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CAP Talk  |  Cadet Programs  |  Cadet Programs Management & Activities  |  Topic: School Programs
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RiverAux
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« on: December 24, 2006, 10:34:11 PM »

The draft minutes of the Nov NEC meeting has an agenda item on the CAP school program.  Here is part of the info presented:
Quote
Civil Air Patrol began reaching into America’s schools about 12 years ago. Today, about 9% of our current cadets are part of our school program and these numbers will continue to rise. As a result, we have developed a comprehensive plan to sustain this rapidly maturing program. As part of this growth, we have identified that CAP’s School Program (SP) needs to become more inclusive to also reach home, private and charter schools. We have also identified the need to go beyond establishing squadrons in schools to directly reach groups of students with our educational materials.

The CAP School Program includes:
Teachers – By moving the AEMs under the SP umbrella we can target more
teachers to become involved in CAP’s efforts
Students – By establishing student clusters of all ages using our educational
materials we can promote CAP to these future recruits
Squadrons in schools – By increasing the number of “800” (school program)
charters, we are able to reach into many school systems with a complete cadet program and increase our membership numbers quickly
Policies – We will need to identify and establish appropriate policies to enable
this expanded program to succeed; we would also need to revise relevant regulations and pamphlets accordingly
Curricula – CAP produced a great curricula series about eight years ago that
helps America’s teachers through our materials and program; we will need to revise these materials towards our current approaches.

PROPOSED NEC ACTION:
That the National Executive Committee vote to endorse the concepts presented in the above paragraphs and also authorize a School Program Summit (funded at
approximately $4,000) that will help CAP leadership determine the policies necessary to make the school program successful.

They decided to endorse these policies.  A few things I find interesting.  There are only 70 school program squadrons and they represent 9% of our cadets.  While I don't have the time to run the exact numbers on current # of CAP squadrons, I am sure that this does mean that school program squadrons account for a greater percentage of CAP cadets than you would expect.  They must be doing something right. 

Its interesting that they're looking ahead at potential new recruits by providing materials targeted at younger age groups. 

Does anyone know to what extent School Program Squadrons are particpating in ES activities?  I've never had close contact with any but it was my impression that they were generally short on senior member support and probably couldn't do much ES work.  I could be very wrong. 
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lordmonar
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« Reply #1 on: December 24, 2006, 10:37:15 PM »

Probably very little to none would be my guess....but that also describes most of the cadet participation in ES across the board IMHO. 
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PATRICK M. HARRIS, SMSgt, CAP
Pacific Region
arajca
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Posts: 4,282

« Reply #2 on: December 25, 2006, 12:11:07 AM »

The school program basically addresses the Cadet and AE missions of CAP. The program recommends teaming with a squadron outside of the school to help provide the support structure and senior members a squadron needs. There is also some misinformation in the school program materials, i.e. you don't get to wear the Communications patch for completing BCUT like the school program says.

In most wings, cadets are actually heavily involved in ES, usually in GT activities. Some states, IIRC NV is one, prohibit CAP from performing GSAR operations, so in those states, there is little cadet involvement in ES.
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RiverAux
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« Reply #3 on: December 25, 2006, 12:59:07 AM »

Sidenote:  IIRC??
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arajca
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« Reply #4 on: December 25, 2006, 01:09:31 AM »

If I Recall Correctly
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lordmonar
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« Reply #5 on: December 25, 2006, 02:10:43 AM »

IIRC NV is one, prohibit CAP from performing GSAR operations, so in those states, there is little cadet involvement in ES.

yea...I know...we are working on that.   There is nothing in writing about it...but there is an institional thinking that cadets should not be part of ES.

We did include them in the last SAREX and we are working hard to expand the training and get them more invovled at both GT and mission base staff.
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PATRICK M. HARRIS, SMSgt, CAP
Pacific Region
DNall
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« Reply #6 on: December 25, 2006, 03:47:09 AM »

I gotta say a couple things here.
1) I think the mission of in-school cadet programs belongs to JROTC & they should keep it. The school program we have does compete with them. I know we say it doesn't, but that's not the case. Those cadets stay with the program after they go to HS & the two programs compete intensely for people & in programming.

2) I think it was a mistake to lower the age to 12 or anything lower. It's very hard to deal with the extra maturity gap. Also, I'm a little uncomfortable with indoctrinating a 12yo to military service, & the historical comparisons.

3) I think if you push up a large scale national program in middle schools that's going to not sit so well with the public that the military is targeting younger & younger kids.

4) Finally, I'm not at all in favor of ioncreasing the percentage of school program cadets to traditional cadets. If the school program grows over time that's fine, but it shouldl stay under 10%. Also don't be misled by the numbers. their inactive percentage is higher after they leave the formal class setting.

