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CAP Talk  |  General Discussion  |  Uniforms & Awards  |  Topic: The Best of Squadron Patches
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Author Topic: The Best of Squadron Patches  (Read 194632 times)
LtCol White
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 959

« Reply #60 on: January 12, 2007, 12:12:45 PM »

This is the new LA Wing HQ patch

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LtCol David P. White CAP   
HQ LAWG

Admiral, Great Navy of the State of Nebraska

Diplomacy - The ability to tell someone to "Go to hell" and have them look forward to making the trip.
afgeo4
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 1,566

« Reply #61 on: January 12, 2007, 01:48:50 PM »

This is the new LA Wing HQ patch


One of the best I've seen... what does the 16 symbolize?
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GEORGE LURYE
afgeo4
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 1,566

« Reply #62 on: January 12, 2007, 01:50:55 PM »

Here is the patch I designed for the 91st All Iowa Squadron that was recently approved by the IAWG/CC. 



Does the unit have ancestry in umm... France?  ;D

Very nice looking patch, but I fear a stranger may not differentiate the motto from the squadron name... I think maybe the name should have been in numbers, not written out.
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GEORGE LURYE
sjtrupp
Recruit

Posts: 36

« Reply #63 on: January 12, 2007, 02:25:54 PM »

Pylon, the only patch I've so far seen that meets the guidelines of Air Force heraldry was the 10XX one.  I can't believe that so many people claim that their patches meet the standard when they've obviously not read the material.

The USAF clearly states that the Shield type patches are to be used for Command, MAJCOM, and Wing patches.  Group patches are usually rockers and odd shapes.  Squadron patches are Pie type patches with rockers on top and bottom.  The top rocker states the designation of the unit (514th AGS or So-and-So Composite Sqdn or NER-NJ-504) while the bottom rocker sports the motto.  In USAF, the MAJCOM patch is worn on one pocket of the BDU while the Wing patch is worn on the other.  The squadron patch, if worn, is placed half way from name tape to shoulder.  That's why you don't see the Pie type patch on pockets in the Air Force.  It isn't that complicated, so why isn't everyone on board?

As far as Syracuse Comp Sqdn patch, I will forward a redesign of the patch tomy superiors ASAP to be implemented with the next patch order.

The problem begins with the simple fact that we don't place the patches in the same place as the AF.  So should we go with the AF standard that patches on the pocket should be shields or that it is a squadron patch and us that information.  Also, most of the wing patches don't follow the standard set forth in the Air Force heraldry, so to be different from the wing patch, squadrons have been using shields.

the best option would be to completely follow the Air Force heraldry standards, starting with the Wing Patch and placement of patches.  I don't see that happening though.

SJT
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afgeo4
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 1,566

« Reply #64 on: January 12, 2007, 02:37:31 PM »

Pylon, the only patch I've so far seen that meets the guidelines of Air Force heraldry was the 10XX one.  I can't believe that so many people claim that their patches meet the standard when they've obviously not read the material.

The USAF clearly states that the Shield type patches are to be used for Command, MAJCOM, and Wing patches.  Group patches are usually rockers and odd shapes.  Squadron patches are Pie type patches with rockers on top and bottom.  The top rocker states the designation of the unit (514th AGS or So-and-So Composite Sqdn or NER-NJ-504) while the bottom rocker sports the motto.  In USAF, the MAJCOM patch is worn on one pocket of the BDU while the Wing patch is worn on the other.  The squadron patch, if worn, is placed half way from name tape to shoulder.  That's why you don't see the Pie type patch on pockets in the Air Force.  It isn't that complicated, so why isn't everyone on board?

As far as Syracuse Comp Sqdn patch, I will forward a redesign of the patch tomy superiors ASAP to be implemented with the next patch order.

