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CAP Talk  |  General Discussion  |  Uniforms & Awards  |  Topic: It's finally here!
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Storm Chaser
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Posts: 2,680

« Reply #40 on: December 31, 2013, 03:51:35 PM »

The wording on specialty track badges is a bit confusing. Are we now going to be allowed to wear three (3) specialty track badges?
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Ned
Resident Philosopher

Posts: 2,202

« Reply #41 on: December 31, 2013, 03:54:06 PM »

It is certainly normal for a person's weight to vary by a couple of pounds during a given day.  That's just human nature, I guess.

And like everyone else, I have experienced slight differences between scales.  And for most adults, even a +/- 1% accuracy difference between scales could result in another couple of pounds difference in scales sitting side by side.

But the policy decision was to go with "any commercially available scale" and not require standaridized calibration procedures so that commanders and members could have an reasonably inexpensive and easy to administer system to allow members to wear the correct uniform.

And not get tied around the axle on calibration technicalities or require the purchase of expensive scales used in doctors' offices and health clubs.

The flip side of that is that about half the time, some members a couple of pounds under the limit might have to wear the corporates for a month and the other half of the time some members a couple of pounds over the limit might be approved to wear the USAF-style until the next weigh-in.

Restated, we are accepting a slightly larger good faith margin of error in lieu of fighting about calibration certificates for expensive scales.

(And BTW, the weigh-in language was directly prompted by discussions here on CT.  Give yourselves a hand.)
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Storm Chaser
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Posts: 2,680

« Reply #42 on: December 31, 2013, 03:55:26 PM »

I'm surprised that the Incident Commander badge still ranks lower than the Observer badge. Even the Air Force have given equal standing to some non-aeronautical badges, such as the Space and Cyberspace badges.
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Panache
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Posts: 1,060
Unit: PAWG

« Reply #43 on: December 31, 2013, 04:03:16 PM »

The wording on specialty track badges is a bit confusing. Are we now going to be allowed to wear three (3) specialty track badges?

Four (4) as far as I can tell, at least with the G/W's.


4.1.9.4.3.2 - (page 54) "CAP Service Specialty Track Badges, Model Rocketry, and NRA Marksmanship Badges (refer to Attachment 4). Wear of these badges is optional. CAP service badges will only be worn by officers and NCOs. Model rocketry and NRA marksmanship badges will only be worn by cadets. The total number of badges worn will not exceed four, to include the above - mentioned aviation and occupational badges. The first badge will be centered on the lower portion of the wearer’s left pocket, between the left and right edges and bottom of flap and pocket.

The second badge will be worn in the corresponding location on the wearer’s right pocket. If a third badge is authorized, it will be centered ½ inch above the nametag. CAP service badges, if worn, are always worn on the left, with only one being worn. Model rocketry badge will only be worn on the wearer’s left pocket. Marksmanship badge is worn centered on the top edge of the left pocket flap. Only one
marksmanship badge may be worn. The National Commander’s Staff Badge will always be worn on the wearer’s right side. The CAP Senior Advisory Group, Command Council, National Board or National
Executive Committee will always be worn on the left side."
« Last Edit: December 31, 2013, 04:08:22 PM by Panache » Logged
a2capt
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« Reply #44 on: December 31, 2013, 04:07:15 PM »

The lighting on the "new" photos is terrible, as expected when yo take pictures in a banquet hall.
Sigh. totally called it. Yellow hotel lighting just sucks. The blue is almost black. Cutting off heads is a good idea, puts the focus on what's supposed to be there.
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Walkman
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Posts: 1,233
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Kris Walker Photography
« Reply #45 on: December 31, 2013, 04:07:51 PM »

The wording on specialty track badges is a bit confusing. Are we now going to be allowed to wear three (3) specialty track badges?

Four (4) as far as I can tell, at least with the G/W's.

It looks like four TOTAL bades, including aviation and specialty badges.

Quote
The total number of badges worn will not exceed four, to include the above-mentioned aviation and occupational badges.

So, one could wear Pilot Wings, GTL Badge, Command Badge and 1 Specialty track badge. Or, GTM badge and 3 Specialty track badges. Does that sound right?
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a2capt
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« Reply #46 on: December 31, 2013, 04:20:10 PM »

Doesn't have one of those honked up file names. Is this because it's a direct post? Is this actually linked from the draft pages?


Is the NRA badge the correct badge?
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Devil Doc
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« Reply #47 on: December 31, 2013, 04:22:23 PM »

Understood, Weigh-Ins are done in Uniform? I am glad they finally but that reg in there, but... Will the SC and WC follow suite?
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Captain Brandon P. Smith CAP
Former HM3, U.S NAVY
Too many Awards, Achievments and Qualifications to list.