That's my take on it. Don't get me wrong, I'd love to get paid to do CAP stuff, & I am a cadet programs officer, I also have great respect for one of the guys around here that helped make this program happen & commands one of those Sqs. I appreciate what the program does. They do some things better than me. I know how much more I could accomplish with more regular or longer times with cadets. They have great advantages & from what I've seen at this one program they do a good job. I'm just not really in love with the program concept, but to each their own.
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DanR
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« Reply #7 on: December 26, 2006, 12:57:01 PM »


2) I think it was a mistake to lower the age to 12 or anything lower. It's very hard to deal with the extra maturity gap. Also, I'm a little uncomfortable with indoctrinating a 12yo to military service, & the historical comparisons.


Yes, the difference in the maturity level is a little harder to deal with than many might come to believe. Personal Experience
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C/CMSgt Dan Russell-Cadet Commander-NER-NY-162-Utica Composite Squadron
RiverAux
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Posts: 10,967

« Reply #8 on: December 26, 2006, 01:06:10 PM »

I think you may have been misled by my comments.  I think what they're aiming at doing is providing AE materials to younger students in the same school system so that when they're older they could join the CAP School Program. 

Basically this would be coordinating AE activities in schools that would later be sending students to schools with CAP programs.  The theory being that if you get them excited about AE in elementary school they might join the CAP program when they get to middle school.

However, they didn't include much detail in the minutes and you would need to see the whole strategy to understand exactly what they meant. 
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Major Carrales
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« Reply #9 on: December 26, 2006, 01:12:23 PM »

As a teacher of 8th Grade American history let me say this and 9 Year CAP'er...

There is a trade off.  Younger cadets are awestruck by what CAP has to offer.  The uniforms, the O-Flights and ability to take an active part in something real are attractive.  The is a corps of cadets this age what, once hooked, will become the Spaatz and, at least, Mictchell, Cadets.

Once a Cadet become a Freshman in High School, there are many more (we could call them distractions) "options" that compete with their time.  Organized things like Band, Football or speech and debate.  Then unorganized and unpredictable things like "relationships" among boyfriend/girlfriend.

Yes, maturity comes with that sobering realization than there is more to life than CAP.  It is at that point that those on the military track latch on with gusto, those looking to complete the program buckle down and those that do it "because its cool" slowly loose interest and are gone.

Now, as a caveat, it is totally dependent on two factors 1) Strength of the Program and 2) The individual.

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"We have been given the power to change CAP, let's keep the momentum going!"

Major Joe Ely "Sparky" Carrales, CAP
Commander
Coastal Bend Cadet Squadron
SWR-TX-454
sandman
Seasoned Member

Posts: 351

« Reply #10 on: December 26, 2006, 02:55:53 PM »

Would splitting the cadet program into a junior and senior program, such as it is in the Naval Sea Cadet Program (leaguers vs. cadets), be a reasonable option? Maybe include uniform or just insignia variations?
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MAJ, US Army (Ret)
Major, Civil Air Patrol
Major, 144th Fighter Wing, Commander, Medical Flight
BillB
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Posts: 1,987

« Reply #11 on: December 26, 2006, 04:30:29 PM »

Sandman.... That was done years ago. In fact the cadet program was split into three parts. The one for the youngest was called The Eaglet Program. This was roughly the equivlant of todays middle school program for 11-13 year old. Eaglets wore military style shirts and blue jeans or equal pants/skirt. The only insignia was the Wing patch. The next was the standard cadet program as we know it for 13 to 18 year olds. And the last was the Officer Training Corp for 18 to 21 year olds. Basically it was just as the name implys a training program for the older cadets. OTC members wore basically the senior uniform with OTC cutouts on the collars instead of CAP cutouts.
A program like that would solve many of todays problems of cadet program as to cadets in peer groups and retention of older cadets.
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Gil Robb Wilson # 19
Gil Robb Wilson # 104
sandman
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« Reply #12 on: December 26, 2006, 04:55:47 PM »

Sandman.... That was done years ago. In fact the cadet program was split into three parts. The one for the youngest was called The Eaglet Program. This was roughly the equivlant of todays middle school program for 11-13 year old. Eaglets wore military style shirts and blue jeans or equal pants/skirt. The only insignia was the Wing patch. The next was the standard cadet program as we know it for 13 to 18 year olds. And the last was the Officer Training Corp for 18 to 21 year olds. Basically it was just as the name implys a training program for the older cadets. OTC members wore basically the senior uniform with OTC cutouts on the collars instead of CAP cutouts.
A program like that would solve many of todays problems of cadet program as to cadets in peer groups and retention of older cadets.

Thanks BilliB, I was not fully aware of the CAP cadet history. Good info! Is there a site to read about that history? Is it on the NHQ website?

I agree with you...reintroducing that style of cadetting would, in my opinion, be very benificial to the cadets participating. The older cadets would be better suited to shadow s'members on live SAR activities with training more in line with a military emphasis whereas the younger set would focus on training for SAR and aerospace activities...more of a scouting or explorer emphasis.

