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CAP Talk  |  General Discussion  |  Membership  |  Topic: Young SM desires to be an NCO - Regulations unclear
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Author Topic: Young SM desires to be an NCO - Regulations unclear  (Read 1181 times)
MacGruff
Seasoned Member

Posts: 345

« on: July 04, 2018, 10:26:00 AM »

Hi everyone,

I was recently presented with the following situation: one of the Squadrons in my area has a new Senior Member. He is 19 years old and is serving in the National Guard. In the Guard, he has reached an E-4 grade. He would really like to be a CAP NCO and was wondering how he goes about it?

Reading CAPR 35-5 presents a quandary:
*   Paragraph 6.2.1 states that "Current or former military members holding the grade E-4 that wish to hold a CAP NCO grade will be appointed to the grade of SSgt after completion of Level I."

So far, so good.

The lack of clarity comes from the following:

Paragraph 1.6 of the same regulation states that the minimum age for getting CAP officer grades is 21 years of age. Hmm.... My prospective NCO is only 19.... So, that makes me wonder if there is an age "issue" here? Looking more thoroughly through 35-5 I see nothing discussing minimum ages for NCOs. Further complicating matters in my mind is that the only part of 35-5 that discusses Senior Members who are less than 21 is in paragraph 7.1 which discusses Flight Officer grades and specifically states that Flight Officer grades are "... for those members who are otherwise eligible for CAP officer grades except that they have not yet reached the minimum age of 21." Again, this is talking about officers and not NCOs.

I am pondering this while waiting for the 4th of July picnic and fireworks displays...  :-)

Checking other regulations like 39-2 and 35-1 has yielded nothing. I have the Wing Chief of Staff stumped about it as well... and NHQ is not open today.

What's the opinion here? Is this a case where this young man has to wait till he reaches the age of 21? Or, can an SM become a SSgt even though he is under 21, since that is an NCO grade and not an officer?

Thanks in advance.
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HandsomeWalt_USMC
Member

Posts: 55
Unit: NER-MA-019

« Reply #1 on: July 04, 2018, 10:52:41 AM »

Anecdotal only, but I was a 20 year old Corporal in the Marines. I've known 19 year old NCOs in the Corps, the Army and the Air Force and a plethora of under 21 NCOs in the above. I've also known a bunch of Navy and Coast Guard Petty Officers who were under 21. If CAP follows Military customs of rank, and we generally do, there should be no issue with him being a CAP SSgt at 19.
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Semper Fidelis
Eclipse
Too Much Free Time Award

Posts: 28,954

« Reply #2 on: July 04, 2018, 10:56:48 AM »

No issue, if, for whatever reason, he wants to come in as an NCO, so be it.
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Jester
Seasoned Member

Posts: 335

« Reply #3 on: July 04, 2018, 11:07:59 AM »

I’d say there’s no problem if the reg doesn’t explicitly state otherwise.

I believe there’s one in my wing that’s under 21 but I’m not sure.
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lordmonar
Too Much Free Time Award

Posts: 10,650

« Reply #4 on: July 04, 2018, 11:20:33 AM »

The only minimum age for NCO's is 18.....you got to be a senior member to be an NCO.

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PATRICK M. HARRIS, SMSgt, CAP
Pacific Region
abdsp51
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 2,559
Unit: Classified

« Reply #5 on: July 04, 2018, 11:39:33 AM »

Why would he want to?  It's still not fully flushed out and there has yet to be any official sound reasoning for it.
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Jester
Seasoned Member

Posts: 335

« Reply #6 on: July 04, 2018, 12:48:25 PM »

Why would he want to?  It's still not fully flushed out and there has yet to be any official sound reasoning for it.
And the hijack begins.

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Holding Pattern
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 1,274
Unit: Worry

« Reply #7 on: July 04, 2018, 12:54:04 PM »

Why would he want to?  It's still not fully flushed out and there has yet to be any official sound reasoning for it.

Among other things, NCO PME is available to CAP members who are NCOs.
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abdsp51
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 2,559
Unit: Classified

« Reply #8 on: July 04, 2018, 03:21:08 PM »

Why would he want to?  It's still not fully flushed out and there has yet to be any official sound reasoning for it.
And the hijack begins.

Sorry if you can't accept the facts and reality of something.
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abdsp51
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 2,559
Unit: Classified

« Reply #9 on: July 04, 2018, 03:22:17 PM »

Why would he want to?  It's still not fully flushed out and there has yet to be any official sound reasoning for it.

Among other things, NCO PME is available to CAP members who are NCOs.

Again why would someone want to when it's not flushed out and there is no reasoning for it?
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Eclipse
Too Much Free Time Award

Posts: 28,954

« Reply #10 on: July 04, 2018, 03:23:55 PM »

Why would he want to?  It's still not fully flushed out and there has yet to be any official sound reasoning for it.

Among other things, NCO PME is available to CAP members who are NCOs.

It's also already available to him as a military NCO, of which he are one.
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Jester
Seasoned Member

Posts: 335

« Reply #11 on: July 04, 2018, 03:28:53 PM »

Why would he want to?  It's still not fully flushed out and there has yet to be any official sound reasoning for it.
And the hijack begins.

Sorry if you can't accept the facts and reality of something.


You really got me on that one.

How about you just answer the question and move on?  If you don’t know the answer, feel free to say nothing and move on. This “guy speaks out of his element and demands to be seen as credible” stuff died with Andy Rooney.
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abdsp51
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 2,559
Unit: Classified

« Reply #12 on: July 04, 2018, 03:29:52 PM »

Why would he want to?  It's still not fully flushed out and there has yet to be any official sound reasoning for it.

Among other things, NCO PME is available to CAP members who are NCOs.

It's also already available to him as a military NCO, of which he are one.

Without knowing what branch he is in it may not be availble just yet.  Also which variation of E4 plays a role as well.
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abdsp51
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 2,559
Unit: Classified

« Reply #13 on: July 04, 2018, 03:31:32 PM »

Why would he want to?  It's still not fully flushed out and there has yet to be any official sound reasoning for it.
And the hijack begins.

Sorry if you can't accept the facts and reality of something.


You really got me on that one.

How about you just answer the question and move on?  If you don’t know the answer, feel free to say nothing and move on. This “guy speaks out of his element and demands to be seen as credible” stuff died with Andy Rooney.

Again can't accept the facts and want to make it personal. 
Logged
CAP_truth
Seasoned Member

Posts: 250

« Reply #14 on: July 04, 2018, 03:47:31 PM »

Only thing needed is a CAPF2 plus proof of grade ex. DD214, promotion orders or military ID. signed by unit commander and sent to national HQ.
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Cadet CoP
Wilson
Pace
CAPTalk Moderator
Dark S'Member Lord
*
Posts: 716

« Reply #15 on: July 04, 2018, 04:07:42 PM »

The original question was quite specific and yet there was needless drift. PM sent.

OP's question was answered. We're done here. If the OP wants this thread reopened, PM me.
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Lt Col, CAP
Former C/Lt Col
Former this & that
Squadron guy
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CAP Talk  |  General Discussion  |  Membership  |  Topic: Young SM desires to be an NCO - Regulations unclear
 


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