Salutations, Uniforms and O-Clubs, Part Two

[pixelwonk]

Private Pilot = 2d Lt
...with commander's approval, of course.

[Nomex Maximus]

As a new butterbar you likely owed everyone their a salute, whether they return it is irrelevant.

I thought Nomex was a 1LT because he's a pilot...

Nomex is a 2Lt on his collar...
... but the next Supreme National Commander in his mind. Watch out!

[Pylon]

Nomex is a 2Lt on his collar...
... but the next Supreme National Commander in his mind. Watch out!

We've had one too many of those "Supreme" National Commanders... don't fall into that trap. 

[Al Sayre]

As a new butterbar you likely owed everyone their a salute, whether they return it is irrelevant.

I thought Nomex was a 1LT because he's a pilot...

Nomex is a 2Lt on his collar...
... but the next Supreme National Commander in his mind. Watch out!

You'll have to get in line behind Colgan and me...

[davedove]

Salutes are not given to anyone wearing a golf shirt.  Unless a person is wearing a USAF-style uniform (or the CMoH is hanging around their neck) they are not saluted - regardless of rank.

I thought the custom is to salute a senior upon recognition (assuming it is appropriate under the circumstances) without regard to whether the officer is wearing uniform or civilian clothing?

Only when wearing military-style uniform (not CAP corporate uniform).

This came up in our unit one night, so we looked up the requirements.  In CAPP 151 it states:

(1) You salute when in military-style uniform.

Thus, it matters what you are wearing, not what the other person is wearing.  So, if you are wearing a military-style uniform and you recognize a higher-ranking individual, you salute, regardless of what he/she is wearing.

[Walkman]

As a new butterbar you likely owed everyone their a salute, whether they return it is irrelevant.

I thought Nomex was a 1LT because he's a pilot...

Nomex is a 2Lt on his collar...
... but the next Supreme National Commander in his mind. Watch out!

Whoops, my bad. 

[O-Rex]

As usual, we're concentrating on the peas-n-carrots, and not the meat: I certainly hope that the conference was worthwhile and informative for all.

My experience at Wing/ Region conferences and the like is that they are usually "no salute" events: with all the cadets in attendance, Seniors may as well walk around with their hand plastered to their foreheads. . . .

[Nomex Maximus]

My comments here deal with the trivial and amusing. Perhaps trivially amusing. I did get useful info out of the conference but that was not the point of this thread.

Five more hours and I go flying!

[Eclipse]

I thought the custom is to salute a senior upon recognition (assuming it is appropriate under the circumstances) without regard to whether the officer is wearing uniform or civilian clothing?

Only when wearing military-style uniform (not CAP corporate uniform).

It >is< the custom. 

I share Grumpy's "GRRRRR".

This idea that you'll only salute if you expect one to be returned is ridiculous.  what is this?  6th grade?
A lot of our members come from units where courtesies are ignores or disdained - and one way to help fix that situation is to SALUTE PEOPLE.

Peer pressure works.  At some point they will get the idea that at least you expect CAP customs and courtesies to be followed, whether they do it back home is irrelevant, they will at least think about it the next time it comes up.

Saluting is not a sign of submission, as some people seem to feel, it is a sign of respect, friendship, and salutation.

Pick one and get over yourself.

[A.Member]

I thought the custom is to salute a senior upon recognition (assuming it is appropriate under the circumstances) without regard to whether the officer is wearing uniform or civilian clothing?

Only when wearing military-style uniform (not CAP corporate uniform).

This came up in our unit one night, so we looked up the requirements.  In CAPP 151 it states:

(1) You salute when in military-style uniform.

Thus, it matters what you are wearing, not what the other person is wearing.  So, if you are wearing a military-style uniform and you recognize a higher-ranking individual, you salute, regardless of what he/she is wearing.

This is true and your clarification is appreciated. 

However, how do you make such a determination from someone in a golf shirt or a blazer?  Real world answer:  You can't and they shouldn't expect a salute.  Likewise, those wearing civilian attire aren't obligated to salute someone wearing a USAF-style uniform either.

http://level2.cap.gov/Prof_Dev_Modules/cap_lesson_10/lesson10_html/lesson10.htm

NOTE: CAP military style uniforms include Service Dress, long and short sleeve blue shirt combinations, BDU, and Flight Suit for which military customs and courtesies apply. The CAP blazer is considered civilian attire and all customs and courtesies observed while wearing this blazer should follow civilian attire procedures.

[A.Member]

It >is< the custom. 

I share Grumpy's "GRRRRR".

This idea that you'll only salute if you expect one to be returned is ridiculous.  what is this?  6th grade?

Where did you come up with this?  Whether a return salute is expected was never part of the discussion.  Nonetheless, as continued below, a nice professional response.    Well done.

A lot of our members come from units where courtesies are ignores or disdained - and one way to help fix that situation is to SALUTE PEOPLE.

Peer pressure works.  At some point they will get the idea that at least you expect CAP customs and courtesies to be followed, whether they do it back home is irrelevant, they will at least think about it the next time it comes up.

Saluting is not a sign of submission, as some people seem to feel, it is a sign of respect, friendship, and salutation.

Pick one and get over yourself.

It's a matter of expectations.  Will anyone chastise a person for offering a salute to a senior officer not in a military-style uniform?  No.  At the sametime however, that senior officer should not expect or assume they will be offered a salute when in civilian attire (i.e. golf shirt, blazer). 

[Eclipse]

redacted as more wasted 1's and 0's.

[A.Member]

redacted as more wasted 1's and 0's.

No worries.  I saw the original comment.  You clearly lead by example.

[pixelwonk]

Some people you just can't reach.   *Lock*


I hope, nay, strongly recommend that further threads regarding this ES Conference (if there must be any) break from the sexy topic fodder such as who wore what uniforms, who didn't get a salute, (honestly, guys... geez.) and O-club worries, and instead focus on the content of the conference.

or don't bother.