CAP budget for dummies

[Eclipse]

Maybe someone can explain just what was approved and passed for CAP?

I read one article that said that the whole $31M had been approved, then another message that it was only $28M (is that the sequestered $31M?), then recently it's only $22M and NHQ may need to RIF additional staff.

I can't seem to find a definitive number anywhere (maybe one doesn't exist? Is it still gray?)

[NCRblues]

I've been looking into this as well.

According to the library of congress " bill tracker", HR 933 was fully acccepted by both house and senate and sent to the desk of POTUS as written ( with 11 amendments, none of which limited CAP funding). It was enacted into law by POTUS signature on the 26th of March, with no line item or outright veto, making it law of the land.

My wing sent out an email saying NHQ was having to let some workers go, and that vehicle maintanence funds were on hold from NHQ/AF.

Now, we got our full funding according to US law, so why are we shuttering?

[a2capt]

Because they are freaked out about the coming year?

.. is this "use it, or lose it" type funding?

Which that in and of itself is something I have not understood. "You can't save money, if you don't use it, we take it back". What lesson does that teach?

Well, I guess they don't want a ton of honey pots sitting at various organizations perhaps .. but .. why shed now then?

Tossing out knowledge and experience, some of which goes back quite a few years..

[Garibaldi]

The thing that always puzzled me was that back in the day, if one squadron had a lot of money due to its own fund raising efforts, and another squadron had just what was given to them, either Wing or National could simply take all that money from Rich Unit and either give it to Poor Unit or redistribute the money across the board, or keep it. Sounds like the worst form of _____ism there is to me, although I don't think that ______ism applies (fill in your own blanks) in the "corporate" world.

[jimmydeanno]

then recently it's only $22M and NHQ may need to RIF additional staff.

NHQ has already laid off staff, late last week, between 20 & 30 personnel. 

[a2capt]

Areas that were hit at NHQ: SE, CP, AE(x2), LG(x3), NOC, Member services, Finance, Printing/Publications (x3) and Shipping.  14 less, and 4 vacant positions not to be filled. When I was there for NSC in 2011, it was evident that the workforce was slim then. What about now?

[arajca]

Sounds like the worst form of _____ism there is to me, although I don't think that ______ism applies (fill in your own blanks) in the "corporate" world.

You wanna bet. I deal with it every year. Dept A gets budget approved for all its operations. Dept B doesn't get full budget because of over-budgeting. VP X likes Dept B manager, so money gets moved from Dept A to Dept B without notice. Dept A finds out when they get over-budget notices with subsequent disciplinary action.

[Ned]

The thing that always puzzled me was that back in the day, if one squadron had a lot of money due to its own fund raising efforts, and another squadron had just what was given to them, either Wing or National could simply take all that money from Rich Unit and either give it to Poor Unit or redistribute the money across the board, or keep it. Sounds like the worst form of _____ism there is to me, although I don't think that ______ism applies (fill in your own blanks) in the "corporate" world.

Maj Estes,

This is a pretty good example of a "CAP Urban Legand" that is both misleading to the membership and actually does a significant disservice to CAP when placed in a public place (like CAPTalk) where it can be read by potential donors who may be discouraged from donating to local units.

Initially, of course, it sounds like we agree that there is only one CAP corporation which owns all corporate assets and also safeguards and spends appropriated dollars provided by the Congress and taxpayers for specific purposes.  Local CAP members do not "legally own" the corporate funds in their care at the squadron.  All CAP assets belong to CAP, Inc, a Congressionally-chartered non-profit corporation headquartered in Montgomery, Alabama.

But far more importantly, the fact the CAP could move funds around in the manner you describe is logically unrelated to whether it has ever happened or is likely to happen in the future.

Because as a practical matter, it simply doesn't.   There is no leader worth her salt that would take the actions you describe.  Because there is no reason to do so, and a lot of very good reasons not to do so.

(Sure, if a unit goes inactive or is de-chartered, CAP will have to take control of the assets just like if a local JC Penny store closed, the district folks would make sure that everything JC Penny owns is accounted for and transferred elsewhere in the corporation.)

By way of comparison, commanders also have the power to transfer members (our most important asset) from unit to unit.  But we don't spend a lot of time worrying about whether evil wing and region commanders will arbitrarily transfer everyone in your unit to some other unit 400 miles away on a whim.  Because it simply doesn't happen.  Mostly because there is no reason to do it and a lot of very good reasons not to do so.

But the most important thing is the effect of this kind of statement on potential donors.  If a local unit is actively fundraising and has contacted a potential donor for a contribution, the donor is likely to do a little internet searching on us before giving us a significant donation.

