Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?
May 25, 2019, 01:04:37 PM
Home Help Login Register
News:

CAP Talk  |  General Discussion  |  The Lobby  |  Topic: CAP wants more of my money
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 5  All Send this topic Print
Author Topic: CAP wants more of my money  (Read 18049 times)
NIN
Administrator

Posts: 5,214
Unit: of issue

« Reply #20 on: March 21, 2014, 07:34:47 PM »

There is a subtle difference fundraising from your audience between a membership organization (CAP) and something like a foundation or a college.
Report to moderator   Logged
Darin Ninness, Lt Col, CAP
Sq Bubba, Wing Dude, National Guy
I like to have Difficult Adult Conversations™
The contents of this post are Copyright © 2007-2019 by NIN. All rights are reserved. Specific permission is given to quote this post here on CAP-Talk only.
antdetroitwallyball
Member

Posts: 75

« Reply #21 on: March 23, 2014, 02:21:09 PM »

I hate organizations that do these kind of shakedowns. I used to volunteer as a Big Brother with Big Brothers Big Sisters (BBBS). They assign you a kid to mentor, and everything you do with that kid basically comes out of your pocket. BBBS was fond of saying, "Well, you can do activities with your mentee that don't cost any money, like bake cookies in your kitchen or visit a local municipal park."

Well, I got assigned a 13 year old boy, and ended up taking on his 15 year old cousin as well. No 13 or 15 year old wants to "bake cookies." We did cool things, like go to museums and even a theme park. That all cost a ton of money, in addition to the gas it cost to drive around.

But I was totally fine with paying for all that. No volunteer work is really free.

I got upset, however, when BBBS started soliciting its volunteer mentors (like myself) for donations to fund the organization. They would pester me via email, mail, phone calls, etc. It was very insulting. I would be very disappointed if CAP began practicing fundraisers like that.... :)
Report to moderator   Logged
Майор Хаткевич
200,000th Post Author
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 6,062
Unit: GLR-IL-049

« Reply #22 on: March 25, 2014, 07:31:06 AM »

You were alone with teenagers, and no one had a heart attack? No one was inappropriately contacted? Man, some of the folks on CAPtalk probably wouldnt touch BBBS with a 10 light year stick.
Report to moderator   Logged
Al Sayre
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 2,514
Unit: SER-MS-001

Mississippi Wing
« Reply #23 on: March 25, 2014, 02:43:38 PM »

I have to say I agree with most of the posters here.  I provided most of the funding for an entire squadron in the 5 years I was a SC/CC (Commander Always Pays).  They need to send these letters to potential outside donors, not the membership.  Were already paying an extra mark-up at Vanguard in addition to our dues and the money we spend to help our squadrons and other members.  At what point do we say enough is enough?
Report to moderator   Logged
Lt Col Al Sayre
MS Wing Staff Dude
Admiral, Great Navy of the State of Nebraska
GRW #2787
Ned
Resident Philosopher

Posts: 2,217

« Reply #24 on: March 25, 2014, 04:49:58 PM »

I think we can all agree that CAP needs additional funding, and that we should not be so dependant on a single source - Uncle Sam.  (Who although beloved, can be a little fickle and invents things like sequestration which can and does cause CAP immense problems.)

The Board of Governors' guidance is to broaden our financial base and seek additional revenue sources.  So we pursue grants, STEM funding, and additional customers.

And we hired a Director of Development, Skip Dotherow.  Skip came to us with an extensive background in fundraising in the non-profit world.  He has created an carefully crafted program that includes annual giving, wills and bequests, special fundraising events and campaigns, and all of the similar programs that every single major non-profit in this country utilize.  Because they are effective and help support the organization.

One part of that are the letters that many of us receive from time to time asking for additional support.  Obviously, they are not intended to insult anyone, if for no other reason because insulting people does not provide an effective fundraising method.  If you are unable to give or simply do not wish to give additional support, do not give.

Everyone -- including Skip -- fully understands that all of you are already engaged in CAP and pay dues at the local, wing, region, and national level.  We know that you support your unit in countless other ways -- providing supplies, sponsoring cadets to activities, kicking in for pizza, etc.  All of which adds up.  We really, really understand that.

But some members are in a position provide additional support, and are happy to do so when asked.  Particularly if it is part of a particular program and they can see where their particular donation is going.  To a particular flight scholarship, perhaps.  Or maybe to support the IACE program.

