New Uniden "Home Patrol" Radio Scanner Receiver

[RADIOMAN015]

Just announced today at Uniden's world headquarters

See:
http://mt-milcom.blogspot.com/2010/06/revolution-in-scanning-is-coming.html

Basically you input in your zip code and it finds all the radio frequncies in your immediate area.   No cost figure yet but it is AM/NFM/P25 CAI modes capable.  No sure if close call capture is part of the set up.

Should be an interesting radio for CAP'ers
RM

[Eclipse]

Should be an interesting radio for CAP'ers

For...?

[cap235629]

Should be an interesting radio for CAP'ers

For...?

ease of use in a joint operations?

[Eclipse]

It's a scanner - anything we need to know for "joint operations" will come down the channel or through our radios.

[davidsinn]

It's a scanner - anything we need to know for "joint operations" will come down the channel or through our radios.

There are never enough radios to go around. Being able to monitor what's going on would help immensely. I would use it on flightline to monitor AV-band and our VHF freqs.

[Eclipse]

^ I disagree about the idea that there are never enough radios, but regardless, before I was in the "ROA" club, I did the same thing.

Didn't help much IMHO.  To each his own.

[cap235629]

our state uses a 700/800 mhz trunked system statewide.  Our wing has exactly 9 radios on the system.  2 portables and 7 mobiles installed in vehicles.  Having a scanner at mission base frees these up for field use.  Eclipse you are once again geographically biased, your wing is your wing, it doesn't reflect the realities of operations in every corner of the USA.

[Eclipse]

You do not need to be on the "state 700/800 mhz system"

You need to be on the CAP radio net.  Period.

I would be willing to bet you have more than 2 / 7 portable CAP radios in the whole state.

There's 11 units in AK - each should have an EFJ mobile for the unit CC's use or discretion.  If you don't have ES-TOA issued equipment, it is because you either don't have GTL's, or don't have GTL's willing to accept responsibility for the gear.

[cap235629]

You do not need to be on the "state 700/800 mhz system"

You need to be on the CAP radio net.  Period.

I would be willing to bet you have more than 2 / 7 portable CAP radios in the whole state.

You missed my earlier post apparently "JOINT OPERATIONS"

in this wing at least 80% of our missions are "JOINT OPERATIONS"

I can't tell you how may times having the ability to at least hear what was going on on the CAP side would streamline our actions.  The ability to communicate across different systems is integral to joint operations.  I am not saying that every ground team needs a liaison radio, rather that a scanner can act as a liaison radio in the CAP "mission base"

[Eclipse]

Awesome, then those "joint operators" should supply the equipment.

[CommGeek]

its called Interoperability!    Everyone needs to talk to everyone!  In a large event, we will be doing ourselves a huge disservice is we stick to the attitude that all we need is our VHF 'System', and we only need to talk to ourselves! 

[Eclipse]

its called Interoperability!    Everyone needs to talk to everyone!

"Interoperability" does not mean "everybody jump on the radio and start talking".

In most cases a CAP field asset, ground or air, is not going to take tasking or direction from someone in another agency - that is going to
happen at the Mission Base level, which would then create tasks, etc.  In the rare cases that direct coordination is necessary, there are allowances to make that happen.

Spend your money anyway you want, but the idea a Wing should be spending corporate funds on radios we can't use 363 days a year to maintain "interoperability" is foolish - maybe in the HLS grant world, but not in ours.

[CommGeek]

I will site several real world examples.

CAP aircraft is working with a local SAR unit, or sheriffs office on a large scale search....how do they talk.

Deep Water Horizon mission. CAP aircraft must talk to the State via an 800 mhz system to coordinate RECON efforts.

CAP aircraft and ground crews need to communicated with National Guard Assets durring a hurricane?


But again, we only need to talk to our mission base!

It dosent have to be 'Tasking or direction' but coordination.

Why cant CAP get an HLS grant  PSIC, IECGP, SHSGP   get in with your State, and anything is possible.

[Eclipse]

But again, we only need to talk to our mission base!

Correct - glad you understand.

A scanner isn't going to help you talk to anyone, and if that other agency needs to talk directly to us, then they will
hand us a radio or will will put an MRO in their shack.

Again, I'm not saying there aren't time when we need to speak directly to field actors, I'm saying that CAP should not
be self-funding different radios for the remote chance.

