Cadet Observers

[Flying Pig]

I have a cadet interested in becoming an observer.  Has anyone dealt with the process. I havnt researched it yet.  I thought I would post it for discussion.

[jimmydeanno]

It should be exactly the same as having an adult become an observer.  No difference.

[Angus]

Is the cadet 18?  If so the process is exactly the same.  When I went thorugh through NESA last year there was a cadet in my class. 

[Flying Pig]

This cadet is under 18.  However, Im sure most will want to do it.  I was never an observer, So I need to research the process.  In my 20 yrs in CAP I don't think I have ever seen a cadet with Observer Wings?

[Eclipse]

Same as any senior member, other than the age prerequisite.

Age has little bearing in this case on understanding, therefore the cadet could begin whatever training or self-study is appropriate, and begin tasking and practice missions the day after his 18th birthday.

Competance and professionalism in his performance and bearing will be the key to working through any reluctance you might encounter on more "seasoned" aircrew members.

Either he can do the job or he can't, past 18 age and cadet status should have no place in the conversation.

[RiverAux]

therefore the cadet could begin whatever training or self-study is appropriate, and begin tasking and practice missions the day after his 18th birthday

I assume you mean that they can begin getting tested over the tasks after they turn 18 since you have to be 18 before stating to get signed off on anything. 

[Airrace]

Yes, He or she must be 18 years old.

[Eclipse]

therefore the cadet could begin whatever training or self-study is appropriate, and begin tasking and practice missions the day after his 18th birthday

I assume you mean that they can begin getting tested over the tasks after they turn 18 since you have to be 18 before stating to get signed off on anything.

Yes - anyone can learn anything, anytime, but the SQTR sign-offs should not be started until after they are 18.

[Short Field]

^^^ Something to do with the Squdron Commander signing off that they have met all the prerequisites before you begin training???

[lordmonar]

^^^ Something to do with the Squdron Commander signing off that they have met all the prerequisites before you begin training???

that would be like a rule or something.....I think I remember reading something about that 

[Airrace]

Here is the link to the form that needs to be signed by the Squdron Commander:

http://members.gocivilairpatrol.com/media/cms/Mission_Observer_SQTR_F1C766CB93848.pdf

[Eclipse]

^^^ Something to do with the Squdron Commander signing off that they have met all the prerequisites before you begin training???

that would be like a rule or something.....I think I remember reading something about that 

...stupid rules...next thing you know we'll all have to dress alike similar...

[Flying Pig]

For a motivation aspect, it would be neat for cadets to be able to be fully qualified Observers, just not be able to go on missions until they are 18.  It would be neat to see cadets with Observer Wings.  It would be great for resumes when cadets go on to apply for academies, education, maturity, etc. Especially if they ever went on to become Pilots, they would know what happens from the right seat first hand.  Maybe some of that Pilot vs Observer culture we discuss sometimes might change.
I would envision something like age 16 you can start to train and it counts on the OPS Qual.  That way when you turn 18 you can hit the ground running.  It may help for retention as well.  Sort of like stacking the deck.  How neat would that be!!!

[lordmonar]

I would agree with you up to a point.

There are just so many training sorties to be had...and if you give up a training sortie to a cadet who can't be used on a real mission my put a whole in you available trained observers.

So....I would have to say NO to that.

On the same subject I don't see anything wrong with chaninging the rules to allow 16 year old scanners and observers to fly real missions.  The only draw back is the AFAM coverage is limited to only those over 18 so it becomes a liability/isnurance issue.

[Eclipse]

There are just so many training sorties to be had...and if you give up a training sortie to a cadet who can't be used on a real mission my put a whole in you available trained observers.

A unit could very easily separate senior MO training from cadet MO training, and schedule more sorties.  If you're going to have cadet MO's, they'll have to be MS' first.  I wouldn't have an issue with that, either. In fact, that's a much better use for a 99 ride than just sitting quietly.

If you're using the monthly AFAMs as intended, the potential for training sorties is only limited by your time and gas money.

Something like this would be a natural for AE grants and similar donations.

[lordmonar]

No....AE grants are for aerospace education....not ES qualifications.

My point is that there is only so much money to be had with AFAM monies. 

[AlphaSigOU]

Back in the olden days when dinosaurs roamed the earth and WIWAC, cadets could earn their observer rating but could not be aircrew on actual missions. Then the 18-year old rule came about and I had to remove my observer wings until I requaled as a senior member.

[Eclipse]

No....AE grants are for aerospace education....not ES qualifications.

My point is that there is only so much money to be had with AFAM monies.

If you're creative, you could find ways to use the money for both - AV weather is AV weather.
We don't rely on AFAMs for training flights.  Most of what we fly is self-funded - split the gas between
the aircrew and get thing done. 

[Flying Pig]

I would see getting a cadet his Observer Wings/Quals more beneficial to Aerospace Education that an O-Ride.

[Gunner C]

It may help for retention as well.  Sort of like stacking the deck.  How neat would that be!!!

Cadet retention into senior-land?  That's just crazy talk!