NIN
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 4,997
Unit: of issue

« Reply #48 on: December 31, 2013, 04:26:34 PM »

Understood, Weigh-Ins are done in Uniform?

I really don't want to see you in your skivvies. :)
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Darin Ninness, Lt Col, CAP
Sq Bubba, Wing Dude, National Guy
I like to have Difficult Adult Conversations™
The contents of this post are Copyright © 2007-2018 by NIN. All rights are reserved. Specific permission is given to quote this post here on CAP-Talk only.
Panache
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« Reply #49 on: December 31, 2013, 04:28:35 PM »

Thoughts:

Disappointed that you still can't wear the flight cap or military ribbons with the G/Ws.

Noticed that when ties are mentioned, all it says is "The tie will be either blue polyester or silk, herringbone twill."  So, does this mean it doesn't have to be "AF-Blue", and I can go out and get a 3rd-party navy blue tie that is actually long enough for me?

It now specifically says you can't wear cargo pants with the G/Ws.  Good.

It looks like four TOTAL bades, including aviation and specialty badges.

Quote
The total number of badges worn will not exceed four, to include the above-mentioned aviation and occupational badges.

So, one could wear Pilot Wings, GTL Badge, Command Badge and 1 Specialty track badge. Or, GTM badge and 3 Specialty track badges. Does that sound right?

Yeah, further down (4.2.5.3.3) when describing the G/W's, it specifically says that the command pin doesn't count as one of the four.  So that would lead me to believe that wings and "occupational qualification" badges count.

Noticed that the blue "CAP" embroidered cut-outs are no longer required with the majority of USAF and the one or two Corporate-style jacket you can wear rank insignia with.  (Still required with the Gortex jacket).

As mentioned before, it seems that the namestapes and embroidered rank insignia for the BBDUs and blue flight uniform has been changed to a dark blue (navy?) background, with white lettering on the tapes.  Woodland camo BDUs keep the ultramarine background, probably to prevent everybody from going out and spending money on changing things on a uniform that will probably go into phase-out.

SMWOG's who wear the G/W's or BBDUS simply don't wear any sort of grade insignia.  Apparently if wearing AF-Blues, officer-trainees will wear blank gray CAP rank epaulettes while NCO-trainees will wear "plain" blue shirts.  Both (officer and NCO "trainees") will wear white embroidered CAP cut-outs on ultramarine background when wearing woodland BDUs.
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NIN
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« Reply #50 on: December 31, 2013, 04:29:12 PM »

8.2.3 - People wearing the green flight suit are still stuck with plastic-encased rank insignia, without the option for embroidered insignia.

It was determined that going to the USAF and asking for changes to the USAF-style FDU was not a good idea at this time.
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Darin Ninness, Lt Col, CAP
Sq Bubba, Wing Dude, National Guy
I like to have Difficult Adult Conversations™
The contents of this post are Copyright © 2007-2018 by NIN. All rights are reserved. Specific permission is given to quote this post here on CAP-Talk only.
NIN
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« Reply #51 on: December 31, 2013, 04:30:43 PM »

Thoughts:

Disappointed that you still can't wear the flight cap or military ribbons with the G/Ws.


You shouldn't wear military ribbons on non-military clothing. Simple as that. G/Ws are not a military uniform.  More or less the same goes for the flight cap. You're mixing military and civilian clothing. (seriously)

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Darin Ninness, Lt Col, CAP
Sq Bubba, Wing Dude, National Guy
I like to have Difficult Adult Conversations™
The contents of this post are Copyright © 2007-2018 by NIN. All rights are reserved. Specific permission is given to quote this post here on CAP-Talk only.
Walkman
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Kris Walker Photography
« Reply #52 on: December 31, 2013, 04:34:26 PM »

Apparently if wearing AF-Blues, officer-trainees will wear blank gray CAP rank epaulettes while NCO-trainees will wear "plain" blue shirts.

Where did you find that? I was looking for that earlier after NIN's comment and couldn't find it. I actually made that mistake when I first joined. I read the regs wrong and saw that there was a blank gray rank slide from Vanguard and ordered it for my Class B's and then found out it was meant for NCOs.
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Devil Doc
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« Reply #53 on: December 31, 2013, 04:34:59 PM »

Thoughts:


Yeah, further down (4.2.5.3.3) when describing the G/W's, it specifically says that the command pin doesn't count as one of the four.  So that would lead me to believe that wings and "occupational qualification" badges count.

Noticed that the blue "CAP" embroidered cut-outs are no longer required with the majority of USAF and the one or two Corporate-style jacket you can wear rank insignia with.  (Still required with the Gortex jacket).

As mentioned before, it seems that the namestapes and embroidered rank insignia for the BBDUs and blue flight uniform has been changed to a dark blue (navy?) background, with white lettering on the tapes.  Woodland camo BDUs keep the ultramarine background, probably to prevent everybody from going out and spending money on changing things on a uniform that will probably go into phase-out.

