Missing Person Searches. Do we do them?

[CDCTF]

Question for all, just to satisfy my curiosity.

Does CAP participate in missing persons searches on any kind of frequent basis? It seems to me that in this nation, they happen quite a bit, with everyone and their brother marching through the woods looking. Is there a reason why CAP seems to be absent from these operations? Am I wrong? Just curious, it seems like something that would be relatively easy for us to do, and cheap as well. I would like to think that our ground teams are just a little more qualified than the local hunting club that shows up to help.

[RiverAux]

Yes, but it is very dependent on the availability of CAP ground teams, local laws, and local needs, and the interest of CAP units at the squadron, group, and wing level to spend the time developing the relationships necessary for us to get requested when such incidents take place.   There is a significant need in this area in most states that CAP could help fill, but we haven't made it a priority and as such, our participation is spotty.  I don't know of any Wings that really focus on this mission. 

[Eclipse]

Yes, we do them, some wings more then others.

As River says, the deployment can be very complicated because of that wing's state's politics.

[Storm Chaser]

There is a significant need in this area in most states that CAP could help fill, but we haven't made it a priority and as such, our participation is spotty.

That's because we're too busy discussing uniforms issues and NCO programs.

[ProdigalJim]

Virginia Wing does quite a few of them.

[Eclipse]

That's because we're too busy discussing uniforms issues and NCO programs.

Certainly 100% true, and true of all the baseline nonsense we are always having to re-discuss and re-teach
(not here, in person) because people can't be bothered, or value their opinion over getting something done.

Every minute wasted never comes back.

[CDCTF]

That's what I kind of thought, that it was more of a local level thing.

A big problem I think in a lot of squadrons is the "why are we here?" problem. Or more simply stated, "who do we help?". I think that if we did more of these simple "ES" operations, more cadets could feel as though they are relevant and actually serve a function. Even if they are not fully GTM qualified. Bottom of the line, small squadrons without a strong ES program, could really benefit from this, and the community would benefit as well.

Well, change starts with me I guess!

[Eclipse]

That's what I kind of thought, that it was more of a local level thing.

Local at the wing, generally not lower, at least in terms of being called out.  Establishing the relationships
with the agencies that might request help is going to be more local - usually Groups would work at the county
level, though the micro on that depends on your wing's plans and structure.

SAR is a mess of federal, state and local laws, policies and politics.  Most states require that any SAR
requests go through the state EMA (YMMV).  Generally you have to ask in the proper fashion and
indicate that your local resources are either exhausted or inadequate. 

It's entirely possible, and not uncommon,  that a local agency will request CAP's help, but the state's EMA
is not interested in making the calls to AFRCC, either because they have their own resources they want / need to use,
politics, or whoever answers the phone that day has never heard of CAP.  BTDT.

DR is a different beast, it's pretty much a piecemeal situation and anyone who needs us can call us direct (via the NOC).
Any federal funding would come through 1AF, but in a lot of case (most?) CAP DR support is customer-funded (ultimately
reimbursed through FEMA for large incidents).  These relationships almost always have to be established by the
local unit or group, and can be at any level the unit or echelon can support.

In some cases (many?) the wing may have corporate funds appropriated or donated to support DR, and in a lot of cases
DR is a little to no cost in which case the NOC can light up an unfunded C or B mission to get our people insurance coverage,
etc.  A lot of DR is just "people and effort".

Your people can't get involved until they are trained and at least marginally qualified.  So the first step is to get there
whatever it takes.  In parallel to that is to seek out the next echelon and discuss the wing's policies regarding who
establishes the relationships, what total force the wing has reasonably available, etc., etc.  Few units have the
ability to respond independently of support from other units or the wing.  Most wings these days do "wing-level" call-outs
for all missions for this reason.

[Private Investigator]

That's what I kind of thought, that it was more of a local level thing.

A big problem I think in a lot of squadrons is the "why are we here?" problem. Or more simply stated, "who do we help?". I think that if we did more of these simple "ES" operations, more cadets could feel as though they are relevant and actually serve a function. Even if they are not fully GTM qualified. Bottom of the line, small squadrons without a strong ES program, could really benefit from this, and the community would benefit as well.

Well, change starts with me I guess!

If a boy scout is "lost" and the scoutmaster calls you and you call up the chain of command. You will get a mission number and everyone gets reimburse for expenses and if you get seriously hurt you are insured. You do not get that mission number, 'you' are just the local hunting club out looking, saavy?   

[cap235629]

That's what I kind of thought, that it was more of a local level thing.

Local at the wing, generally not lower, at least in terms of being called out.  Establishing the relationships
with the agencies that might request help is going to be more local - usually Groups would work at the county
level, though the micro on that depends on your wing's plans and structure.

SAR is a mess of federal, state and local laws, policies and politics.  Most states require that any SAR
requests go through the state EMA (YMMV).  Generally you have to ask in the proper fashion and
indicate that your local resources are either exhausted or inadequate. 

It's entirely possible, and not uncommon,  that a local agency will request CAP's help, but the state's EMA
is not interested in making the calls to AFRCC, either because they have their own resources they want / need to use,
politics, or whoever answers the phone that day has never heard of CAP.  BTDT.

