ABUs: The Large Print Giveth, And The Small Print Taketh Away

[ProdigalJim]

Just got the word on our Wing's allocation of ABUs and it's kinda not encouraging. The language in Maj Gen Vazquez's announcement suggested there were large numbers of ABUs that might be made available...not necessarily for everyone, but substantial numbers.

At least from the documentation I've been given, there are very few pieces that would constitute a complete "set" (coat plus trousers). Roughly 75% of the male items are size 46 or better...6% of the total items (male and female) are accounted for with size 50 Short trousers (so much for height/weight, and I don't think we have 13 cadets in the wing of that size). There are exactly two pairs of male trousers on the list, one 40 Short and one 44 Regular. Some 23% of the female pieces are size 16 or better and all of those, except for five coats, are XS, S or L.

Overall, there appear to be enough items to partially outfit perhaps 15% of our Wing's cadets, and exactly one complete set (coat plus trousers) -- a female size 4 Regular.

Free is free, and free is good. We're grateful, because that's a bunch of stuff we didn't have before. We'll salute and do what we can. But...wow, definitely a let-down.

[Eclipse]

Roughly 75% of the male items are size 46 or better...6% of the total items (male and female) are accounted for with size 50 Short trousers (so much for height/weight,

Most of the people able to wear those sizes, aren't allowed to wear ABUs, especially 50 short.

They shouldn't even be issued or even be in the CAP inventory.

USAF max waistline is 39.  No wonder these have been sitting around.

[SMWOG]

So we were told everyone should be able to get a set because USAF has excess. Membership is hyped due to NHQ statement. Reality, we dont have enough and the ones that we do are in large sizes.  Dont make promises  you cant make delivery on!

[Майор Хаткевич]

Roughly 75% of the male items are size 46 or better...6% of the total items (male and female) are accounted for with size 50 Short trousers (so much for height/weight,

Most of the people able to wear those sizes, aren't allowed to wear ABUs, especially 50 short.

They shouldn't even be issued or even be in the CAP inventory.

USAF max waistline is 39.  No wonder these have been sitting around.

Repeal of H/W Confirmed!

[Eclipse]

Undersell and overdeliver a concept CAP does not seem to be able to grasp.

[Майор Хаткевич]

Undersell and overdeliver a concept CAP does not seem to be able to grasp.

Well, as someone said...free is free, and a large amount of free is...free. But a large amount of parachutes does us little good.

[Spaceman3750]

Maybe I should start re-considering the logistics involved in making SS blues the default meeting uniform here, and if you want to do something requiring a field uniform you should probably plan to buy it.

Of course, we'll be fully onto the next commander by the time sunset hits.

[Storm Chaser]

The larger ABU sizes are available for those Airmen who either have a medical waiver or are in the period between a failed fitness test and their retake or are awaiting separation from the Air Force. In all those instances, these Airmen must continue wearing a uniform while on duty.

I agree that some of those sizes would not be in compliance with the CAP height and weight standards. Then again, CAP has no waist standard, so taller members may be able to wear some of those larger sizes.

[Damron]

HQ didn't provide BDU's, so I'm not sure what the fuss is about.  Our squadron has a large stock of BDU's so I'm not that interested in ABU's unless they show up for free or I find some great bulk deals on ABU's.

Myself, I'm wearing BDU's until I can provide ABU's to every member of my squadron.   

For the next five years, we'll see a mix in the ranks.  We'll survive. 

On a side note, with the dark blue tapes, the corporate BDU just became a fantastic looking uniform. 

[Eclipse]

Then again, CAP has no waist standard, so taller members may be able to wear some of those larger sizes.

No one wearing 50 short is gong to be CAP-compliant, and the taller people will need tall sizes in order for the length to be correct.
Proper's chart indicates size 46R ABU shirt is intended for 5'-5" to 5'-9",  not "tall by US standards" (max weight at that height for CAP is M:185, F:165).

[Майор Хаткевич]

On a side note, with the dark blue tapes, the corporate BDU just became a fantastic looking uniform.

Pretty sure that was the main logic behind the switch.

[NIN]

Equine dentistry, right on CAP Talk


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[foo]

Then again, CAP has no waist standard, so taller members may be able to wear some of those larger sizes.

No one wearing 50 short is gong to be CAP-compliant, and the taller people will need tall sizes in order for the length to be correct.
Proper's chart indicates size 46R ABU shirt is intended for 5'-5" to 5'-9",  not "tall by US standards" (max weight at that height for CAP is M:185, F:165).