The problem begins with the simple fact that we don't place the patches in the same place as the AF.  So should we go with the AF standard that patches on the pocket should be shields or that it is a squadron patch and us that information.  Also, most of the wing patches don't follow the standard set forth in the Air Force heraldry, so to be different from the wing patch, squadrons have been using shields.

the best option would be to completely follow the Air Force heraldry standards, starting with the Wing Patch and placement of patches.  I don't see that happening though.

SJT

Our patches aren't totally off in placement.  USAF puts on patches on their pockets.  MAJCOM on one, and Wing on the other. The squadron patch, if used, is placed on right chest, above the name tape, basically where the ES patch now goes. However, most airmen don't wear their squadron patch.  Many do wear their occupational patches though... "Red Horse" and "Prime Beef" units are a good example. I suspect the reason why squadrons made their patches shield/scrolls is so that their uniforms look like the USAF ones with shield/scroll patches on pockets.  Speaking of... we totally could change the look by simply changing the concept... we should have done it years ago... Region patch (to replace MAJCOM) and Wing patch (to replace Wing), both done in proper heraldry in shield/scroll form to be worn on pockets.  Squadron patch optional to be worn on upper right chest.  Too late now, but would have made a lot of sense.

Anyway, the point for BDU's is pretty lost since the new ABU has no patches authorized what so ever. The AF already authorized CAP to wear the ABU once it becomes available, so if/when CAP issues the order, I suspect our patches will be gone too. We shouldn't nix the patches all together though... we'll still be wearing Zoom Bags with lots of purdy patches on them.
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GEORGE LURYE
LtCol White
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 959

« Reply #65 on: January 12, 2007, 03:00:16 PM »



Thanks.

The 16 in the patch is the Wing number. It was carried over from our Wing Patch.  We liked the Winged Fleur de lis on our wing patch and wanted to preserve this since the wing patches are out. The RWB colors make it patriotic for the US and also our French heritage.

It also follows the USAF guidelines which we felt was a necessary requirement.
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LtCol David P. White CAP   
HQ LAWG

Admiral, Great Navy of the State of Nebraska

Diplomacy - The ability to tell someone to "Go to hell" and have them look forward to making the trip.
MIKE
Super Moderator

Posts: 5,471
Unit: LANTAREA

« Reply #66 on: January 12, 2007, 03:14:04 PM »

Anyway, the point for BDU's is pretty lost since the new ABU has no patches authorized what so ever. The AF already authorized CAP to wear the ABU once it becomes available, so if/when CAP issues the order, I suspect our patches will be gone too. We shouldn't nix the patches all together though... we'll still be wearing Zoom Bags with lots of purdy patches on them.

One can only hope.  Note that you aren't supposed to wear unit patches on CAP bags... A point apparently lost on many members.

At this point I would advise against producing actual patches... Although logos would be fine for letterhead and such.  Wait and see.  I would rather have a nice black t-shirt or mock turtleneck with the patch logo on it than the patch itself.  All in all it's something that isn't required... but if you make a patch you are gonna want everyone to wear 'em. Or at least pay to have 'em made.
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Mike Johnston
MIKE
Super Moderator

Posts: 5,471
Unit: LANTAREA

« Reply #67 on: January 12, 2007, 03:31:48 PM »

Here is the patch I designed for the 91st All Iowa Squadron that was recently approved by the IAWG/CC. 



Not to be overly critical, but if the unit name is the 91st All Iowa Squadron, why isn't it in one of the scrolls? (The bottom.)  Looking at it as an outsider it is hard to discern what's what.

Edit: Fixed misquote.  Apologies to Lt Col White.
« Last Edit: January 12, 2007, 05:11:43 PM by MIKE » Logged
Mike Johnston
LtCol White
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 959

« Reply #68 on: January 12, 2007, 03:33:21 PM »

Mike, you quoted my comment about the LA patch but were talking about the Iowa patch.
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LtCol David P. White CAP   
HQ LAWG

Admiral, Great Navy of the State of Nebraska

Diplomacy - The ability to tell someone to "Go to hell" and have them look forward to making the trip.
MIKE
Super Moderator

Posts: 5,471
Unit: LANTAREA

« Reply #69 on: January 12, 2007, 03:37:46 PM »

Mike, you quoted my comment about the LA patch but were talking about the Iowa patch.

