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flyguync
Member

Posts: 78

« on: July 01, 2019, 11:53:41 PM »

Before getting flamed, yes I used the search function and nothing newer than 9 years ago..

Need advice on using CAP on a resume, 20+ years has to count for something, right??

GRW, IC, SOS, ACSC, AWC, etc.

How do you all word it other than a one line blurb?

Again not wanting to get flamed, and absolutely nothing replaces military service, but anyone used CAP in lieu of before?

Thanks in advance!!

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arajca
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Posts: 4,414

« Reply #1 on: July 02, 2019, 12:33:43 AM »

Quick point - SOS, ACSC, AWC go under "Education". Spell them out and provide a brief description, including approximate education/degree level.
Most CAP stuff can fall under "Other activities". If you can tie somethings you've done in CAP to the position you're after, that helps.
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TheSkyHornet
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Posts: 1,879

« Reply #2 on: July 02, 2019, 01:33:59 PM »

If you're using CAP on a resume for an external job, just list the relevant parts of CAP.

For example, if it's something to do with management, list relevant duty positions or experiences where you deal with/oversee people. If it's something to do with, say, inventory tracking, talk about roles involving logistics/supply/finance but maybe leave out providing O-Flights.

Just remember that there's a good percentage of people who don't know what CAP is. If you list it, be prepared to explain it in 20 seconds.
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CFToaster
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Posts: 55
Unit: SER-FL-116

« Reply #3 on: July 02, 2019, 02:08:17 PM »

I don't think I would list CAP-specific training unless it is VERY specific to the position you're applying for. For instance, if I were applying for flight nurse position, I would mention any air crew training that I'd taken. Likewise, if I were putting in for a management position, I'd mention any leadership training I'd done.

As far as your listing CAP, it can go either under "Volunteer Experience" if you have such a section (usually reserved for employer-specific job applications, or CV), or among your other work experience. For job title, use your current position title(s). List specific responsibilities and accomplishments of your time in CAP.

I've been in less than a year, but such an entry on my resume would look like this:

September 2018 - Present
Health Services, Safety and Emergency Services Training Officer
Civil Air Patrol, U.S. Air Force Auxiliary, Seminole Composite Squadron
Provide health and safety education to squadron members.  Conduct activity-specific safety risk assessments and minimize identified risks. Provide first aid care in austere environments. Supervise and mentor youth members during regular meetings and field activities. Qualified in ground search and rescue and urban direction finding; train fellow squadron members in these skills.

If I had any specific accomplishments, I'd list those, too (Staff positions at activities, successful recruitment or fundraising activities, etc.)
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MovingOnToOtherThings
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Posts: 1,321

« Reply #4 on: July 02, 2019, 03:51:29 PM »

For my full-time occupation as a Complex Safety Manager for Tyson Foods I did not mention CAP on the resume but did come up during lunch meeting when asked about hobbies.

When I submitted my CV for an Adjunct Professor's job I listed several things from my CAP experience which was asked about during the interview process.

I believe it is going to depend on what you are applying for.

I now teach full-time for one and part-time for another college in Safety & Emergency Management.

From an HR perspective I was talking with one of my co-workers about it (a 4 hours car ride gives time for great conversation). He is now a Corporate HR VP and a former member of the CAP. His opinion was the classes like the Tech, Senior, and Master did not merit as much attention because they were not actual AF courses and not “Certified or written by a TPA” such as ANSI/ASSE Z490.1 Qualified Person. The individuals that wrote the courses are not likely trained in Safety other than within CAP. You are basically validating your own work and calling it qualified. I asked because I was trying to decide if I was going to get my Master Rating in Safety. He stated if my master’s degree in Safety, 20 years of experience and work as a Professor Didn’t do it he wouldn’t waste his time. He noted that CAP Pilots came in at advanced rank because they want pilots but as someone with a master’s degree in HR/Professional Development he still had to start out as a SM. He stayed in for 3 years.

Courses such as the Region Staff College, National Staff College, and a few others are better but only because they had interaction from within and outside of the organization. Courses like the SOS, ACSC, AWC were better viewed than any of the others because it was by the AF and not within the organization itself. Granted neither of us know the course writers’ backgrounds and was a generalized statement. When I applied for my other Adjunct Professor job my completion of SOS was looked at favorably because I was going to be teaching classes that have an element of military interaction.

I think you must look at each situation by itself and use the appropriate level of information for the resume. I would not include it on a resume for a job in an Industrial Facility but would for another teaching job.

I did list the ICS 300/ ICS 400 along with a MS in ESM from FEMA and GEMA on the CV but did not list any Safety Courses from CAP on my CV as I have an MS in OSH. When I interviewed with a former company the Regional Manager liked the fact I had been in CAP for 14 years at that time, but courses were not really discussed.