As others have indicated in this thread, providing volunteers an additional opportunity to contribute to the mission is both normal and necessary in the non-profit world.  ARC volunteers receive that same letters that have been described here.  As do BBBS volunteers.   Scouters, symphony subscribers, and the parents of every public and private school in the universe -- all receive letters seeking support.

Bottom line: seeking additional support from the fraction of the membership that can provide it is an important and successful part of our development plan.  But we also are aggressively pursuing outside gifts, donors, grants, and other funding. 

All of which enables us to better perform our missions.  Which is the real reason we exist in the first place.


Ned Lee
NHQ Apologist

Report to moderator   Logged
JeffDG
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 3,179

« Reply #25 on: March 25, 2014, 04:55:53 PM »

Ned Lee
NHQ Apologist

I just can't believe that NHQ didn't advertise that new duty position for folks to apply for.   >:D
Report to moderator   Logged
Eclipse
Too Much Free Time Award

Posts: 29,821

« Reply #26 on: March 25, 2014, 05:12:28 PM »

Where's the opt-out button?
Report to moderator   Logged


MSG Mac
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 1,986
Unit: MER-MD-071

« Reply #27 on: March 25, 2014, 05:33:16 PM »

Also explains why your income level is now an optional input on the membership forms.
Report to moderator   Logged
Michael P. McEleney
Lt Col CAP
MSG USA (Retired)
DoubleSecret
Forum Regular

Posts: 124

« Reply #28 on: March 26, 2014, 10:44:09 AM »

Where's the opt-out button?

This.  I still get mail from two of my colleges asking for donations.  An opt-out button would at least save them the time and money they waste asking me. 
Report to moderator   Logged
Patterson
Seasoned Member

Posts: 316

« Reply #29 on: March 26, 2014, 11:17:07 AM »

^ exactly!  Postage adds up, it eats away at the amount of cash generated by the mailing. 
Report to moderator   Logged
Alaric
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 785

« Reply #30 on: March 26, 2014, 01:12:43 PM »

I think we can all agree that CAP needs additional funding, and that we should not be so dependant on a single source - Uncle Sam.  (Who although beloved, can be a little fickle and invents things like sequestration which can and does cause CAP immense problems.)

The Board of Governors' guidance is to broaden our financial base and seek additional revenue sources.  So we pursue grants, STEM funding, and additional customers.

And we hired a Director of Development, Skip Dotherow.  Skip came to us with an extensive background in fundraising in the non-profit world.  He has created an carefully crafted program that includes annual giving, wills and bequests, special fundraising events and campaigns, and all of the similar programs that every single major non-profit in this country utilize.  Because they are effective and help support the organization.

One part of that are the letters that many of us receive from time to time asking for additional support.  Obviously, they are not intended to insult anyone, if for no other reason because insulting people does not provide an effective fundraising method.  If you are unable to give or simply do not wish to give additional support, do not give.

Everyone -- including Skip -- fully understands that all of you are already engaged in CAP and pay dues at the local, wing, region, and national level.  We know that you support your unit in countless other ways -- providing supplies, sponsoring cadets to activities, kicking in for pizza, etc.  All of which adds up.  We really, really understand that.

But some members are in a position provide additional support, and are happy to do so when asked.  Particularly if it is part of a particular program and they can see where their particular donation is going.  To a particular flight scholarship, perhaps.  Or maybe to support the IACE program.

As others have indicated in this thread, providing volunteers an additional opportunity to contribute to the mission is both normal and necessary in the non-profit world.  ARC volunteers receive that same letters that have been described here.  As do BBBS volunteers.   Scouters, symphony subscribers, and the parents of every public and private school in the universe -- all receive letters seeking support.

Bottom line: seeking additional support from the fraction of the membership that can provide it is an important and successful part of our development plan.  But we also are aggressively pursuing outside gifts, donors, grants, and other funding. 

All of which enables us to better perform our missions.  Which is the real reason we exist in the first place.