I think if the OTC program were reintroduced, it would give other cadetting programs a "run for their money". If run properly, it could "outdo" ACA, Sea Cadets, Young Marines. Opinions?
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MAJ, US Army (Ret)
Major, Civil Air Patrol
Major, 144th Fighter Wing, Commander, Medical Flight
BillB
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« Reply #13 on: December 26, 2006, 06:40:44 PM »

The big problem with introducing an OTC program would be the addition of a whole new series of manuals. However, the old thick Vol 1 Book 2 from 1949 could be updated into a single volume. Keep in mind OTC members would probably be high school juniors at the least and probably senior or have graduated. So training manual(s) would have to be written for this age group. OTC members shadowing Officer members in addition to OTC training would be an excellent idea.
As to history, there was a brochure on the Eaglet Program that CAP produced, but I haven't seen a copy in a long time. The only references you'll find to the OTC program would be the OTC insignia listed in the old uniform regulations or the manuals of insignia that the bookstore used to sell and possibly Vanguard has those copies.
If either the Eaglet or OTC programs were introduced, it would require a major overhaul of the existing cadet program, and I can't see NHQ with it's reduced staff accomplishing this.
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Gil Robb Wilson # 19
Gil Robb Wilson # 104
sandman
Seasoned Member

Posts: 351

« Reply #14 on: December 26, 2006, 06:57:22 PM »

Why should it have to involve just NHQ? I would imagine that delegating portions of the jobs out to the CAP community should be able to cobble together the requisite product. There is a lot of neuron power out there along with computer hardware/software (not to mention meeting sites such as this one) to accomplish the mission.
Cadetting needs to be reformed and updated. Look at the TV/web commercials geared torward these skulls full o' mush. A good cadet program should be able to morph into a viable program to meet the basic demands of our military services. This in turn allows a cadet to choose a career path in the military with basic skills met through their cadetting experiences, or choose a civilian career with a basic sense of self-confidence...one can dream right?
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MAJ, US Army (Ret)
Major, Civil Air Patrol
Major, 144th Fighter Wing, Commander, Medical Flight
CAP428
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Posts: 218

« Reply #15 on: December 26, 2006, 07:34:59 PM »


1) I think the mission of in-school cadet programs belongs to JROTC & they should keep it. The school program we have does compete with them. I know we say it doesn't, but that's not the case. Those cadets stay with the program after they go to HS & the two programs compete intensely for people & in programming.

Yes, but some school systems (such as mine) do not have JROTC.  A CAP school program that isn't necessarily a class during the school day but rather an extracurricular activity simply sponsored by the school provides the school system with a similar program to JROTC but a better alternative since it doesn't have to take up part of the school day for those involved.  Also, students might be more likely to join since they don't have to take a class for it, but can rather come when they want/can after school.  A JROTC class is mandatory attendance that some students may not want.
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flyguy06
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Posts: 2,195

« Reply #16 on: December 26, 2006, 10:55:40 PM »

Sandman.... That was done years ago. In fact the cadet program was split into three parts. The one for the youngest was called The Eaglet Program. This was roughly the equivlant of todays middle school program for 11-13 year old. Eaglets wore military style shirts and blue jeans or equal pants/skirt. The only insignia was the Wing patch. The next was the standard cadet program as we know it for 13 to 18 year olds. And the last was the Officer Training Corp for 18 to 21 year olds. Basically it was just as the name implys a training program for the older cadets. OTC members wore basically the senior uniform with OTC cutouts on the collars instead of CAP cutouts.
A program like that would solve many of todays problems of cadet program as to cadets in peer groups and retention of older cadets.

That sounds interesting. That must have been wayyy back in the day. Sounds like a good programthough
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arajca
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« Reply #17 on: December 26, 2006, 11:46:30 PM »

Something else with JROTC, due to agreements between the services and laws, there are only a limited number of JROTC units allowed. The total number is split among the services in a specific formula with each getting a fixed percentage. The CAP school program is not part of this agreement and therefore doesn't impact the number of AJROTC units authorized.

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flyguy06
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« Reply #18 on: December 27, 2006, 12:40:32 PM »

There are no AFJROTC units in my school system. Its all Army JROTC which doesnt really mean anything.

Our Squadron has a program in a High school. Its a fligh from our unit. We have one Senior member working with them. He's a Media Specialist at the school. But he doesnt really know much about CAP or how it is run. He refuss to take the cadets anywhere in his POV and cities school regs. I tell him that while he on a CAP activity, but he doesnt understand that. The school program is a good idea if youhave the right people working it.
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RiverAux
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« Reply #19 on: January 06, 2007, 12:38:48 PM »

It doesn't quite sound as if he is the right person for that job.  Sometimes you can have a person "weak" on CAP programs/knowledge in charge if there are some experienced folks around him, but I wouldn't put a guy who doesn't know the ropes out on his own like that. 
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CAP Talk  |  Cadet Programs  |  Cadet Programs Management & Activities  |  Topic: School Programs
 


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