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Author Topic: CAP as an IMA Reservist  (Read 2240 times)
bpettitt
Newbie

Posts: 4

« on: April 09, 2019, 05:11:58 AM »

I'm an IMA in USAFR with 10 years prior service, now considering joining my local CAP squadron.  The folks here haven't dealt with active Reservists before, so we're trying to feel the process out.  It seems that I have two participation options:

1. Under CAPRAP I could serve as an IMA performing additional duty, or
2. Simply register as a new senior member instead. 

It also appears that as a MSgt (E-7) I'm eligible to join in a CAP officer billet.

 I would sincerely welcome any advice regarding the pros/cons of these choices.

Thanks!
Brian P.
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Fubar
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Posts: 765

« Reply #1 on: April 09, 2019, 05:29:46 AM »

Do you need the retirement points? I believe that's why reservists end up in the CAP-RAP program, the folks I've worked with tended to be at the end of their careers and for whatever reason needed a few more points before they pulled the plug.

As for joining CAP or assisting via CAPRAP, that's entirely up to what you'd like to do. If you want to participate in CAP doing what CAP members do, then join a local squadron. I've never met a reservist in the CAP-RAP program that was there simply to hang out with CAP or do CAP stuff, so I'm not even sure you can do that.

As for a CAP grade if you join, one of the first things you'll learn about CAP is our grade structure looks familiar, but does not operate at all like the military does. There are no functional differences between being an E or an O in CAP, we're all worker bees where authority is based on position, not grade. Heck, you can't even trust a person's grade to reflect their CAP experience.
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MSG Mac
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« Reply #2 on: April 09, 2019, 03:04:41 PM »

Call USAF-CAP (or the  Region LO) for the doís and dontís Of the CAP-RAP program. Compare it with CAP membership. Two vastly different programs.
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Michael P. McEleney
Lt Col CAP
MSG USA (Retired)
Eclipse
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« Reply #3 on: April 09, 2019, 03:42:49 PM »

The local squadron people really don't need to deal with you as a "reservist" per se.

If you become affiliated with CAP as a CAP-RAP, then you won't be a member of the squadron,
and if you join, your Reservist status isn't really relevent beyond your own PD.

1. Under CAPRAP I could serve as an IMA performing additional duty, or

This is true, however you will not be a "member" per se.  You would not be attending meetings,
participate in ES missions (other then as an occasional observer or evaluator), nor could you hold
any staff role or earn ratings or PD grade, etc.  In short you would be one of the "eyes and ears"
of CAP-USAF, assisting in oversight of the program, but not participating in it.

Your USAF grade remains the same, and you would be eligible for per diem and retirement points
based on your circumstance and assignments.

It's also not something you "join" (which I'm sure you understand), but would need to coordinate with
a local LR-ADO as to whether there are available slots and your military status qualifies.

I personally know of excellent RAPs who have been doing it for 10+ years even promoting during that time.
These are >very< active nationally and attend activities all over the place.

It also appears that as a MSgt (E-7) I'm eligible to join in a CAP officer billet.
Upon joining and completing Level 1 you would be eligible for the below:

Immediate promotion to Second Lieutenant (which everyone is eligible for after 6 months).
From there you would participate in the normal cycle of PD training and TIG towards the officer grades.

You could retain your military-equivalent NCO grade of E-7, wearing the CAP-style NCO stripes,
in which case you would only be eligible for promotion if you are promoted in your service, or are assigned
certain CAP jobs at Group or Wing.

There is no difference in assignments, status, or authority between NCOs and Officers in CAP, other then you
will be saluting more then anyone else (there are very few adult NCOs in CAP), and you can't be a Unit Commander,
unless you are, which isn't allowed, except when it is, in which case you're not supposed to, even though it's done.

You USAF training like NCO Academy and other classes you've completed may qualify as equivalent for
some CAP classes needed for Specialty Tracks and Professional Development advancement.
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Jester
Seasoned Member

Posts: 389

« Reply #4 on: April 09, 2019, 05:00:29 PM »

If you have CAP NCO questions and want answers from an a CAP NCO, shoot me a message.
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abdsp51
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« Reply #5 on: April 09, 2019, 11:45:40 PM »



You USAF training like NCO Academy and other classes you've completed may qualify as equivalent for
some CAP classes needed for Specialty Tracks and Professional Development advancement.