***added I did not include that I did mention having been part of the National Safety Committee at one time. Before it was eliminated when applying for the professor jobs"

As a side note I have not been active in CAP for more than a year now and can’t attest to current courses.
« Last Edit: July 02, 2019, 04:14:30 PM by MovingOnToOtherThings » Report to moderator   Logged
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shuman14
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Unit: NHQ-996

« Reply #5 on: July 02, 2019, 04:27:46 PM »

Depends on the Resume.

If this is for a Federal Job, using the USAJobs.gov  webpage, the longer the better. List everything, explain every position and duties, expand every abbreviation, list all awards and badges. The computer screening program looks for key words and phrases to deem you qualified for the job so more is better.

Civilian, non-government, resume, not so much. Less is more and no more than one sheet of paper and some will say double sided is too much.

Here is a bullet I would suggest:


MAJOR, CIVIL AIR PATROL (15JAN1986 - Present) Mayberry, IN.

Volunteer Service assisting the US Air Force in emergency service operations, youth development and Community outreach. Numerous Staff and Leadership positions throughout the period.



I agree any formal training should be listed under your education:


AIR WAR COLLEGE (05JUN2018) Maxwell Air Force Base, AL.

Post-Graduate Level Education Certificate in Strategic Studies and Leadership. 



Short and sweet and will allow you to expand on your Service and the education itself during your interview.
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Joseph J. Clune
Lieutenant Colonel, Military Police

USMCR: 1990 - 1992                           USAR: 1993 -1998, 2000 - Present     CAP (National Patron) 2013 - Present
INARNG: 1992 - 1993, 1998 - 2000       USCGAux: 2004 - Present
Fubar
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Posts: 790

« Reply #6 on: July 03, 2019, 03:40:33 AM »

It's always interesting to see how people work in "U.S. Air Force" into these things even though most members don't come within a football field of doing something directly for the Air Force. But hey, it's a resume, I totally get it.
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CFToaster
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Posts: 55
Unit: SER-FL-116

« Reply #7 on: July 03, 2019, 11:21:13 AM »

It's always interesting to see how people work in "U.S. Air Force" into these things even though most members don't come within a football field of doing something directly for the Air Force. But hey, it's a resume, I totally get it.

Guilty as charged. Here in Florida, the Coast Guard Auxiliary is a very big thing that most people are familiar with. My intent including "Air Force Auxiliary" in my resume is to capitalize on any familiarity the reviewer may already have with [branch] Auxiliaries.
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Holding Pattern
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Unit: Victory

« Reply #8 on: July 03, 2019, 06:28:19 PM »

He noted that CAP Pilots came in at advanced rank because they want pilots but as someone with a master’s degree in HR/Professional Development he still had to start out as a SM. He stayed in for 3 years.

Everyone starts out as a SM.

Pilots with qualifications can be advanced because, well, we are in the Civil AIR Patrol.

There are advancements for other exceptional qualifications codified in regulation, however for those circumstances like the one you outlined, CAPR 35-5 1.8.4 would apply:

"1.8.4. In unusual cases where an exceptionally qualified individual does not meet the promotion eligibility criteria of the applicable promotion method outlined in 1.8.1. above, a waiver may be requested by the unit commander, provided he or she can prove that the member concerned has a skill or background unique to CAP which makes him or her eminently qualified for the grade recommended ahead of his or her peers. Each region commander has authority to waive promotion eligibility criteria for the grades of second lieutenant through captain for exceptionally qualified personnel assigned to the region headquarters and subordinate units within the region. This authority will not be delegated. Requests to waive promotion eligibility criteria for major and lieutenant colonel will be considered by the National Awards and Promotion Team (See para 1.10.2.). The following procedures will apply:"
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Eclipse
Too Much Free Time With Silver Clasp
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Posts: 30,261

« Reply #9 on: July 03, 2019, 06:58:36 PM »

From an HR perspective I was talking with one of my co-workers about it (a 4 hours car ride gives time for great conversation). He is now a Corporate HR VP and a former member of the CAP. His opinion was the classes like the Tech, Senior, and Master did not merit as much attention because they were not actual AF courses and not “Certified or written by a TPA” such as ANSI/ASSE Z490.1 Qualified Person. The individuals that wrote the courses are not likely trained in Safety other than within CAP. You are basically validating your own work and calling it qualified. I asked because I was trying to decide if I was going to get my Master Rating in Safety. He stated if my master’s degree in Safety, 20 years of experience and work as a Professor Didn’t do it he wouldn’t waste his time. He noted that CAP Pilots came in at advanced rank because they want pilots but as someone with a master’s degree in HR/Professional Development he still had to start out as a SM. He stayed in for 3 years.

The issue is relevance.

CAP Safety training is intended to be relevent to CAP activities and operations, not provide a generalized education
for a compliance environment. It primarily stresses attention to detail in planning and risk management.
That puts CAP SE's a cut above "joe off the street", but obviously no in the same class as someone
working in a business environment.  However to simply assume the curriculum wasn't drafted by qualified
people is a leap at best, and probably indicates the conversation was on the right vector to start.
Even as someone who generally derides what CAP does as the "check-box mentality", it would be hard to argue
that what is presented and required isn't' also relevent.

