private pilots license

[luv2fly97]

Is there a way to get a pilots license through CAP?

[SarDragon]

Maybe.

There are solo course summer activities, and if you live close to where a CAP plane is based, and have a willing CAP instructor you can get lessons. This will require a lot of work and commitment on your part.

[Flying Pig]

A pertinent question is are you a cadet or senior?  The paths would be different.  There are options available to cadets that are not open to Seniors. 

[SarDragon]

The OP's profile gives an age of 16.

[sparks]

A cadet can receive Pivate Pilot training in a CAP aircraft, senior members can't. As stated before, access to a CAP aircraft and a willing instructor would have to be worked out. The student is responsible for flight time, fuel and other costs of getting a Private Pilot License, not cheap. The specifics of the regulation are supplied below for the curious;

CAPR 60-1 states "2-8. Pilot Training.
a. CAP cadets and qualified SAR/DR mission pilots are authorized to use CAP airplanes for flight instruction toward any FAA certificate or rating.
b. All CAP members are authorized to use CAP gliders for flight instruction toward any FAA certificate or rating.
c. CAP senior members that are not current SAR/DR mission pilots must obtain permission to receive flight instruction in CAP airplanes toward FAA certificates or ratings as follows:
(1) Senior members who hold a Private Pilot Airplane Certificate or higher and have been an active CAP member for at least 1 year – wing commander written permission.
(2) All other senior members – Written permission from the wing commander, region commander and the CAP Chief Operating Officer is required and may be granted provided the member lives more than two hours driving time from a commercial training facility.
d. For C182 airplanes, a student pilot must obtain the written permission of their wing or region commander to train in a specific C182 airplane and with a specific flight instructor. Such permission may be granted for multiple flights (including all the flights needed to complete private pilot flight training). Any change of flight instructor or C182 airplane used will require another written permission be obtained by the student."

[mdickinson]

Read this:
http://captalk.net/index.php?topic=15686.msg284791#msg284791
in which I outline all the costs associated with earning your Private Pilot Certificate (not "private pilots license") through CAP.

There are also valuable comments and sage advice from other CAP CFIs in that thread.

[Flying Pig]

You outlined that a private airplane rating is over $14,000???   What the heck is going on in CT?  If your private exceeds $80000 you need to do some serious soul searching.  A very large helicopter and airplane 141 school I worked with in CA offers a private airplane for $7500 and that includes housing for 8 weeks.  Another school I taught at, we could do it for about $7000.  Geeeeeeeez...... I did my private helicopter for about $11K.  You said in your initial post that those were your numbers, so they are what they are......but wow!

[SunDog]

As a CAP member, you are probably eligible to join a DoD (or other agency) aero club/flying club. If there is a military base near you, might be worth looking into. You'll save a TON on instruction and aircrfaft rental.

But don't assume it has to be on a USAF base, or located on a military base - NSA has a club, the Naval Academy has one at a local civilian airport, Army has clubs, etc.

Membership charters vary - but most are pretty liberally - many will take a local first responder, such as a police officer, firefighter, etc., in addition to military members and agency civilians.

Good luck!

[PHall]

As a CAP member, you are probably eligible to join a DoD (or other agency) aero club/flying club. If there is a military base near you, might be worth looking into. You'll save a TON on instruction and aircrfaft rental.

But don't assume it has to be on a USAF base, or located on a military base - NSA has a club, the Naval Academy has one at a local civilian airport, Army has clubs, etc.

Membership charters vary - but most are pretty liberally - many will take a local first responder, such as a police officer, firefighter, etc., in addition to military members and agency civilians.

Good luck!

CAP members can join DoD Aero Clubs only if the club they want to join will accept them.
It's up to each club, there is no blanket policy...
So if you want to join a club you need to call them and find out if they will accept you as a member.

[mdickinson]

You outlined that a private airplane rating is over $14,000???   What the heck is going on in CT?

First of all, the airport in question is not in CT, it's in New York. Several factors contribute to the high cost of flying there. It's very close to NYC, and as such is a very expensive place to keep an airplane. Also, the flight school there went high-end a few year back, with all new Cessnas. That means it's no longer possible to rent a plane that's not G1000 equipped... which means C-172 rentals start at $169/hour. They don't post the rates on their web site any more, but you can see the rental fleet: http://www.flypfs.com/air_rental.html  And finally, this place is a snazzy corporate FBO, not your average flight school. See pics at http://panoramaflightservice.com/ Their fuel price at the moment is $6.86 per gallon. So to sum up: This is far from the average place to learn to fly.

[Edit: I do not offer up the figures in the referenced post as average figures. They are, however, the only figures I have, since that's the only airport where I have taught CAP cadets for their private certificate. More important is the downloadable spreadsheet I provided in the post - which allows you to enter in the exact prices at your local flight school.]

If your private exceeds $80000 you need to do some serious soul searching.

I can't help but wonder where you plucked that $80,000 figure from. My private training was twenty years ago, when I could rent a Cherokee for $40/hour wet, and fuel was $1.75/gallon. Today's cadets don't have that option.

If you meant $8,000 as some sort of never-exceed figure for the cost of private pilot training, you may be a few years behind the times, since the current rental, fuel, and dual prices at most airports mean it's not possible to earn the private for less than $8,000.

A very large helicopter and airplane 141 school I worked with in CA offers a private airplane for $7500 and that includes housing for 8 weeks.  Another school I taught at, we could do it for about $7000.

I wonder how recent those cost figures are that you're offering up. My guess is they are dated - perhaps from days when avgas was $4 per gallon. Not that it matters; I don't know any CAP cadets who have the option to jet out to California and stay in flight-school housing for 8 weeks. If they are going to learn how to fly, they are going to do it at the local airport. I was glad to offer them a lower-cost option through CAP, even though it was a big time commitment on my part, because it put the private certificate in reach of a bunch of dedicated young men who would not otherwise have been able to do it.