USAF  PD will transfer over as long as he requests it...
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bpettitt
Newbie

Posts: 4

« Reply #6 on: April 12, 2019, 12:05:41 AM »

If you have CAP NCO questions and want answers from an a CAP NCO, shoot me a message.

PM sent, thanks!
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bpettitt
Newbie

Posts: 4

« Reply #7 on: April 12, 2019, 12:23:45 AM »

Thank you all for the detailed and comprehensive replies -- I really appreciate the feedback!!

So, the squadron here in Okinawa, Japan is just starting to rebuild under the leadership of a new commander and they haven't even heard of CAPRAP, so they've recommended I simply join as a senior member. 

From what I've gathered from your replies, it seems that my first step should be to call back to the Pacific Region office at Beale AFB to find out if CAPRAP is even an option for me here, either in a permanent CAPRAP billet or as an additional duty to my present IMA position.  Barring that, my only option is to join CAP as a senior member. 

We'll see how it goes.....
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Eclipse
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« Reply #8 on: April 12, 2019, 12:49:03 AM »

Ah, an overseas squadron is another beast entirely.  Same general program but with some limitations
and nuance due to being in a foreign country.

It will be interesting to see how and if they can use RAPs "over there".
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Ohioguard
Member

Posts: 53

« Reply #9 on: April 12, 2019, 02:16:03 AM »

We had a CAPRAP assigned to the Okinawa Cadet Squadron back in the 80s.  He was an SES assigned on the island and was a reserve CMSgt.  He was helpful coordinating with the command staff on the base.  We had great support from the AF and had a wonderful unit.

Glad to hear that it is still going.  I spent five great years, four as commander, with that unit.



Lt Col J. Wandell, CAP
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abdsp51
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« Reply #10 on: April 12, 2019, 03:22:57 AM »

Ah, an overseas squadron is another beast entirely.  Same general program but with some limitations
and nuance due to being in a foreign country.

It will be interesting to see how and if they can use RAPs "over there".

Doubtful oversas squadrons do not fall into the traditional structure of CAP.
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abdsp51
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« Reply #11 on: April 12, 2019, 03:23:34 AM »

Thank you all for the detailed and comprehensive replies -- I really appreciate the feedback!!

So, the squadron here in Okinawa, Japan is just starting to rebuild under the leadership of a new commander and they haven't even heard of CAPRAP, so they've recommended I simply join as a senior member. 

From what I've gathered from your replies, it seems that my first step should be to call back to the Pacific Region office at Beale AFB to find out if CAPRAP is even an option for me here, either in a permanent CAPRAP billet or as an additional duty to my present IMA position.  Barring that, my only option is to join CAP as a senior member. 

We'll see how it goes.....

Pm me I can provide info for you. 
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bpettitt
Newbie

Posts: 4

« Reply #12 on: April 12, 2019, 03:53:30 AM »


Pm me I can provide info for you.
[/quote]

PM sent, thanks!
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PHall
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Posts: 6,549

« Reply #13 on: April 12, 2019, 04:18:47 AM »

Thank you all for the detailed and comprehensive replies -- I really appreciate the feedback!!

So, the squadron here in Okinawa, Japan is just starting to rebuild under the leadership of a new commander and they haven't even heard of CAPRAP, so they've recommended I simply join as a senior member. 

From what I've gathered from your replies, it seems that my first step should be to call back to the Pacific Region office at Beale AFB to find out if CAPRAP is even an option for me here, either in a permanent CAPRAP billet or as an additional duty to my present IMA position.  Barring that, my only option is to join CAP as a senior member. 

We'll see how it goes.....


Part of the problem with the overseas units like Kadena is the fact that the membership, with a few exceptions, is only there for a couple of years. Continuity is a big problem. Not to mention the problems with Base Commanders, some actually follow the regs and support CAP and others ignore us and hope we will go away.
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SarDragon
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Unit: NAVAIRPAC

« Reply #14 on: April 12, 2019, 05:54:49 AM »

I was in the Misawa, Japan squadron for 2.5 years. The commander when I got there was First Shirt for the base services squadron, so we had excellent relations with the base CO. When I took over, I interviewed with a new base commander, who just happened to be a former CAP member, so things were still good. My relief was a Navy E-5 Spaatzen.

