Pledge of Allegiance Not Allowed?

[Private Investigator]

Recently I attended a SAREX in OKWG, and when a senior member suggested we should say the pledge of allegiance, etc,

In CAP you can tell what background people have. Somebody who spends way to much time with the Cadet side would want to do the pledge and maybe a prayer. Somebody who is an ES guy/gal will get right to their task.

Like somebody mentioned CAP should be standarized but I have been a member of several Squadrons and Groups and each had basically the same format just small differences.

[FW]

I was just thinking (I know it's dangerous)... I don't ever remember saying the pledge while serving in the Army while in uniform. However, at every wing, region and national CAP conference, the pledge was said after the posting of the colors.
Maybe we should start practicing what we preach (ref: CAPP 151) :angel:

[Devil Doc]

I believe in the pledge of allegance, we say it at every meeting, and then an prayer afterwards. We are also an composite squadron. as former military, yes you do not recite the pledge while in uniform, national anthem is different. The rule goes in CAP, if you are not confortable with something, then dont do it, as we are an volunteer force not bound by contract. IF the senior leader wants to recite the pledge at meetings, missions, sarex etc, so be it, it is only 20 seconds. thats my 2 Cents. Get youe gear backed, chew gum, hydrate do watever in them 20 seconds.

[jjmalott]

I was just thinking (I know it's dangerous)... I don't ever remember saying the pledge while serving in the Army while in uniform. However, at every wing, region and national CAP conference, the pledge was said after the posting of the colors.
Maybe we should start practicing what we preach (ref: CAPP 151) :angel:

AGREED!   151 is pretty black and white.

[tsrup]

I believe in the pledge of allegance, we say it at every meeting, and then an prayer afterwards. We are also an composite squadron. as former military, yes you do not recite the pledge while in uniform, national anthem is different. The rule goes in CAP, if you are not confortable with something, then dont do it, as we are an volunteer force not bound by contract. IF the senior leader wants to recite the pledge at meetings, missions, sarex etc, so be it, it is only 20 seconds. thats my 2 Cents. Get youe gear backed, chew gum, hydrate do watever in them 20 seconds.

Wrong attitude, and is a clear example of what is wrong with CAP.


Our regulations are not a buffet where members can pick and choose which ones they wish to follow. 

[Майор Хаткевич]

I don't get the use of Prayer...Is this a chaplain session?

[Critical AOA]

You say prayers at your CAP meetings?  You must be joking.  That has no place in CAP.

[Al Sayre]

First here's the full quote from CAPP 151:

The pledge is not normally recited when CAP members are in
formation. Reciting the pledge when in military-style uniform, let alone
when assembled in a formation, is somewhat redundant – the uniform
and all the other trappings of national service are themselves symbols
of a special devotion to America.

Note the first (imperative) sentence says "in formation".  A bunch of people standing around the briefing room would not be considered a formation unless they are at attention and have performed a close order dress right dress.

The second sentence is declarative, not imperative, and does not describe a required action as does the first sentence but rather simply makes an observation. 

Therefore there is nothing that prohibits a member who is wearing a military uniform but is not in a formation from reciting the pledge.

Additionally, members wearing civilian clothes, the Polo Shirt or Blazer Combination are not considered to be in a "Military Uniform" and should therefore always recite the pledge. 

[JeffDG]

Additionally, members wearing civilian clothes, the Polo Shirt or Blazer Combination are not considered to be in a "Military Uniform" and should therefore always recite the pledge.

Again,

This assumes that all members are in a position where they CAN pledge allegiance.  Some of us cannot do so.  I refuse to cheapen the pledge of allegiance by making it some meaningless recitation of words just to go along with everyone else.  At such time as I have taken the naturalization oath, then I will recite the pledge of allegiance, but until then, it is flat out inappropriate for me to do so.

[tsrup]

First here's the full quote from CAPP 151:

The pledge is not normally recited when CAP members are in
formation. Reciting the pledge when in military-style uniform, let alone
when assembled in a formation, is somewhat redundant – the uniform
and all the other trappings of national service are themselves symbols
of a special devotion to America.

Note the first (imperative) sentence says "in formation".  A bunch of people standing around the briefing room would not be considered a formation unless they are at attention and have performed a close order dress right dress.

The second sentence is declarative, not imperative, and does not describe a required action as does the first sentence but rather simply makes an observation. 

Therefore there is nothing that prohibits a member who is wearing a military uniform but is not in a formation from reciting the pledge.

Additionally, members wearing civilian clothes, the Polo Shirt or Blazer Combination are not considered to be in a "Military Uniform" and should therefore always recite the pledge.

You missed a part.

When in a military-style uniform, stand at attention and remain silent.

note: "military-style",
Only the members wearing the polo will be able to recite the pledge. 

This is supported by the handy picture that is also in the manual.

The fact remains that there are better/more appropriate things to do.

[Brad]

Going to try to gently steer this back on-topic. This thread was intended to address the OP's concern about the possibility of an extreme regulation and how to follow-up on it, not to debate the place of prayer in a CAP meeting or the idea of a foreign national taking the pledge of their host country.

To the OP, no the supposed regulation that CAP members are forbidden from rendering national courtesies or reciting the pledge when in uniform (yes I know it was "CAP uniform", but unless you're talking that specific in terms of 39-1 and distinctive uniforms, most people take that to include the AF-style uniforms) does not exist.

Just look at CAPP 3. This tells you exactly what you ARE to do given what style of uniform you are wearing. Would this publication exist if, as you were told, CAP was forbidden from rendering honors to the flag?! Sounds like those other staff members have forgotten common-sense and seem content in their own little worlds. An all too common trend.

[tsrup]

Just look at CAPP 2. This tells you exactly what you ARE to do given what style of uniform you are wearing. Would this publication exist if, as you were told, CAP was forbidden from rendering honors to the flag?! Sounds like those other staff members have forgotten common-sense and seem content in their own little worlds. An all too common trend.

What does the pamphlet regarding ELT/EPIRB searches have to do with customs and courtesies?

[Brad]

Just look at CAPP 2. This tells you exactly what you ARE to do given what style of uniform you are wearing. Would this publication exist if, as you were told, CAP was forbidden from rendering honors to the flag?! Sounds like those other staff members have forgotten common-sense and seem content in their own little worlds. An all too common trend.

What does the pamphlet regarding ELT/EPIRB searches have to do with customs and courtesies?

Fixed, I looked at the wrong line in the table. You knew what I meant though...