Ned Lee
NHQ Apologist

I have communicated to Dr. Dotherow that I believe his methods are a violation of our core value of integrity, and after further consideration of respect as well.  If NHQ is so desperate for funding that they have to solicit their own members then perhaps they should ask senior leadership to take the hit first (i.e. if a National or Region member wishes to travel its on his own dime; if we are going to have a fundraising person, do what other organization do, hire him with a very low salary with bonuses based on his ability to solicit from outside the organization.)  What this organization does not need is more apologists, if we are ever going to change the organization for the better
Report to moderator   Logged
ironputts
Seasoned Member

Posts: 233
Unit: PA-101

Lower Bucks Squadron PA101
« Reply #31 on: March 26, 2014, 01:46:15 PM »

As Ned said, give if you can and if you cant or wont then dont! Like some of you, I read what it said and I tossed it. I then went to my CAP meeting and had a great time with the cadets.
Report to moderator   Logged
Greg Putnam
Lt. Col., CAP
jimmydeanno
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 4,155
Unit: ǝnƃoɹ

« Reply #32 on: March 26, 2014, 01:56:01 PM »

I've always been of the opinion, "If our own members aren't willing to support our organization, why should anyone else."  I pay my annual membership dues.  That is the only money CAP formally gets from me.  I don't pay for fuel in vans, supplies for the office, or fuel in the planes.  I do, however, contribute to scholarship funds locally, and will more than likely contribute to this one because I now know about it - and it meets the goal of what I think CAP should be doing. 

Just because your unit is horrible at external fundraising doesn't mean that CAP NHQ needs to shut down its efforts because you personally contribute more locally.  If that's how you want to fund your local program, fine, open your wallet and your donation is appreciated.  If I don't "have to" fund my local unit because they're doing their job, then I can keep spending my money on encampment scholarships, NCSA scholarships, and flight scholarships.  I don't mind them asking, because otherwise I wouldn't know they had the donation opportunity.

The cause is  good.  Encampment scholarships would be cool, too., but flight scholarships certainly do meet the aim of our aerospace education program.  If you chose not to donate, just recycle the letter.  Don't bash the scholarship program, anyone searching for this scholarship online is probably going to find this in the top results and ask the same question I do, "If their own members aren't willing to contribute, why should I?"
Report to moderator   Logged
If you have ten thousand regulations you destroy all respect for the law. - Winston Churchill
Eclipse
Too Much Free Time Award

Posts: 29,821

« Reply #33 on: March 26, 2014, 02:29:14 PM »

"If their own members aren't willing to contribute, why should I?"

Or...

Why does a national organization which is a partner with a military service, not to mention fielding the largest private fleet of GA aircraft
in the world have to ask its members for money?

Why aren't they leveraging those relationships externally, especially when flight training benefits their external partners?

Ready, fire, aim.
Report to moderator   Logged


Alaric
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 785

« Reply #34 on: March 26, 2014, 02:53:53 PM »


Just because your unit is horrible at external fundraising doesn't mean that CAP NHQ needs to shut down its efforts because you personally contribute more locally.  If that's how you want to fund your local program, fine, open your wallet and your donation is appreciated.  If I don't "have to" fund my local unit because they're doing their job, then I can keep spending my money on encampment scholarships, NCSA scholarships, and flight scholarships.  I don't mind them asking, because otherwise I wouldn't know they had the donation opportunity.



I don't think CAP NHQ needs to shut down its efforts as long as it concentrates on EXTERNAL fundraising, stop bothering me for money, and spending money by sending physical letters.
Report to moderator   Logged
a2capt
300,000th Post Author
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 5,089
Unit: pǝʇɹǝʌuı

« Reply #35 on: March 26, 2014, 05:52:59 PM »

In a sick twisted way, it could be like we're passengers on a plane that stopped for fuel and they're asking the passengers to chip in for gas.. and they paid for their seats already, too.
Report to moderator   Logged
Eclipse
Too Much Free Time Award

Posts: 29,821

« Reply #36 on: March 26, 2014, 06:10:33 PM »

We can attack this from another vector as well.

Why does an organization with over 500 airplanes and thousands of pilots need to be paying
anyone externally for flight training?

A properly scaled program could essentially have zero costs except for fuel.

Allow some of the O-Ride money to go towards flight instruction - maybe on an "opt-in" basis
per cadet.   That's 5 hours of stick time, per cadet, without any additional budget changes.
Report to moderator   Logged


SJFedor
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 1,689

« Reply #37 on: March 26, 2014, 06:36:31 PM »

We can attack this from another vector as well.

Why does an organization with over 500 airplanes and thousands of pilots need to be paying
anyone externally for flight training?

A properly scaled program could essentially have zero costs except for fuel.

Allow some of the O-Ride money to go towards flight instruction - maybe on an "opt-in" basis
per cadet.   That's 5 hours of stick time, per cadet, without any additional budget changes.

