  This is CAP's annual report to the US Congress, and Col Hodgkins was head of CAP-USAF.  It darn well BETTER be right.  Else the whole ball of yarn just came unravelled and you're saying CAP lied to the US Congress in their annual report. 

I don't for a second think CAP or CAP-USAF lied to Congress. The whole sales pitch for the WBP was that it was necessary so that CAP could achieve an unqualified audit status. I suspect he who shall not be named conveniently forgot to reveal to the NEC and NB that CAP had already told Congress in writing that they had achieved that status. The majority of the national board apparently liked the idea of getting direct control of all squadron funds, so they bought into the deal and didn't look under the hood or kick the tires.

[IceNine]

I don't claim to understand finances for a second, but I do know that when Gen Courter was at our wing/region conference she was very excited that for the first time in FY08 CAP as an organization could get an unqualified audit.

The post above yours says that NHQ received their first unqualified audit in '06 which IIRC is what the Gen was saying.

Anyone else at the GLR conference remember what the Gen said about this during the Sat lunch (just after the garbage bag demonstration)?

[BlackKnight]

The post above yours says that NHQ received their first unqualified audit in '06 which IIRC is what the Gen was saying.

Ice, Col Hodkgins used "CAP" twice in his statement regarding the unqualified audit.  Nowhere did he restrict his statement to apply only to an NHQ audit.  USAF Colonels generally don't make those kind of parsing mistakes. Certainly not in formal reports to Congress. 

Now, if the good Colonel did make a mistake of that magnitude, it would seem to be a simple matter to ammend the report to correct any misinterpretation - after all it is part of the public/Federal record, and such ammendments are not uncommon.  This is not a new issue, and the inconsistency between what is stated in the 2006 annual report compared to the information given to the NB by Gen Pineda and his staff (per NEC and NB published meeting minutes) as to why the WBP was so essential was identified to NHQ soon after the 2006 annual report was published. NHQ remained silent on the issue.

[FW]

Col. Hodgkin's statement was correct;  in that it was the first time CAP had an unqualified audit opinion.  HOWEVER, he was not referring to the whole of CAP.  
NHQ had it's first unqualified audit in '06.  The auditors could not fully account for the units below wing level.  This was a significant finding in  '06 and to a lesser extent in '07.  (The WBP started in FY '06 and expanded to all wings in '07.)  With the full implementation of the WBP, we have included almost $4 million dollars in previously unaccounted assets.  This represents a significant amount.  Now that the WBP is in full effect, CAP/FM is confident we will have a completely unqualified audit for all of CAP.

This is one issue I am intimately familiar with.  

[ADCAPer]

Col. Hodgkin's statement was correct;  in that it was the first time CAP had an unqualified audit opinion.  HOWEVER, he was not referring to the whole of CAP.  

Okay,  I'd like to know where in this report it says that this audit does not apply to the "whole of CAP"?

[FW]

The report to congress does not mention an unqualified audit; it only gives Col. Hodgkin's quote (I haven't seen the report in awhile so I may be mistaken).  
However, if it does, it is wrong.  CAP has NEVER had a fully unqualified audit to date.
I should know;  I've been dealing with this stuff since Aug. 05.  

Congress knows this, the BOG knows this, CAP-USAF knows this, the NEC/NB knows this and now you know this.  I don't know what else I can say.  These are plain facts.
No spin, no hype and, definitely, no unqualified audit.

[ADCAPer]

The report to congress does not mention an unqualified audit; it only gives Col. Hodgkin's quote (I haven't seen the report in awhile so I may be mistaken).  
However, if it does, it is wrong.  CAP has NEVER had a fully unqualified audit to date.
I should know;  I've been dealing with this stuff since Aug. 05.  

Congress knows this, the BOG knows this, CAP-USAF knows this, the NEC/NB knows this and now you know this.  I don't know what else I can say.  These are plain facts.
No spin, no hype and, definitely, no unqualified audit.

You are obviously mistaken.

This is a direct quote from a full page write-up by Col Hodgkins, wihich is on page 40 of the document that is posted on the National Civil Air Patrol web site, which is clearly identified as the "2006 Civil Air Patrol annual report to Congress". It is the only mention of the word "audit" in the entire document.

"Additionally, I am pleased to report CAP has continued to advance in fiscal accountability. For the first time since reorganization of Civil Air Patrol in 1995, outside auditors assessed an "unqualified" audit rating for CAP's annual financial statement in summer 2006.[/i][/font]"

Now, I'm not sure how you can tell me that "The report to congress does not mention an unqualified audit..." because it's right there in plain black and white. There are no disclaimers, no asterisks to comments, nothing.  So anyone who is interested can go to this site and can plainly see a signed statement by the Air Force Colonel who is plainly identified as the CAP-USAF Commander. Now, is he lying, or was he mislead?

