Wearing the flight suit to weekly meetings...

[CASH172]

Well the question I ask is what if a cadet that's working toward their private wears their flight suit just as much as most aircrews to non flight operations like meetings. 

[Jolt]

Well the question I ask is what if a cadet that's working toward their private wears their flight suit just as much as most aircrews to non flight operations like meetings. 

I'm very rarely seen in my flight suit.  I really do just wear it while flying and just after landing before a meeting (Just twice in about 5-6 months).  If cadets are wearing their flight suits to meetings on a regular basis, then they probably need a hug or something because they're desperate for attention.

[Stonewall]

Well the question I ask is what if a cadet that's working toward their private wears their flight suit just as much as most aircrews to non flight operations like meetings. 

Cadets, moreso than seniors, in fact, almost exclusively, should be in the uniform of the day.  I support the cadet working on his pilots license, but that's no excuse to wear a filght suit in lieu of the UOD.

[jimmydeanno]

Some squadrons in an effort to help build enthusiam about AE, allow their cadets with CAP approved aeronautical ratings and seniors with them to wear their flight suits during AE nights - it builds some discussion between the zoomers and non zoomers from what I've seen.

[mikeylikey]

it builds some discussion between the zoomers and non zoomers from what I've seen.

OR it builds some tension/distraction/competition between zoomers and non zoomers. 

[jimmydeanno]

^ competition

not always a bad thing (good compeition, team environment) - many times what keeps cadets progressing.  Heaven forbid if we get members trying to increase their qualifications, wouldn't that be horrible? 

[Sgt. Savage]

I guess it never dawned on me to ask but...

What's the big deal? Again, if we aren't "Uniformed" to begin with, why not wear a flight suit?

[culpies]

The uniform, just like a football or baseball uniform helps to instill that sense of team in those wearing it. It's just one piece of the pie, but a piece none the less.  While it's true that you are better off having people in some uniform that no uniform, but if they have the UOD then they should be in it.  Make your acceptable substitute for the OUD a full set of dress blues and I doubt many people will not wear the UOD. 

[Dragoon]

I'm a big fan of "uniform of the day."  Made lots of posts elsewhere on getting folks to feel like members of a team.

That said, we have to remember that not everyone in CAP even HAS a uniform.  And very few have all, or even close to all the uniforms.

I would never ever mix flight suits with service dress.  That would be wrong and silly.  And the golf shirt just needs to die.

And cadets need to dress alike most of the time- it's part of their military program.  We don't need any adolescent "I'm cooler than you because my Mom and Dad could afford flight lessons." 

But suppose you wanted your squadron "uniform of the day" to be BDUs.  Are you going to require seniors to buy BDUs? What about your pilots who have no need for that uniform?  Sure, you could make 'em (39-1 allows it), but is it really worth their money?   Wouldn't it make more sense to have them invest in the suit they will wear when doing their CAP job? 

Most USAF units are operating in a mix of BDUs and nomex.  This includes the Air Staff at the Pentagon.  The two suits blend pretty well, at least everyone is basically green.  If CAP did this, it would look...pretty air force-y.  I don't think that's a bad thing.

Now, cadets need to dress as alike as possible most of the time- it's part of their military program. 

(As an aside, if I ran CAP, the mandatory uniforms woudn't be service dress, it would be BDUs and flight suits.  That's the clothes when we're doing most of the important stuff.)

[jimmydeanno]

And cadets need to dress alike most of the time- it's part of their military program.  We don't need any adolescent "I'm cooler than you because my Mom and Dad could afford flight lessons." 

Yeah, isn't it terrible...

Real life story...

My previous squadron was in an area where the AFA was really active and had money to spend.  So, they decided that they were going to award 2 solo scholarships to our squadron each year.  Criteria for the scholarship was left to us.

So, for 3 years we selected 2 cadets that were over achievers and the AFA paid for them to solo (up to 14 hours).  As a way to recognize those cadets the Squadron CC set a policy that on AE nights, those cadets could wear their flight suits.

Guess what, there was no animosity between the cadets, no bickering or demeaning or "I'm cooler" crap.  All that came of it was discussions about soloing, their experiences, what they did to earn the scholarships and some guidance and mentoring on what the other cadets can do to help their chances of getting one.

We always hear about cadets joining to "fly."  New cadets associate flying with flightsuits, so why not get some flightsuits visible so those cadets know who to talk to about things like that?

[Dragoon]

In your situation, it sounds like a good thing

1.  You did it only on  AE night.  Makes sense.

2.  Your zipper suited sun gods were also your best cadets (I'm assuming that's how your scholarship selection process worked).