And they may well come across your statement or something similar.  And any reasonable donor is going to think twice before giving $500 to a local unit to help send cadets to encampment (or whatever) if they see that Evil National Headquarters is simply going to snatch the money away and waste it elsewhere.

If you have concerns that assets may be transferred inappropriately from one unit to another, I urge you to speak directly with the commanders involved.  They need to hear about your concerns, and you need to hear their responses.

I'm confident you will be pleasently surprised.

Thank you for your generous donations of time and treasure to CAP.  They are truly appreciated.

Really.

Ned Lee

[Eclipse]

Thanks, Ned - beat me to it.

Back on track.

How much did funding did CAP get approved?

What does that mean in real money?

Does that amount then get sequestered to 80% or whathaveyou?

[Ned]

How much did funding did CAP get approved?

What does that mean in real money?

Does that amount then get sequestered to 80% or whathaveyou?

There have been a lot of memos flying back and forth in the last month or so describing the technical effects and procedures of the sequester and it's effect on the FY '13 and '14 budgets - both corporate and appropriated.

I doubt I can do any better in explaining it at this point than the background papers to the BoG agenda linked above.

Tomorrow night I will physically be in Atlanta hearing from the audit committee and should be able to formulate a better response.

[jhsmith400]

Sounds like scuttlebutt, who knows even the folks in the know may not till the cash isn't there look at the Blue Angels they started their season as if they had funding now they are scrubbed, it happens it will happen, and it has happened in the past.  We as CAP have been this route before and will again and we have and will survive.  My question is why does Sen. McCain dislike(or at least seems to) CAP so much, it seems like anytime he gets a chance he tries to ding us, is this a Navy vs A.F. thing in his mind?

[Garibaldi]

Sounds like scuttlebutt, who knows even the folks in the know may not till the cash isn't there look at the Blue Angels they started their season as if they had funding now they are scrubbed, it happens it will happen, and it has happened in the past.  We as CAP have been this route before and will again and we have and will survive.  My question is why does Sen. McCain dislike(or at least seems to) CAP so much, it seems like anytime he gets a chance he tries to ding us, is this a Navy vs A.F. thing in his mind?

I don't think he dislikes CAP per se, it just seems that in his mind we would be better off with our budget coming out of a non-combatant organization. The Coast Guard is part of the Treasury Department and I guess it would seem to him that we perform much the same mission.

[jhsmith400]

Sounds like scuttlebutt, who knows even the folks in the know may not till the cash isn't there look at the Blue Angels they started their season as if they had funding now they are scrubbed, it happens it will happen, and it has happened in the past.  We as CAP have been this route before and will again and we have and will survive.  My question is why does Sen. McCain dislike(or at least seems to) CAP so much, it seems like anytime he gets a chance he tries to ding us, is this a Navy vs A.F. thing in his mind?

I don't think he dislikes CAP per se, it just seems that in his mind we would be better off with our budget coming out of a non-combatant organization. The Coast Guard is part of the Treasury Department and I guess it would seem to him that we perform much the same mission.

Yeah, that maybe it, I suppose it could also be that he looks at us as (is common with some ex, and current military folks)has been or wannna be adults playing Air Force with kids, and doesn't see why the gov. should pay for it.  Either way it shows a sad miss-understanding of our niche in the world.

[RRLE]

The Coast Guard is part of the Treasury Department and I guess it would seem to him that we perform much the same mission.

The USCG has no been part of the Treasury Department since 1967 when it was moved to the new Department of Transportation (DOT). Since 2002, the USCG has been part of the Department of Homeland Security (DHS).

[Garibaldi]

The Coast Guard is part of the Treasury Department and I guess it would seem to him that we perform much the same mission.

The USCG has no been part of the Treasury Department since 1967 when it was moved to the new Department of Transportation (DOT). Since 2002, the USCG has been part of the Department of Homeland Security (DHS).

Brain slipped gears on me. Seriously, I wonder sometimes if I'm going senile. I meant DOT, not Treasury. I was thinking USSS I guess.

[JeffDG]

The Coast Guard is part of the Treasury Department and I guess it would seem to him that we perform much the same mission.

The USCG has no been part of the Treasury Department since 1967 when it was moved to the new Department of Transportation (DOT). Since 2002, the USCG has been part of the Department of Homeland Security (DHS).

Brain slipped gears on me. Seriously, I wonder sometimes if I'm going senile. I meant DOT, not Treasury. I was thinking USSS I guess.

USSS isn't in Treasury anymore either, they're part of DHS now.

