Search and Rescue in water?

[NJcadet]

I've been pondering this for a little while now, what kind of Search and Rescue sorties or emergency services efforts are CAP authorized to perform in water? I know that a common use for ELTs are for boats, and after researching fundraising, there is a specific section for donations of watercraft.

Basically, is CAP authorized to work in the water, and if so, is it common?

[Archer]

I recall reading in Volunteer a while ago about CAP assets working the SAR of a downed bird in water. I think it was solely air-recon that was preformed in that case.

[MIKE]

While one of my non-distress finds was an EPIRB at a marina, if the vessel is not moored at a marina or shrink wrapped in someones yard... There is another federal agency that is equipped for such a case, the USCG.  And being that we are now in the days of 406 MHz EPIRBs the need for CAP to DF one should be slim to none.

[lordmonar]

I remember someone telling me that at Airventure they had a boat with a rescue diver for a lake there on the airport.

But as far a I can see....there is no reason why we could not do water borne search.....although it is a little outside of area of competency.  A great oportunity to get with the local CG or CGAUX to see if we could so some join SAR.

[NJcadet]

But as far a I can see....there is no reason why we could not do water borne search.....although it is a little outside of area of competency.  A great oportunity to get with the local CG or CGAUX to see if we could so some join SAR.

That's exactly what I was thinking, it may be a little out of our operating competency but there's no harm in training. Honestly, 90% of SAR missions are training now anyway xD

Also the chances of a CAP ground team getting sent out alone, meaning not with any local police fire or other search organization is slim to none. The Coast Guard and CGaux are obviously very skilled at this type of SAR and I think they would work well with CAP.

[SarDragon]

Here in CA, it's pretty much as MIKE described. I have a marina find myself. I was involved in another mission where we made the determination that the target (ended up being an EPIRB) was NOT ashore. The CG ended up retrieving it about half a mile offshore. The best we can do, given current tasking limitations, is what we are doing. I don't see any additional tasking coming.

[Critical AOA]

Another reason to go for my seaplane rating!

But this brings up some very, very important questions. 

Will the CAP folks assigned to watercraft have a special uniform?  Khaki shorts & deck shoes?

Would the member in charge of the boat be called Captain even if he /she did not hold that actual rank?

Would crew have to say "aye aye cap'n" rather than "yes sir?"

Would we then have a SEAL school as well as a Ranger school?

Important stuff here. 

[Flying Pig]

Sounds like it could be an interesting GT mission.  What if the mission required crossing a lake or other body of water to continue the mission.  I was told this week that several years ago here in FL an aircraft ELT was DF'd to a large inland lake and the aircraft, helicopter I believe, was found about 3ft below the surface with the deceased crew still inside.  Ill try to research the detail.  I was told it was an LE or EMS helo. 

Would you do it in Mojave?  No.... but after spending the last week flying in FL at 500' I could most definitely see it being a skill set. 

[lordmonar]

Also not just for ELT searches...but for missing people on or around lakes.....especially for those states with lots of lakes or shorelines....being able to search from boats (not a water search but a land search from boats), insertion to search location via boats, and supporting ground teams with boat would be an interesting thing to have as an add on rating to Ground Teams.....AS Flying Pig said....not required for everyone...but added where/as needed.

[RiverAux]

The legislation that authorizes CAP is broad enough that we probably could get involved in it.  However, the most useful type of waterborne SAR is probably swiftwater rescue, but that has such a high degree of danger that I don't see CAP getting involved in it. 

And seeing as how there is another nationwide paramilitary volunteer organization that does some degree of water SAR already, that niche is probably filled.

Maybe someday we'll actually make ground SAR a priority...

[Spaceman3750]

Around here, water missing person searches are done with water HRD dogs and divers... We have neither.

[Flying Pig]

The legislation that authorizes CAP is broad enough that we probably could get involved in it.  However, the most useful type of waterborne SAR is probably swiftwater rescue, but that has such a high degree of danger that I don't see CAP getting involved in it. 

And seeing as how there is another nationwide paramilitary volunteer organization that does some degree of water SAR already, that niche is probably filled.

Maybe someday we'll actually make ground SAR a priority...

Im a Swift Water Tech....  That being said.... NOT something CAP needs to be involved in. The degree of training, gear and equipment and continued training is immense.  Now.... my SWT experience was on the Kings River and in the large canals, Friant-Kern, etc.  Maybe other places have a different definition of "swift water".  No joke, probably the only training Ive ever attended where I really asked myself, "is this for me?"  And Im a guy who trained for the Alcatraz swim and who can swim 4000-5000 yrds with no breaks.

