Metal grade (rank) insignia on BDU uniforms

[Brad]

Polo here for PD courses are verboten.  It was either blues or grey and white combos.

Interesting. Must be a Wing Thing because here just about every PD class I go to has seniors in polos.

[The CyBorg is destroyed]

Since the "Harwell incident" and its aftermath in the early '90s, the only time metal grade for seniors has been authorised is on the CSU, and we know what happened with that.

Currently, metal grade is optional on the BBDU cap, and why I don't know since we've had it pulled from us on everything else.  But it's CAP uniforms, and no accepted rules of logic apply there.

Metal grade is not permitted on the collars of either BDU's or BBDU's.

The closest thing I have seen is some seniors wearing metal CAP cutouts (as cadets do) on BDU's.  It's not regulation, but I can sympathise in that case because it's a PITA to get cloth CAP insignia put on when in most cases you'll just have to take them off in six months or so.

However, I have seen some uniform violations that do make me go "hmmmmm?"

Military ribbons/devices on the G/W
Metal grade on the AF waist-length jacket
Blank grey sleeves worn by SMWOG (another one I can say is a good idea)
AF waist-length jacket (with rank) worn with G/W
CSU brushed-silver nameplate worn with AF service dress (another one I think is a good idea)

CAP ribbons on a polo shirt?  I probably would have laughed fit to cry...

[manfredvonrichthofen]

It is too easy to sew rank on to use any excuse to wear metal grade when it is not authorized. Once it is on it is on, you don't have to measure it again. Or you can Velcro it, that takes care of you for all grades from FO to 1st LT, and then you can put on another piece of Velcro for everything to COL. It's too easy to just follow the regulations.

[Phil Hirons, Jr.]

Currently, metal grade is optional on the BBDU cap, and why I don't know since we've had it pulled from us on everything else.  But it's CAP uniforms, and no accepted rules of logic apply there.

Of course if you wear it as designated in 39-1 you put a dent in your forehead from the frog.

[jeders]

COMPLIANCE WITH THIS PUBLICATION IS MANDATORY.  Any variation from this publication is not authorized.  Items not listed in this publication are not authorized for wear.   

This is a handy little line that so many seem to never find.

Personally, I have worn metal grade insignia on my BDUs as a senior. It was when I promoted to Capt and my promotion came through sooner than anticipated. Since we were meeting in BDUs and the squadron commander wanted to have some form of promotion ceremony, he grabbed a set of metal captain's bars and pinned them on over my sew on rank. I saluted, went back to my seat, and before I got 10 feet away they were already off and I was back in uniform. The moral of the story being, I think it's a fine thing to do for a promotion ceremony if you're in BDUs, but they need to be taken off as soon as the ceremony is over.

[Eclipse]

It is too easy to sew rank on to use any excuse to wear metal grade when it is not authorized. Once it is on it is on, you don't have to measure it again. Or you can Velcro it, that takes care of you for all grades from FO to 1st LT, and then you can put on another piece of Velcro for everything to COL. It's too easy to just follow the regulations.

I agree it's not that big a deal, but they aren't the same size - the cutouts are different from the Lt's, so it will leave some visible marks, especially if you have the garment professionally cleaned.

Velcro looks horrible on the collar - the insignia will stick up and curl.

No velcro.

[Eclipse]

Currently, metal grade is optional on the BBDU cap, and why I don't know since we've had it pulled from us on everything else.  But it's CAP uniforms, and no accepted rules of logic apply there.

Of course if you wear it as designated in 39-1 you put a dent in your forehead from the frog.

Bend the prongs over.

[manfredvonrichthofen]

It is too easy to sew rank on to use any excuse to wear metal grade when it is not authorized. Once it is on it is on, you don't have to measure it again. Or you can Velcro it, that takes care of you for all grades from FO to 1st LT, and then you can put on another piece of Velcro for everything to COL. It's too easy to just follow the regulations.

I agree it's not that big a deal, but they aren't the same size - the cutouts are different from the Lt's, so it will leave some visible marks, especially if you have the garment professionally cleaned.

Velcro looks horrible on the collar - the insignia will stick up and curl.

No velcro.

ALL of my patches are Velcroed, they look just fine, and the best thing, they don't go through the wash so they don't curl or lose shape, and the colors don't bleed or fade any where near like they do if they are washed. Nor do they stick up.

[Pylon]

As for the OP's post about how to "pin" senior members with their new grade at a promotion if they happen to be wearing BDUs.  Been there, done that, got the solution.  We took a set of cloth 2d Lt bars (but it could work with other grades) and a pair of single ribbon holders (from CAP's official uniform supplier, The HockVanguard!) and wrapped the cloth insignia around the ribbon holder with the pin-backs sticking out of the back.  Some strategic placement of tape and tight folding left us with two cloth 1st Lt bars with approximately the required 1/8" border that could be pinned on a members' uniform.

[The CyBorg is destroyed]

Of course if you wear it as designated in 39-1 you put a dent in your forehead from the frog.

My skull's so hard and dented nobody would notice.

[PHall]

Polo here for PD courses are verboten.  It was either blues or grey and white combos.

Interesting. Must be a Wing Thing because here just about every PD class I go to has seniors in polos.

It's a CAWG thing.    

But if you do look at the Table 4-8 in CAPM 39-1 that shows which AF style uniform is equal to to each CAP Distinctive uniform,
the AF Short Sleeve Blues is equal to the Aviator White Shirt/Grey Slacks Combo.
It's a PD class, they're trying for a "professional image".

[Spaceman3750]

I visited a squadron in FLWG once that had seniors wearing metal grade insignia on their BDU patrol caps. I mentioned to a 2d Lt. "I don't think those are authorized." and she said that the SQ/CC told her it was authorized an to wear it. I think he was confused with the metal allowed on the BBDU caps, but there was some other goofy stuff happening so who knows. I'm a lowly flight officer so I just went about my business.

[bflynn]

Wow...I went to Ft Bragg years and years ago and there were these crazy airborne guys running around in maroon colored french hats, even through they clearly weren't authorized by regulations at the time.

At some point, you just have to defer to local authority and realize that if there's a hammer, you're not it.

[Eclipse]

At some point, you just have to defer to local authority and realize that if there's a hammer, you're not it.

There is very little latitude for "local authority" with CAP, and what there is has a defined lane.

[lordmonar]

At some point, you just have to defer to local authority and realize that if there's a hammer, you're not it.

There is very little latitude for "local authority" with CAP, and what there is has a defined lane.

Nope....but there is already an authority.....at that point it becomes a peer-to-peer issue or you have to report it up the chain for them to handle.

[NIN]

I actually authorized metal grade on BDU caps (back when there was no grade) for a short while.

Of course, it was October 2001 and the armed sentries at the armory nearly drew down on one of my officers when he drove up to the guard shack at his pre-9/11 speed, and they were getting confused/nervous when they saw officer rank on the collar of people in BDUs, and not on the hat.

Didn't help that the sentries were seldom the same guys..