DR is a different beast, it's pretty much a piecemeal situation and anyone who needs us can call us direct (via the NOC).
Any federal funding would come through 1AF, but in a lot of case (most?) CAP DR support is customer-funded (ultimately
reimbursed through FEMA for large incidents).  These relationships almost always have to be established by the
local unit or group, and can be at any level the unit or echelon can support.

In some cases (many?) the wing may have corporate funds appropriated or donated to support DR, and in a lot of cases
DR is a little to no cost in which case the NOC can light up an unfunded C or B mission to get our people insurance coverage,
etc.  A lot of DR is just "people and effort".

Your people can't get involved until they are trained and at least marginally qualified.  So the first step is to get there
whatever it takes.  In parallel to that is to seek out the next echelon and discuss the wing's policies regarding who
establishes the relationships, what total force the wing has reasonably available, etc., etc.  Few units have the
ability to respond independently of support from other units or the wing.  Most wings these days do "wing-level" call-outs
for all missions for this reason.

Bob,

Unit level relationships are what drive our ES activities.  We have developed EXCELLENT working relationships with the Emergency Managers and Sheriff's in the the  county area I would call our "AO"  In fact, many a mission included a request for our SPECIFIC UNIT..... 

ALL CAP IS LOCAL!!!!!!!!!!!

[Eclipse]

^ I don't disagree - that won't change the state's laws in regards to SAR (and possibly DR) response.

We have a number of units who have first-name relationships with EMA managers and similar, yet
are still unable to provide support because of the way our states response framework is structured.

Local relationships are key, especially for DR, but for SAR as well, if they don't know about you, they won't know to call,
but make sure you understand who can call who and where the money is coming from.

[cap235629]

^ I don't disagree - that won't change the state's laws in regards to SAR (and possibly DR) response.

We have a number of units who have first-name relationships with EMA managers and similar, yet
are still unable to provide support because of the way our states response framework is structured.

Local relationships are key, especially for DR, but for SAR as well, if they don't know about you, they won't know to call,
but make sure you understand who can call who and where the money is coming from.

I have yet to come across an actual SAR, ground or air, that the AFRCC has not footed the bill for.  The key has to be "preservation of life".  Our Comprehensive Emergency Response Plan in Arkansas mentions CAP in 11 of the 14 ESF functions.  The key is to make sure the LOCAL agencies know of our TRUE capabilities and consider us a LOCAL asset as opposed to a "partner".....

[Private Investigator]

I have yet to come across an actual SAR, ground or air, that the AFRCC has not footed the bill for.  The key has to be "preservation of life".  Our Comprehensive Emergency Response Plan in Arkansas mentions CAP in 11 of the 14 ESF functions.  The key is to make sure the LOCAL agencies know of our TRUE capabilities and consider us a LOCAL asset as opposed to a "partner".....

I am not sure if we are talking apples and oranges. I would say in my state it is 90% AFRCC paying the bills. The lost boy scout and lost hikers had State EMA mission numbers. So I am guessing the Sheriff called the state capital instead of AFRCC.   

[Eclipse]

^ I don't disagree - that won't change the state's laws in regards to SAR (and possibly DR) response.

We have a number of units who have first-name relationships with EMA managers and similar, yet
are still unable to provide support because of the way our states response framework is structured.

Local relationships are key, especially for DR, but for SAR as well, if they don't know about you, they won't know to call,
but make sure you understand who can call who and where the money is coming from.

I have yet to come across an actual SAR, ground or air, that the AFRCC has not footed the bill for.  The key has to be "preservation of life".  Our Comprehensive Emergency Response Plan in Arkansas mentions CAP in 11 of the 14 ESF functions.  The key is to make sure the LOCAL agencies know of our TRUE capabilities and consider us a LOCAL asset as opposed to a "partner".....

As I mentioned in the PM I sent you - if the state law says all SAR goes via the state's EMA, and the state's EMA is not interested in either responding at all, or requesting CAP,
it won't matter how local your contacts are, you won't go.

I agree completely that local relationships are important, but they don't trump local law and politics.  My state's plan specifically call's out CAP for >AIR< SAR, but says nothing
about ground / missing persons.

[SARDOC]

Virginia Wing does quite a few of them.

I wish we did more of them.  There are a lot more but because they deal with "despondent" subjects we don't get the green light.  I do like the fact that anytime the state EOC activates ESF#9 we get a call.  Huge step in the right direction.

[CDCTF]

What I meant by "change starts with me" and "local" was trying to work within my group. We all know wing is a bottomless pit 

But, I'm going to do my own research and start asking my chain of command how we can as a unit and as a group be more helpful to our communities. Basically, let's get moving and let's get this done at the lowest (most local) level possible. I realize that mission number really covers us and sanctions our activity. Always, always, always, CYA.

[ProdigalJim]

Virginia Wing does quite a few of them.

I wish we did more of them.  There are a lot more but because they deal with "despondent" subjects we don't get the green light.  I do like the fact that anytime the state EOC activates ESF#9 we get a call.  Huge step in the right direction.

Yep. Col. Carter made tremendous strides in getting us into the mix and restoring relations. Relationships plus credible response goes a long way towards getting us called again.