That's already specifically prohibited by regulation. CAPR 60-1, 2.2(h)
Quote
Except for flight instruction or during CAP check rides, only a qualified CAP pilot may handle the controls below 1,000
ft AGL. Orientation flights are not flight instruction. PICs on orientation flights must handle the controls below 1,000 ft AGL.

Emphasis mine.

Is it silly? Absolutely. Has it unofficially happened? Most likely.


Report to moderator   Logged
Steven Fedor, NREMT-P
Master Ambulance Driver
Former Capt, MP, MCPE, MO, MS, GTL, and various other 3-and-4 letter combinations
NESA MAS Instructor, 2008-2010 (#479)
NIN
Administrator

Posts: 5,214
Unit: of issue

« Reply #38 on: March 26, 2014, 06:39:47 PM »

Having worked in higher education, and being closer personal friends with several folks who do "development" in higher ed and other non-profits, I will echo that it is a bit of a tightrope to walk to solicit donations from your membership base.  I'm not saying you shouldn't, but the message has to be tailored differently for your membership audience (even more so than it has to for an alumni-based situation like a school).

Development people are in the unenviable position to continually be seeking funding sources, both internally (members/alumni) and externally (foundations, philanthropists, industry, etc).  I heard a *lot* of grousing from recent grads from the college I worked at that they just spent $80,000 on school and already the college was trying to get them to donate more money.  Well, they got a $20,000 a year education based on getting a discount scholarship of $20,000 that  the school's endowment could support that due to the efforts of the development people.  The didn't understand that the "scholarship" they got wasn't 100% due to someone in the Admissions department's largess with a pen, but rather due to the largess of some fairly well-off alum with his checkbook.

Dr. Dotherow may have (just making up examples) Aeroshell on the hook for a $20,000 grant or Cessna lined up to fund a flight training scholarship, but that all hasn't come thru yet.  Or maybe he went to Cessna and said "Can we get a $100,000 to start a flight training scholarship?" and Cessna said "Nah, we give you guys a huge break on the price of airplanes already.."  Time to go to Piper, Cirrus, etc. But that does take time.

But maybe Mr. and Mrs. Smith from Podunk, Iowa just lost their son Timmy who had been a cadet 20 years ago, and they want to fund a scholarship in his name.  Might be local, might not be.

Its tough. I spend a lot of $$$ on CAP yearly. I get that.   Personally, I am not likely to write a check for a fundraising appeal for some faceless national flight scholarship when I may also have to pony up a few dollars to my unit to help Timmy & Susie get to encampment this year.  But maybe that letter hits Jim Ragwing, CAP pilot extraordinaire, when he's got an extra $10,000 $1,000 and he reads that letter and goes "You know, I remember when I was a teenager and wanted to fly..."  Out comes the checkbook.

Report to moderator   Logged
Darin Ninness, Lt Col, CAP
Sq Bubba, Wing Dude, National Guy
I like to have Difficult Adult Conversations™
The contents of this post are Copyright © 2007-2019 by NIN. All rights are reserved. Specific permission is given to quote this post here on CAP-Talk only.
Eclipse
Too Much Free Time Award

Posts: 29,821

« Reply #39 on: March 26, 2014, 06:45:46 PM »

We can attack this from another vector as well.

Why does an organization with over 500 airplanes and thousands of pilots need to be paying
anyone externally for flight training?

A properly scaled program could essentially have zero costs except for fuel.

Allow some of the O-Ride money to go towards flight instruction - maybe on an "opt-in" basis
per cadet.   That's 5 hours of stick time, per cadet, without any additional budget changes.

That's already specifically prohibited by regulation. CAPR 60-1, 2.2(h)
Quote
Except for flight instruction or during CAP check rides, only a qualified CAP pilot may handle the controls below 1,000
ft AGL. Orientation flights are not flight instruction. PICs on orientation flights must handle the controls below 1,000 ft AGL.

Emphasis mine.

Is it silly? Absolutely. Has it unofficially happened? Most likely.

Understand, but it would be a minor change with zero budget implications except for the
lawyers who would probably have a conniption.

I'd be willing to bet NAFI would lobby hard against it as well.
Report to moderator   Logged


Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 5  All Send this topic Print 
CAP Talk  |  General Discussion  |  The Lobby  |  Topic: CAP wants more of my money
 


Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP SMF 2.0.14 | SMF © 2017, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!
Page created in 0.067 seconds with 26 queries.
click here to email me