You say there is no spin, and no hype, but I spent 20 years in the AF, and I can tell you exactly how many times I put my signature on something that might have been incorrect, or even worse misleading; and that number is exactly 0.   

[mikeylikey]

^ hmmm.....that makes me think they lied to Congress. 

[ADCAPer]

^ hmmm.....that makes me think they lied to Congress. 

Certainly appears that way. No AF officer I've ever known would attach their signature to a statement like that if they had any idea that it was wrong, or even if they though that it might be the least bit misleading.

Seems to me that if this was a legitimate mistake that there would be a corrected copy of the annual report submitted with a clarification, and that report, or the retraction of the mistake would be on the web page. Otherwise it just gives the appearance that our entire organizations financial program is a joke. Especially since it's 2008 and we're now trying to get the "unqualified" audit that the Air Force told Congress we got for the first time in 11 years in 2006.

[FW]

You're going to need to ask Col. Hodgkins about his statement in the report.  I'm not going to speak for him.  And, I never said his quote was not in the report. I said there is no official statement in the report stating an unqualified audit for CAP, Inc.  Take my comments as you like for they won't change the facts.

It is my responsibility, as CAP/NFO,  to insure the audit is done and to get the results.  I read the audits and understand the details.  I do this in conjunction with the Chief Financial Officer of CAP and the Executive Director, the report is forwarded to the BoG.  I speak with the auditors at least once each quarter and, at no time did anyone in CAP/FM make any claim of an unqualified audit nor did the CAP/CC, or CAP/EX.  No member of the National Finance Committee ever made such a statement, nor has any member of the BoG.  

I stand by my previous post.  I am not mistaken and we have not yet received an unqualified audit.  The Col's quote is a matter of record.  Your understanding of the quote is noted however, as someone who knows the facts, I don't read into it as you do.  

There isn't anything else I can add to this topic.  Any questions you have regarding the annual report to congress can be given to the CAP/EX.  That is the office responsible for its content.  

[mikeylikey]

^ But that's it Sir!  You know the facts, no one here does, nor do the readers of the report.  To every person not familiar with the CAP FM side, it appears we received an unqualified audit in 2006.

How we went from Bill Paying to this is puzzling. 

Back to bill paying......If a person not associated with CAP decides to pay our electric bill, all he or she needs to do is write the check.  If they want to use that as a tax deduction.....they need to write the check to the unit??  Or to Wing HQ?  Then do we need to fill out a "fundraiser request"??   

[Eclipse]

A unit CC may accept cash donations up to $4,999.99.

8. Donation or Bequest of Money. A Donation Receipt is completed when money is donated or bequeathed to CAP. A Donation Receipt must be executed for all donations of $250 or more where no goods or services are provided to the donor and all donations of $75 or more where goods or services are provided to the donor. See Attachment 1, which may be reproduced locally. It is important that it is completely filled out and a copy retained in the corporate officer's file accepting the donation. Funds received by donation or bequest must be accounted for as required by CAPR 173-1, Financial Procedures and Accounting Report for Units Below Wing Level, and CAPR 173-2, Financial Procedures for CAP Regions and Wings. Units below wing level receiving donations or bequests in excess of $5,000 must notify their wing financial officer and NHQ CAP/FM within 30 days of receipt of the donation or bequest.

In this case, if someone wants to pay a bill on our behalf, that is not a donation to the unit, they just paid a bill.  The only issue a higher HQ might raise is the continuity of the action and what the unit will do if it ceases.  That is a fiscal planning issue.

I still say for all concerned, the best course is a donation to the unit and have the unit write the check through WBP, but its certainly not required, and if its more hassle then its worth, just have the member pay the bill.

With all the above said, a higher HQ >could< direct this unit CC to do things anyway they see fit, as long as that directive itself doesn't violate a reg.  If Group or Wing would prefer this be made as a donation to the unit, so be it.  That is command authority, not a financial regulation issue.

Not every thing that is good practice for running a unit is in the regs - the only thing you will find there is the minimum required.  Just because its not required in a reg, doesn't mean it can't be required by a commander.

[FW]

^ But that's it Sir!  You know the facts, no one here does, nor do the readers of the report.  To every person not familiar with the CAP FM side, it appears we received an unqualified audit in 2006.

Mikey, that's why I enjoy contributing to CAP-TALK.  I have a somewhat different perspective on things.

^How we went from Bill Paying to this is puzzling.  

Back to bill paying......If a person not associated with CAP decides to pay our electric bill, all he or she needs to do is write the check.  If they want to use that as a tax deduction.....they need to write the check to the unit??  Or to Wing HQ?  Then do we need to fill out a "fundraiser request"??  

Eclipse is correct.  NO ONE in CAP should tell a member how to spend their own money.  We only deal with the cash deposited in CAP's name.  Then those dead presidents heads belong to us.