[CommGeek]

It was Sarcasm!  we are in for a rude awakening if thats our mindset!

[arajca]

In the standard CAP channel plan, there are several federal Interoperability channels. Every CAP VHF radio should have them. Additionally, there are two or more banks of 16 (in the EFJs) that each wing can set up as they need. The channel issue with the technisonics is being discussed/worked out at echelons above reality.

Given that emergency services and management agencies use  a wide spectrum (HF, VHF-low, VHF-high, airband, uhf, 700/800), it is not practical for each field resource (ground team or aircraft) to carry all of them. There are some multiband radios coming out, typically VHF-high & 700/800, but they make EFJs seem affordable.

Also keep in mind that just because you have a radio that can operate on a particular band, without the proper authorization, you CANNOT operate on that band. Except for the interop channels, you need written authorization to use someone else's frequencies. The life-or-death exception does not apply to normal incident traffic, despite what some members may think.

[Thunder]

A scanner isn't going to help with communication. You need to get mission information in-context from a briefing or through the Operations branch, not gleaned from a radio conversation listened to by chance. If you need to communicate with an agency directly, you already have avenues to accomplish this:

Relay
Telephone
Mutual Aid Channels

Adjusting your tasking based on what you overhear between two other people is a big mistake. Otherwise, you are just curious about the traffic and you should focus on your task instead of snooping anyway, or get MRO qualified and then you can handle all the interagency comm yourself.

[NIN]

Correct - glad you understand.

A scanner isn't going to help you talk to anyone, and if that other agency needs to talk directly to us, then they will
hand us a radio or will will put an MRO in their shack.

Again, I'm not saying there aren't time when we need to speak directly to field actors, I'm saying that CAP should not
be self-funding different radios for the remote chance.

Sadly, its this same attitude that causes CAP ICs to show up at an ICP and act like they're the sole authority in a multi-agency mission.

I didn't assume that the Arkansas system was "self-funded," and in fact, I'd bet it was state-funded for interoperability and coordination purposes. 

Having worked in a couple different places on systems such as this, the problem with CAP is often that we've managed to 'stovepipe' our comm assets to the point where its cumbersome, unworkable and downright counter-productive to setup a "parallel network" for certain situations.

A number of years ago (12+), we had a microcell/tornado bust thru Detroit.  As I was issuing a peremptory alert to my unit's ES members for disaster relief duties, we got activated under the "911T" system by wing via some MOUs we had in place.  Within a few hrs, my squadron and some folks from another were providing a presence in the City of Hamtramck in our big white vans. Basically, all we did was drive around and keep an eyeball out for looters (they'd declared a curfew in town, so the cops and us were the only folks on the streets that night) and help out any citizens in need. We reported any needs right to the cops.

Instead of stationing a cadet in the police dept with a CAP radio, the PD just handed us two of theirs. We kept team-to-team tabs on one another via CAP radio, and coordinated with the cops and the city on their radios.

This had a net effect of giving us an additional body on the team (ie. we did not have to station a guy in the PD), we didn't have to put a senior with the cadet to "supervise" or use one of our seniors in that role instead, we didn't require an extra HT or mobile at the PD, and our communications were direct with the "customer" without any filtering or time lag. 

Honestly, I think CAP should get with that program a little more often.

(IIRC, we had this problem last year where we had to do something to our FMs in our aircraft that were slated to fly fire patrol around the state.  They were setup with the state "fireguard" frequency that allowed each aircraft to be contacted, and in turn contact, each firetower and the state forest fire people directly.  Yes, it wasn't a CAP frequency, but the states authorized us to operate on their frequency for the purposes of coordination.  In this way, we did not need to man-up a mission base with CAP radio operators just to facilitate comms to the fire folks while our planes were flying. Its sometimes tough enough to get enough aircrews, let alone aircrews and mission-base folks.   Plus, in some instances our fire patrol routes took the planes to the north of the White Mountains, meaning that our comms with wing HQ were spotty at best, and routinely non-existent. It stood to reason that if our guys spotted a brewing fire someplace that they be able to radio it directly to the folks who were going to respond without running it back to our folks who would then relay it to the state fire folks. Thats just asking for delays, missed comms, etc)

[Eclipse]

It was Sarcasm!  we are in for a rude awakening if thats our mindset!

Wait?   What?