[EMT-83]

Earlier this year, I was able to use my GBD skills to coordinate a water search for my fire department. While not a CAP mission, there are similarities.

A local hunter had gone out to his favorite duck hunting spot and never returned home. His wife called 911 and the state police showed up to investigate. They screwed around for about 3 hours, including canines and putting a trooper alone in a boat, at night with no PFD. No luck, so they decided to let the dumb firemen give it a try.

I approached the IC to offer my thoughts on the search, and was immediately put in charge of the operation. I set it up like a CAP search; a team to do a hasty search around the perimeter, and two boats (borrowed from neighbors) in the water doing a grid search. We located the victim, unfortunately deceased, in less than 20 minutes.

We weren't specifically trained in water SAR, but were able to adopt our training and accomplish the mission.

[lordmonar]

The bad part of your story.....is that...those are not GBD skills....but Planning Section Skills. 

but yes......for the most part CAP ES is based on real world operations....and yes believe it or not sometime CAP is actually good at doing these things.

SAR is a secondary job to most LE/FD organizations.  And some of these organizations just don't exercise as much as they should.

And to restate what I said before and to reinforce what River Aux said.   There maybe someone in your AOR who already does this.
Get with them and see how we can complement each other. 

The local GCAUX may be all fired up for looking for missing/stranded boats and MOB situations....they may never have considered how they may support a lost person or downed aircraft search.  Likewise we may never has considered what happens when a hiker or aircraft is down in a lake environment.

As for Swift Water.....I agree.....probably not something CAP needs to get into.....much like High Angle Rescue......but that is not what the OP was asking about......I don't think. 

[Woodsy]

I can think of 2 REDCAPS in FLWG within the past year where members ended up in boats.

Last summer while performing an over-water mission for a missing teen swimmer who was caught in a rip current, we had a CAP member on board the Sheriff's Office boat to act as a comms relay.  Their radios wouldn't talk to our CAP radios in the plane, so we put a Liaison Officer who had a portable CAP radio on board to coordinate.  Worked well. 

Earlier this year, a plane went down in some thick swampland in south Florida a mile from solid ground, but too thick with tree cover for helicopter ops.  The ELT was pinging and a LE agency (can't remember if it was local or Fish and Wildlife) asked a ground  team to join them in their air boat with DF equipment to get to the scene.  That was the incident where 3 descendants of Buffalo Bill Cody of Cody, WY were killed. 

I don't see a need for CAP to have boats, be a primary user of them, or train for operating them, but there is a possibility that members may be called on to be a PASSENGER on a vessel during a mission. 

[Woodsy]

Here in CA, it's pretty much as MIKE described. I have a marina find myself. I was involved in another mission where we made the determination that the target (ended up being an EPIRB) was NOT ashore. The CG ended up retrieving it about half a mile offshore. The best we can do, given current tasking limitations, is what we are doing. I don't see any additional tasking coming.

Had a similar issue here.  Got an ELT mission based on airborne reports which turned out to be an EPIRB on a vessel adrift just off the coast.  Turns out the vessel had an emergency the day before and the CG had pulled the crew off but hadn't secured the boat. 

[Huey Driver]

So far, my finds have all been on/around marinas. We have a Coast Guard Station right nearby, and if we targeted the signal to a moored boat off the dock, we'd call the Station and we'd go out to the moored boat with them.

[TarRiverRat]

My squadron, Tar River, has had a marina find and of all places, on a Coast Guard Cutter.  Our air crew located the area and did several passes over the cutter.  They then landed and did a ground search of where they believed same was coming from and it was the Cutter.  The CG was notified and they advised that it was not them but then the EPIRB mysteriously disappeared.  They finally let the ground team on board and what had happened was the bracket for the EPIRB had failed and someone had packed PFD's under it to hold it up and it had shifted setting off the alert.

[TarRiverRat]

Sounds like it could be an interesting GT mission.  What if the mission required crossing a lake or other body of water to continue the mission. 

During Floyd, aka the Great Flood of 99, my squadron used boats and helicopters in that mission.  I was the GTL for that mission.  It was quite interesting.

[TarRiverRat]

I know during WWII CAP used air boats and possibly other boats for SAR.  I saw a comic strip from Zack Moseley that had a CAP Air boat with CAP markings on it.  I always thought that would be interesting in doing that in CAP now.