Sadly, the CAP unit based there went from 16 pilots and 4 CFIs (a few years ago) to 2 pilots and zero CFIs (last fall) due to some unfortunate command decisions. So whereas a few years back we had three cadets earn their private certificates in one year, right now the local cadets can choose to spend $15,000 at the local FBO, or put their dreams on hold until they move somewhere with more reasonable rates.

[SarDragon]

The wet rates mdickinson listed are a little high for my area (San Diego), but everything else is pretty much in line with the local rates at flight schools.

[Eclipse]

Sadly, the CAP unit based there went from 16 pilots and 4 CFIs (a few years ago) to 2 pilots and zero CFIs (last fall) due to some unfortunate command decisions. So whereas a few years back we had three cadets earn their private certificates in one year, right now the local cadets can choose to spend $15,000 at the local FBO, or put their dreams on hold until they move somewhere with more reasonable rates.

Or participate in one of several powered flight academies for under $1000 including lodging.
You've also got $1000 for ground school, which can be taken at a community college for 1/2 that or less, and
at least in my state, at those dusty airstrips, there's plenty of places to rent aircraft for $100 and hourwet
depending on gas prices that day.  New glass 172s?  No.  Steam gauge 150s.

Not everyone, even in the NYC area needs to go to a "corporate FBO" most new student pilots are perfectly
fine with the "dusty sheds".  If you're happy with that and have the means, good on 'ye, but characterizing
that situation as the "typical" cost to learn to fly, is kinda like giving Mid-Town Manhattan prices to someone
looking for their first apartment.

You've also got $1000 for ground school, which can be taken at a community college for 1/2 that or less, and
at least in my state, at those dusty airstrips, there's plenty of places to rent aircraft for under $100 wet
depending on gas prices that day.

AOPA's current estimate on their FAQ page is $5000-9000 depending on aptitude and rating pursued.
Which is pretty much what the flight schools in my state quote.

[FlyingThorn]

I think now might as well be good enough a time to break my silence and make my first post. Piggyback on this thread seeing as its already here and I'm about to dump 10k on a private through my University.
At what point does a CAP member become eligible for such rates? I seem to remember after 1 year of membership? I'm not going to be joining up just to save some cash of course, and I plan to join regardless of where I end up pursuing it.

[Eclipse]

At what point does a CAP member become eligible for such rates? I seem to remember after 1 year of membership?

There is no set time period.
In order to rent CAP aircraft a member must be a licensed pilot with a current medical and have passed a Form 5 checkride.

It's possible to do that the day after your background check clears and your membership becomes active.

[FalconHatTrick]

To echo what mdickinson said. 

I work at a flight school in Northern NJ.  We are only 20 miles outside NYC.  I understand that based on your location learning to fly could vary by thousands of dollars.  We normally tell students to expect to spend $13,000-$16,000.  The typical $7,000 - $8,000 is normally based off of the minimum 35 hours for Part 141 or 40 hours for Part 61.  Unfortunately the national average is 60-80 hours for a Private Certificate.  So based at the minimum of the National Average, here is rough pricing for my flight school.

In our cheapest airplane: C172P @ $125 per hour wet
Aircraft Rental $125x60 hours = $7,500
Instructor $60x60 hours = $3,000
Ground School $50x30 hours = $1,500
Examiner's Fee = $400
Total = $12,400 plus misc stuff (headsets, gadgets, FAA exams, more training)

Our most expensive airplane: C172SP G-1000 @ $165 per hour wet
Aircraft Rental $165x60 hours = $9,900
Instructor $60x60 hours = $3,000
Ground School $50x30 hours = $1,500
Examiner's Fee = $400
Total = $14,800 plus misc stuff (headsets, gadgets, FAA exams, more training)

Obviously if you do it in less time it will be cheaper, but also if you need more training it will be more expensive. Just like anything else, YMMV. 

[mdickinson]

Or participate in one of several powered flight academies for under $1000 including lodging.

Yes! I always recommend this route to any CAP cadet interested in flight training.

I've taught at two national flight academies and one wing flight academy, and both gave phenomenal value for the money. Definitely the best way to jump-start your training - and also to get a taste of the fire-hose method of learning that might predict success in future endeavors like USAF pilot training. If you're 14 or 15, attend a glider flight academy; if you're 16 or over, attend a powered flight academy.

One of the cadets that I worked with to get his private through CAP started out by soloing at a wing flight academy, then did his private with me during the fall. A year later he was at the Air Force Academy, and four years after that entered USAF pilot training. now I keep up with his progress from occasional Facebook photo posts like this one (from his solo in a T-6 a few months back). Makes a flight instructor proud!

CAP flight academy graduate:

[Mitchell 1969]

Of absolutely no value to the discussion, other than nostalgia:

In 1970, I soloed through a CAP nationally funded program. NHQ paid 1/3, Wing paid 1/3, squadron paid 1/3. That gave me a total of 15 hours, including soloing at 6.5 (flying every day from an uncontrolled field).

That was followed by becoming one of about 100 cadets who attended "Cadet Flying Encampment License" every year. We were divided into 4 sessions, running two at a time, one at Oklahoma State and the other at University of Oklahoma.

Billeting was in dorms. Flying was every weekday. Ground school every weekday evening for the first two weeks. At the end of four weeks, we had Airman's Certificates as Private Pilot, airplane, single engine, land.

Total out of pocket - cost of a plotter, cost of an E6B, quarters for the laundry and $96 dollars for meals. About six weeks and  $130 TOTAL from zero-time to Private Pilot. 

Those were the days.