[Patterson]

Seriously... Has anyone submitted a Cadet or Senior membership application within the past three weeks??  I sent five applications in over the course of one week, THREE WEEKS AGO!!  After calling down to Maxwell and being told only two had arrived I assumed it was the Postal delays that had caused the lag.  However, it has been three days and those two applications I was told had arrived have yet to be processed.

I am in no way angry or upset, just disappointed that CAP has yet to publish an announcement detailing what the budget situation has caused them to do to save money!! 

In a cost saving move, I suggest all business functions be examined by a volunteer group of CAP members who are not connected with or affiliated with National Headquarters or anyone Wing, Region or National Staff Officer. This group should be comprised of members that are small business owners and from different parts of the country.  Face it, CAP IS A BUSINESS!  Time to start treating it as such.  Evaluate the processes involved from the time a prospective member submits an application to the time they leave the program.

For starters, why are we still mailing a paper application?!?  A Squadron Commander accepts a prospective member, scans and uploads the paper application to a server, a clerk verifies all boxes are "checked" and pushes "membership approved button".  For payment of membership fees, that system already exists in eServices. Guess what?  The document upload feature already exists in eServices!!  Granted this is an easy transition for Cadet applications, Senior applications will need the FBI fingerprint card smoothed out, but that seems like something that currently is not processed by the FBI until after membership has already been "conditionally" approved.

Those of us who must continuously think about costs and profits everyday see failings in the CAP business practices. Some here will disagree with my point of view and argue heatedly, but anyone who is against reviewing business practices is either afraid of change, too lazy to change, just doesn't care or benefits from current costly practices and does not want to give up what they have.

[Al Sayre]

FWIW, here's how it was explained to me by a congressional staffer:

If the full budget wasn't passed, then it was a continuing resolution, basically an agreement to continue operating under the previous budget.  The actual budget submitted has 3 different amounts, House bill, Senate bill, and Presidential submission until it gets passed as law as agreed upon by all 3.  Under a continuing resolution, you get the lowest of the three numbers...

[JeffDG]

FWIW, here's how it was explained to me by a congressional staffer:

If the full budget wasn't passed, then it was a continuing resolution, basically an agreement to continue operating under the previous budget.  The actual budget submitted has 3 different amounts, House bill, Senate bill, and Presidential submission until it gets passed as law as agreed upon by all 3.  Under a continuing resolution, you get the lowest of the three numbers...

That said, what ended up passing was a CR for most of the Government, but an actual appropriations bill for Defense, VA, and one other that I don't recall off hand.

[abdsp51]

Seriously... Has anyone submitted a Cadet or Senior membership application within the past three weeks??  I sent five applications in over the course of one week, THREE WEEKS AGO!!  After calling down to Maxwell and being told only two had arrived I assumed it was the Postal delays that had caused the lag.  However, it has been three days and those two applications I was told had arrived have yet to be processed.

I am in no way angry or upset, just disappointed that CAP has yet to publish an announcement detailing what the budget situation has caused them to do to save money!! 

In a cost saving move, I suggest all business functions be examined by a volunteer group of CAP members who are not connected with or affiliated with National Headquarters or anyone Wing, Region or National Staff Officer. This group should be comprised of members that are small business owners and from different parts of the country.  Face it, CAP IS A BUSINESS!  Time to start treating it as such.  Evaluate the processes involved from the time a prospective member submits an application to the time they leave the program.

For starters, why are we still mailing a paper application?!?  A Squadron Commander accepts a prospective member, scans and uploads the paper application to a server, a clerk verifies all boxes are "checked" and pushes "membership approved button".  For payment of membership fees, that system already exists in eServices. Guess what?  The document upload feature already exists in eServices!!  Granted this is an easy transition for Cadet applications, Senior applications will need the FBI fingerprint card smoothed out, but that seems like something that currently is not processed by the FBI until after membership has already been "conditionally" approved.

Those of us who must continuously think about costs and profits everyday see failings in the CAP business practices. Some here will disagree with my point of view and argue heatedly, but anyone who is against reviewing business practices is either afraid of change, too lazy to change, just doesn't care or benefits from current costly practices and does not want to give up what they have.

Man, you rarely have anything positive to say about the organization. Whether you choose to acknowledge it or not CAP is not a business.  Now if you have a sound idea present it but keep your negativity and bias out of it.  At the end of the you coming here and bashing a process does not fix any issues nor does complaining and presenting you ever present negativity.  You don't like the process submit your suggestion for a change up the CoC and list the reasoning why this would be more efficient and worthwhile.  If you can't do that or start the process you will always be part of the problem.