SMWOG's who wear the G/W's or BBDUS simply don't wear any sort of grade insignia.  Apparently if wearing AF-Blues, officer-trainees will wear blank gray CAP rank epaulettes while NCO-trainees will wear "plain" blue shirts.  Both (officer and NCO "trainees") will wear white embroidered CAP cut-outs on ultramarine background when wearing woodland BDUs.
[/quote]

I actually wore no rank on my BDUs for awhile, I dont wear alot of Fru Fru Badges/Patches on my BDU. Im not big into rank either.  I was told I had to sow on the "Butter Bar", Per my SC stated "You want to be an good example for cadets" So... Its on there now.
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Captain Brandon P. Smith CAP
Former HM3, U.S NAVY
Too many Awards, Achievments and Qualifications to list.

Panache
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 1,060
Unit: PAWG

« Reply #54 on: December 31, 2013, 04:35:34 PM »

You shouldn't wear military ribbons on non-military clothing. Simple as that. G/Ws are not a military uniform.  More or less the same goes for the flight cap. You're mixing military and civilian clothing. (seriously)

Understood, Colonel.  Still disappointed, none the less.   :-\
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Panache
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« Reply #55 on: December 31, 2013, 04:36:44 PM »

Apparently if wearing AF-Blues, officer-trainees will wear blank gray CAP rank epaulettes while NCO-trainees will wear "plain" blue shirts.

Where did you find that? I was looking for that earlier after NIN's comment and couldn't find it. I actually made that mistake when I first joined. I read the regs wrong and saw that there was a blank gray rank slide from Vanguard and ordered it for my Class B's and then found out it was meant for NCOs.

Section 1.4, page 12.
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Panache
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Unit: PAWG

« Reply #56 on: December 31, 2013, 04:42:32 PM »

Quote
1.4
Adults without Grade.
Adult individuals without grade will wear the dress uniform for the grade structure they are pursuing. Unit commanders will monitor new individualsto ensure they comply with
the requirements of this paragraph.

1.4.1
Adult individuals without Grade pursuing officer promotion will wear the USAF-style (except Mess Dress which is not authorized for individuals members without grade) or
Corporate-style uniform as for Officers without any grade insignia.

For example, these individuals will wear the officer-style service coat, with sleeve braid, officer style flight cap, US collar insignia, and gray epaulets without grade insignia.
On USAF-style Utility Uniforms (BDU), these individuals will wear light silver embroidered CAP insignia on blue cloth centered 1 inch from the bottom edge on both sides of the collar. On the
Corporate-style Field Uniform, no collar insignia or grade insignia on the hat will be worn. On the Aviator Combination Uniform, no grade insignia or collar devices will be worn.

1.4.2
Adult individuals without Grade pursuing NCO promotions based on prior military services will wear the USAF-style uniform (except Mess Dress which is not authorized for
individuals without grade) and Corporate uniforms as for NCOs without wearing any grade insignia.

For example, these individuals will wear the service coat without epaulets, flight cap with blue braid, CAP collar insignia, and no epaulets. On USAF-style Utility Uniforms (
BDU), these individuals will wear white embroidered CAP insignia on ultramarine blue cloth centered 1 inch from the bottom edge on both sides of the collar. On the Corporate-
style Field Uniform, no collar insignia or grade insignia on the hat will be worn. On the Aviator Combination Uniform, no grade insignia or collar devices will be worn.

Apparently I misread.  NCO-candidates wearing AF-blues will wear the CAP cut-outs.
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Eclipse
Too Much Free Time Award

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« Reply #57 on: December 31, 2013, 04:43:45 PM »

Grade on the dark blue flight suit is already dark blue cloth.
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A.Member
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Posts: 1,617

« Reply #58 on: December 31, 2013, 04:45:43 PM »

Only skimmed through it.

The one area that stands out as still needing attention is that of cold weather outer wear for BDUs.  I realize that 2/3rds of the country probably doesn't care about this all that much.  But the other 1/3rd care about it a lot. 

There is not a good, true cold weather outer garment solution for wear with BDUs.  The field jacket is not adequate for real cold weather climates in the North and they're not very readily available.  Gore-Tex jacket is too lightweight.
« Last Edit: December 31, 2013, 04:50:34 PM by A.Member » Logged
"For once you have tasted flight you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skywards, for there you have been and there you will long to return." - Leonardo da Vinci
Eclipse
Too Much Free Time Award

Posts: 29,270

« Reply #59 on: December 31, 2013, 04:47:16 PM »

Black Fleece for wear with Corporate-style working uniforms.

Tactical pants now explicitly authorized with golf shirt.
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