Chain of Command?

[JoeTomasone]

... which still has nothing to do with the chain of command.

Well, it does, kinda. 

In the RM, those you command don't have a whole lot of say in the matter.   You give them orders, and they are obligated to follow them.   In a volunteer organization (non-CAP), if people don't agree with you, they walk.    In CAP, it's a blend - you voluntarily buy in to the "You give orders, I follow them" RM mantra, but as a volunteer you can still walk (to another unit or out of CAP altogether) at any time.   If the commander is an ogre, that will be a unit of one pretty quickly.   However, if you think your commander's actions warrant his/her commander's review, you have that option instead of walking away.   And again, a CAP commander who retaliates against a subordinate going properly to the next higher commander will ultimately wind up commanding only him or herself.   

Ultimately, it depends on the rapport with the commander and the nature of/how egregious the matter is as to whether or not you inform your commander of your decision to seek redress at higher HQ.   

[flyguy06]

We are not professional volunteers; we are professionals who volunteer their time.  Big Difference...

Now, that being said.  I agree we must meet certain expectations to participate fully in CAP.  However, for a CAP commander to be effective, there must be "buy in" by those who agree to follow.  There is nothing for a commander to do other than motivate their followers to buy in to the process.  Yes, we must feel we are part of the team.  If a volunteer feels no true connection; the volunteer will leave.  A leader understands this and will act accordingly.  A leader who doesn't will fail.  It's actually a simple point to master but, for some reason, many who accept a leadership position can't figure this out.  When a leader resorts to "it's my way or else", most will chose "or else".   Even our mothers don't get much success when they say "because I said so..."

Just my $.02; YMMV

it depends on your mother and how she raised you.

I think that is the disconnect. Different people have differnt meanings of what a professional volunteer is or a professional who is a volunteer. As a NAtionalCAP, we are notalways on the same sheet of music. that needs to change.

[WT]

Read this, especially paragraph two.

http://www.capmembers.com/cap_national_hq/inspector_general/complaints.cfm

 
That said, to reiterate, way too many things are brought to the IG that absolutely should have been resolved at a lower level.  I suggest giving it a little time, then talk again with the Squadron Commander in trying to work it out.  If that doesn't work, and you are still concerned about it, try to resolve the matter with next higher command.  For the most part, unless it is a violation of some reg, the IG will most likely kick it back to command anyway.

[DG]

I've been a leader in non-military style volunteer organizations and you absolutely need to have leadership and consensus building skills to be successful.

... which still has nothing to do with the chain of command.

Oh, right!

Not if you are doing your duty...,

As a Jack-Booted Thug.

[EMT-83]

If someone wants to start a new thread on management styles, I'll join the conversation. The topic was chain of command, right?

[ketseyowyow]

yea it was,
here's a question
I have review boards coming up and I moved squadrons so I have never done a review board before. I have been looking and looking for a set chain of command, but I cant find one, does anyone know it off the top of their heads?
I need it from Flight Sergeant up to group commander.

[ketseyowyow]

If someone wants to start a new thread on management styles, I'll join the conversation. The topic was chain of command, right?

so yeah there ya go.
I started a new one... :

[lordmonar]

Which has nothing to do with the original post.

Yes, certain management styles work better than others when dealing with volunteers. But you still better have a pretty good reason to leave boot prints on your commander's forehead.

Nope....you just have to live with the consequences.

Everyone has the right to take anything up the chain of command.

Everyone has the responsibilty to try to resolve issues at the lowest level.  But if you have a problem with the link (i.e. you are going to complain about your CC's retaliation to people who disagree with with him) I don't see any problem with jumping the chain.  The next person in that chain's first question should be "have you taken this to your commander?" Which is where you insert your explanation of why you skipped the chain.

This is not rocket science this is basic military/buisness/family management.

We have a chain of command for a reason.  We have anti retaliation rules for a reason.  And we have an IG hotline for a reason.

[lordmonar]

yea it was,
here's a question
I have review boards coming up and I moved squadrons so I have never done a review board before. I have been looking and looking for a set chain of command, but I cant find one, does anyone know it off the top of their heads?
I need it from Flight Sergeant up to group commander.

??

You do not know the chain of command to the group commander?

Or are you looking for CoC with specific names in it?

If you are looking for a generic cadet to Nat CC chain of command it is like this:

Cadet
c/Element Leader
c/Flight Sergeant
c/Flight Commander
c/Squadron Commander
Deputy Commander for Cadets (Composite Squdron's only)
Squdron Commander
Group Commander (If you have them)
Wing Commander
Region Commander
National Commander

[Bluelakes 13]

I need it from Flight Sergeant up to group commander.

Cadet,
Since you are not signing your posts, I can't tell what grade/rank you are.

A First Sergeant is not in the chain of command.  Please refer to your Leaderhsip Vol. 1, pg. 11 for the diagram, pg. 32 for the explanation.

[lordmonar]

I need it from Flight Sergeant up to group commander.

Cadet,
Since you are not signing your posts, I can't tell what grade/rank you are.

A Flight Sergeant is not in the chain of command.  Please refer to your Leaderhsip Vol. 1, pg. 11 for the diagram, pg. 32 for the explanation.

I think you are confusing Flight sergeant with First Sergeant.

You are correct the FIRST Sergeant is not not in the chain of command....but a FLIGHT Sergeant is.

[Bluelakes 13]

My bad.  Need more coffee...