Sam: "Whatcha up to, Norm?"
Norm: "My ideal weight if I were 11 feet tall."

[Slim]

My wing: one medium size exchange on an air Guard base that services three small satellite exchanges (2 AF, 1 Army), 66 pieces.

Wing to the immediate south:  One very large active duty base, large exchange that probably also services several satellite stores.  I've been led to believe they went and filled up a 32 foot FEMA trailer, and didn't get them all.

Rumor has it that region is about to issue a "Stop" order on distribution.

[Майор Хаткевич]

My wing: one medium size exchange on an air Guard base that services three small satellite exchanges (2 AF, 1 Army), 66 pieces.

Wing to the immediate south:  One very large active duty base, large exchange that probably also services several satellite stores.  I've been led to believe they went and filled up a 32 foot FEMA trailer, and didn't get them all.

Rumor has it that region is about to issue a "Stop" order on distribution.

Surely the plan wasn't to distribute it based on what the AF had in each Wing? I figured the logistics would suck, but that the distribution would be based on at least a regional level, and cadet numbers / wing?

[Spaceman3750]

So a while ago when this first came out I asked a friend who is in the ANG what happens to their old uniforms (I was really angling for "they sit in a pile in the supply room and here's the supply NCO's phone number"). I'm told they turn them into supply and supply ships them off to be "recycled". Hearing what the AAFES situation is, it makes me wonder what is happening to the turn-ins...

People have been saying for years they've had to turn away bags and bags and bags of ABUs. It's not like the AF suddenly stopped cycling their uniforms. Sure, some of them will be trashed, but there's a huge number of airmen that ride a cube, and whose 3 year old turn-in ABUs will presumably be in great shape.

[Eclipse]

Surely the plan wasn't to distribute it based on what the AF had in each Wing? I figured the logistics would suck, but that the distribution would be based on at least a regional level, and cadet numbers / wing?

[stillamarine]

Then again, CAP has no waist standard, so taller members may be able to wear some of those larger sizes.

No one wearing 50 short is gong to be CAP-compliant, and the taller people will need tall sizes in order for the length to be correct.
Proper's chart indicates size 46R ABU shirt is intended for 5'-5" to 5'-9",  not "tall by US standards" (max weight at that height for CAP is M:185, F:165).

Where did you get those numbers? Per CAPM 39-1 Attachment 2 the max weight for 5'9" is 208

[Майор Хаткевич]

Then again, CAP has no waist standard, so taller members may be able to wear some of those larger sizes.

No one wearing 50 short is gong to be CAP-compliant, and the taller people will need tall sizes in order for the length to be correct.
Proper's chart indicates size 46R ABU shirt is intended for 5'-5" to 5'-9",  not "tall by US standards" (max weight at that height for CAP is M:185, F:165).

Where did you get those numbers? Per CAPM 39-1 Attachment 2 the max weight for 5'9" is 208

It's 186 at the lower end of that scale.

[ProdigalJim]

HQ didn't provide BDU's, so I'm not sure what the fuss is about.

I understand your point, but this is where my heartburn comes in. The notice from NHQ about this change included the following sentences:

"As a result of negotiations with the Army & Air Force Exchange Services (AAFES), CAP has also been approved to receive a significant number of excess ABUs.  This will allow many CAP members to receive the basic ABU shirt and pants at no cost." (Emphasis mine)

The allocation for our Wing of about 1,500 members give or take includes precisely ONE complete "basic ABU shirt and pants," a female size 4 R, and 209 pieces of clothing (trousers and/or coats). So maybe 80-100 members can make use of them if they're big enough or short enough.

My beef is not looking a gift horse in the mouth, it is instead my disappointment with the mismatch between what was said and what is actually occurring. It's squadron CCs like me who have to explain that mismatch to members and cadets and cadet parents who are following along at home reading the notices. Not the end of the world, by any means, but disappointing nonetheless.

What if, instead of creating the impression that there were going to be large numbers of ABUs available, the letter from NHQ had simply said something like this?

"2. Although CAP has reached an agreement with the Army-Air Force Exchange Services (AAFES) that could make available some excess ABU items to members, quantities are extremely limited and many sizes may be unavailable depending on your location and size needs. In keeping with existing policy, members remain responsible for obtaining their own utility uniforms, and members should not rely on the AAFES agreement to obtain an initial set of ABUs once the phase-in period begins."

If the letter had something like this above, I would not be griping about the smallish pile of 46L and 50S trousers we're going to get here. In short, it's not about uniforms it's about expectations.