In this way you avoided the underachieving cadet airman with rich parents who flaunts his superiority over his way more capable but financially challenged superior. (seen it)

[jimmydeanno]

^congrats on your salty&seasoned

[Jolt]

In this way you avoided the underachieving cadet airman with rich parents who flaunts his superiority over his way more capable but financially challenged superior. (seen it)

All three of the cadets in my squadron that ever wear flight suits are cadet officers.  Two of us are Earhart cadets and all of us have been in the "top 3" (C/CC, C/XO, C/CD).  We all have some kind of wings (solo and cadet pilot) and our cadet pilot just started at the Naval Academy this summer.

Again, we rarely ever wear our flight suits.  I don't even wear my wings on my BDU.

[BlackKnight]

Most USAF units are operating in a mix of BDUs and nomex.  This includes the Air Staff at the Pentagon.  The two suits blend pretty well, at least everyone is basically green.  If CAP did this, it would look...pretty air force-y.  I don't think that's a bad thing.

This pretty much describes my composite squadron.  We permit qualifying cadets (18 or older) who are actively engaged in CAP air crew training to wear the green CAP flight suit in lieu of BDUs on meeting nights where the BDU is the official UOD.  All patches and insignia must be correct and per regs- same as if the cadet were in BDUs. Seeing these older cadet officers in flight suits does seem to help keep the interest and focus of the junior cadets on "Air Power!" instead of Hoo-ah!   

[JayT]

In this way you avoided the underachieving cadet airman with rich parents who flaunts his superiority over his way more capable but financially challenged superior. (seen it)

All three of the cadets in my squadron that ever wear flight suits are cadet officers.  Two of us are Earhart cadets and all of us have been in the "top 3" (C/CC, C/XO, C/CD).  We all have some kind of wings (solo and cadet pilot) and our cadet pilot just started at the Naval Academy this summer.

Again, we rarely ever wear our flight suits.  I don't even wear my wings on my BDU.

So you violating 39-1 why? (Not the flight suit thing, the wings on BDUs things)

[JayT]

I'm a big fan of "uniform of the day."  Made lots of posts elsewhere on getting folks to feel like members of a team.

That said, we have to remember that not everyone in CAP even HAS a uniform.  And very few have all, or even close to all the uniforms.

I would never ever mix flight suits with service dress.  That would be wrong and silly.  And the golf shirt just needs to die.

And cadets need to dress alike most of the time- it's part of their military program.  We don't need any adolescent "I'm cooler than you because my Mom and Dad could afford flight lessons." 

But suppose you wanted your squadron "uniform of the day" to be BDUs.  Are you going to require seniors to buy BDUs? What about your pilots who have no need for that uniform?  Sure, you could make 'em (39-1 allows it), but is it really worth their money?   Wouldn't it make more sense to have them invest in the suit they will wear when doing their CAP job? 

Most USAF units are operating in a mix of BDUs and nomex.  This includes the Air Staff at the Pentagon.  The two suits blend pretty well, at least everyone is basically green.  If CAP did this, it would look...pretty air force-y.  I don't think that's a bad thing.

Now, cadets need to dress as alike as possible most of the time- it's part of their military program. 

(As an aside, if I ran CAP, the mandatory uniforms woudn't be service dress, it would be BDUs and flight suits.  That's the clothes when we're doing most of the important stuff.)

What important stuff do we do in BDUs? I thought that ES was completely optional?

CAP should forcus on Blue stuff, Aerospace education and the Cadet Program, way more then ES. Honestly, I think that some units obession with ES is the worst thing for the program. In my area, we have almost no missions what so ever. So we teach cadets such ES skills as 'Don't worry about your uniform, it's an emergency!' and 'Don't worry about rank, it's an emergency!'

I would honestly love to seperate the Cadet Program from the rest of the CAP junk.

[Jolt]

So you violating 39-1 why? (Not the flight suit thing, the wings on BDUs things)

I'm not required to wear my solo wings until you can find me a reg cite (I just did a quick look at M39-1 and R35-6).

[RiverAux]

Just because you've earned a qualification doesn't mean you're required to wear it.  Except for ribbons where there is a minimum, I believe.

[jb512]

it builds some discussion between the zoomers and non zoomers from what I've seen.

OR it builds some tension/distraction/competition between zoomers and non zoomers. 

Tension would come from people who could better direct their energy towards working on an aeronautical rating and has no place in the meeting.

Distraction might come at first until it becomes a regular sight.

Competition is never a bad thing.

[Hawk200]

So you violating 39-1 why? (Not the flight suit thing, the wings on BDUs things)

The Air Force requires aeronautical ratings to be worn. Civil Air Patrol has no equivalent policy. Besides, if you require it, you have to issue it.