As to having a Masters in HR and complaining about not being promoted, that's on him.  I can't imagine
the mission skills relevance of HR/PD for an advanced promotion, but, as indicated above, if he could have made the case, that
avenue is open.  CFIs and others are afforded the opportunity for advanced grade in acknowledgement of
bringing and using those skills to CAP, and good CCs don't confer that grade until such time as they start
doing just that.

How much HR/PD development work did he do in those 3 years?



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MovingOnToOtherThings
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 1,321

« Reply #10 on: July 25, 2019, 10:23:22 AM »

From an HR perspective I was talking with one of my co-workers about it (a 4 hours car ride gives time for great conversation). He is now a Corporate HR VP and a former member of the CAP. His opinion was the classes like the Tech, Senior, and Master did not merit as much attention because they were not actual AF courses and not “Certified or written by a TPA” such as ANSI/ASSE Z490.1 Qualified Person. The individuals that wrote the courses are not likely trained in Safety other than within CAP. You are basically validating your own work and calling it qualified. I asked because I was trying to decide if I was going to get my Master Rating in Safety. He stated if my master’s degree in Safety, 20 years of experience and work as a Professor Didn’t do it he wouldn’t waste his time. He noted that CAP Pilots came in at advanced rank because they want pilots but as someone with a master’s degree in HR/Professional Development he still had to start out as a SM. He stayed in for 3 years.

The issue is relevance.

CAP Safety training is intended to be relevent to CAP activities and operations, not provide a generalized education
for a compliance environment. It primarily stresses attention to detail in planning and risk management.
That puts CAP SE's a cut above "joe off the street", but obviously no in the same class as someone
working in a business environment.  However to simply assume the curriculum wasn't drafted by qualified
people is a leap at best, and probably indicates the conversation was on the right vector to start.
Even as someone who generally derides what CAP does as the "check-box mentality", it would be hard to argue
that what is presented and required isn't' also relevent.

As to having a Masters in HR and complaining about not being promoted, that's on him.  I can't imagine
the mission skills relevance of HR/PD for an advanced promotion, but, as indicated above, if he could have made the case, that
avenue is open.  CFIs and others are afforded the opportunity for advanced grade in acknowledgement of
bringing and using those skills to CAP, and good CCs don't confer that grade until such time as they start
doing just that.

How much HR/PD development work did he do in those 3 years?

The gist of the conversation was about the use and benefit of courses volunteer organizations may have that the individual volunteers could use to gain knowledge, skill, and experience that may be applicable to their future endeavors. I did not take his comments as him saying that the individuals that wrote the programs or training were not capable or intelligent individuals, but rather that the individual monthly training topics did not reach the level of a "CEU" course. Rather a course such RSC, NSC, SOS, ACSC, AWC or something along that line.

I was a Tech Rated Safety Officer at the time and though what he said about the Master Rating may have been his opinion I have always believed that you have to understand the organization programs and requirements from the safety perspective. I look at it like OSHA states that an "Individual Receiving Mobile Equipment Training" are required to go through the individual company's training to be certified in that facility and that a general license for PIT cannot be transferred from one facility the next. You can get that Certification at a school or other organization but the receiving business still requires in house training. Though I may have the academic portion behind me the "organizational specific aspects is what they want" then that is what you have to learn and qualify for. I have not worked towards the Senior Rating not because I don't think I should have to, but because I have not been an active member for several years.

If I remember correctly he stayed in for the 3 year period to support his daughter and helped in Admin, Personnel, and some Cadet Stuff.
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OldGuy
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Posts: 675
Unit: TBKS

« Reply #11 on: July 25, 2019, 01:55:08 PM »

Everyone starts out as a SM.
Well, except for former cadets with the Earhart or Spaatz, lawyers, doctors and CPAs also get bumps pretty much at the start.
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arajca
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Posts: 4,414

« Reply #12 on: July 25, 2019, 02:43:27 PM »

Everyone starts out as a SM.
Well, except for former cadets with the Earhart or Spaatz, lawyers, doctors and CPAs also get bumps pretty much at the start.
CPAs no longer do, unless they're serving as wing finance staff. You didn't mention pilots...
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Mitchell 1969
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Unit: PCR-CA-051

« Reply #13 on: July 25, 2019, 09:58:58 PM »

Everyone starts out as a SM.
Well, except for former cadets with the Earhart or Spaatz, lawyers, doctors and CPAs also get bumps pretty much at the start.

You forgot the Mitchell.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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_________________
Bernard J. Wilson, Major, CAP

Mitchell 1969; Earhart 1971; Eaker 1973. Cadet Flying Encampment, License, 1970. IACE New Zealand 1971; IACE Korea 1973.

CAP has been bery, bery good to me.
Eclipse
Too Much Free Time With Silver Clasp
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Posts: 30,261

« Reply #14 on: July 25, 2019, 10:12:13 PM »

FWIW All adults come in as Senior Members (Without Grade).

Nothing is automatic, it all has to be manually processed and go through the various approvals.
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