My bad... I was thinking you were from Iowa for some reason.  ???
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Mike Johnston
LtCol White
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 959

« Reply #70 on: January 12, 2007, 03:51:19 PM »

Well Katrina tried to push us up that way. LOL
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LtCol David P. White CAP   
HQ LAWG

Admiral, Great Navy of the State of Nebraska

Diplomacy - The ability to tell someone to "Go to hell" and have them look forward to making the trip.
TDHenderson
Member

Posts: 88

« Reply #71 on: January 12, 2007, 05:12:05 PM »

The colors are from the state flag.  Iowa was originally part of the Louisianna Purchase so the colors came from the French tricolor.

As far as the text I don't really have an answer other than the full Squadron name would not have fit in the template (or would have with very very small text).  Most of us in Iowa refer to other squadrons by their number anyway so that is also a reason.  We refer to ourselves as the Ninety First more than we do the 91st All Iowa Squadron.
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MIKE
Super Moderator

Posts: 5,471
Unit: LANTAREA

« Reply #72 on: January 12, 2007, 05:20:36 PM »

You could abbreviate squadron as SQ and it would mostly likely fit.
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Mike Johnston
DNall
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 3,721

« Reply #73 on: January 12, 2007, 05:48:54 PM »

The French invade Iowa recently?  Dang beat me to it.

Not that I like it much, but here's ours:
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Major Carrales
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 4,107

« Reply #74 on: January 12, 2007, 06:15:57 PM »

The French invade Iowa recently?  Dang beat me to it.

Not that I like it much, but here's ours:


That's a dang good patch...I must admit it is pleasing to the eye.
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"We have been given the power to change CAP, let's keep the momentum going!"

Major Joe Ely "Sparky" Carrales, CAP
Commander
Coastal Bend Cadet Squadron
SWR-TX-454
DNall
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 3,721

« Reply #75 on: January 12, 2007, 06:20:30 PM »

why thank you sir. I'll make sure to pass that along to the guy that designed it back before written history & mastery of fire. Just minor updates over the years.  :D
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JohnKachenmeister
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 3,352

« Reply #76 on: January 12, 2007, 08:52:23 PM »

Mike:

What is the white design in the center?  It looks like it forms an ace of spades at the top of the patch, but when you firstlook at it, it looks like a dead chicken held upside down.

A tribute to Iowa's poultry farms, perhaps?
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Another former CAP officer
TDHenderson
Member

Posts: 88

« Reply #77 on: January 12, 2007, 09:23:26 PM »

Hey now!  Play nice...

The ACE formed by the wings of the Phoenix symbolize our three primary missions.

Aerospace Education
Cadet Programs
Emergency Services
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TDHenderson
Member

Posts: 88

« Reply #78 on: January 12, 2007, 09:56:35 PM »

OK, made some adjustments based upon comments received.  The squadron name is now complete on the bottom and the squadron motto in latin is on the top.  That translates to "For Our Neighbor".

Better?

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Major Carrales
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 4,107

« Reply #79 on: January 12, 2007, 09:59:19 PM »

OK - now I am confused.  You say this is >your< unit's insignia?

Maj. Owen Younger was one of the IC's down at Katrina, and was wearing that patch as well.  Even if he was a wall flowere before (which he doesn't appear to be, I would think he received some visibility when he got back and since.

You really aren't aware of him?

Major Younger is the IC of this weekend's January DSARex.
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"We have been given the power to change CAP, let's keep the momentum going!"

Major Joe Ely "Sparky" Carrales, CAP
Commander
Coastal Bend Cadet Squadron
SWR-TX-454
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CAP Talk  |  General Discussion  |  Uniforms & Awards  |  Topic: The Best of Squadron Patches
 


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