Our cadet were all military dependents, so there was a constant flux of members. I think our largest cadet membership while I was there was 13.
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Dave Bowles
Maj, CAP
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flyboy53
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Posts: 923

« Reply #15 on: April 12, 2019, 03:02:07 PM »

I'm an IMA in USAFR with 10 years prior service, now considering joining my local CAP squadron.  The folks here haven't dealt with active Reservists before, so we're trying to feel the process out.  It seems that I have two participation options:

1. Under CAPRAP I could serve as an IMA performing additional duty, or
2. Simply register as a new senior member instead. 

It also appears that as a MSgt (E-7) I'm eligible to join in a CAP officer billet.

 I would sincerely welcome any advice regarding the pros/cons of these choices.

Thanks!
Brian P.

Certainly you can join, however, having done this, I would strongly suggest just doing the CAPRAP because of the potential retirement points and M-days, and avoid trying to mix it until you have finished your reserve career. Depending on where you are assigned, your commander does have the authority to require that you can be a member but now allow you to wear the uniform, especially if the squadron is on a military base. (As happened to me -- and the commander BTW was a brigadier general.)

During my CAP/USAF tours, I did CAPRAP as an additional duty to coincide with being assigned militarily as a CAP base liaison and once even being the CAP unit's building custodian -- meaning I wasn't the cleaner but was responsible for the building where the CAP maintained two headquarters.

I maintained my CAP membership mostly through my Air Force career, retiring in 1994. Free of that side, I went back to the CAP, retiring in 2015 with 44 1/2 years service.
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abdsp51
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« Reply #16 on: April 12, 2019, 05:17:07 PM »

I'm an IMA in USAFR with 10 years prior service, now considering joining my local CAP squadron.  The folks here haven't dealt with active Reservists before, so we're trying to feel the process out.  It seems that I have two participation options:

1. Under CAPRAP I could serve as an IMA performing additional duty, or
2. Simply register as a new senior member instead. 

It also appears that as a MSgt (E-7) I'm eligible to join in a CAP officer billet.

 I would sincerely welcome any advice regarding the pros/cons of these choices.

Thanks!
Brian P.

Certainly you can join, however, having done this, I would strongly suggest just doing the CAPRAP because of the potential retirement points and M-days, and avoid trying to mix it until you have finished your reserve career. Depending on where you are assigned, your commander does have the authority to require that you can be a member but now allow you to wear the uniform, especially if the squadron is on a military base. (As happened to me -- and the commander BTW was a brigadier general.)

During my CAP/USAF tours, I did CAPRAP as an additional duty to coincide with being assigned militarily as a CAP base liaison and once even being the CAP unit's building custodian -- meaning I wasn't the cleaner but was responsible for the building where the CAP maintained two headquarters.

I maintained my CAP membership mostly through my Air Force career, retiring in 1994. Free of that side, I went back to the CAP, retiring in 2015 with 44 1/2 years service.

No CAP/RAP for overseas units.
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flyboy53
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Posts: 923

« Reply #17 on: April 12, 2019, 08:15:22 PM »

I'm an IMA in USAFR with 10 years prior service, now considering joining my local CAP squadron.  The folks here haven't dealt with active Reservists before, so we're trying to feel the process out.  It seems that I have two participation options:

1. Under CAPRAP I could serve as an IMA performing additional duty, or
2. Simply register as a new senior member instead. 

It also appears that as a MSgt (E-7) I'm eligible to join in a CAP officer billet.

 I would sincerely welcome any advice regarding the pros/cons of these choices.

Thanks!
Brian P.

Certainly you can join, however, having done this, I would strongly suggest just doing the CAPRAP because of the potential retirement points and M-days, and avoid trying to mix it until you have finished your reserve career. Depending on where you are assigned, your commander does have the authority to require that you can be a member but now allow you to wear the uniform, especially if the squadron is on a military base. (As happened to me -- and the commander BTW was a brigadier general.)

During my CAP/USAF tours, I did CAPRAP as an additional duty to coincide with being assigned militarily as a CAP base liaison and once even being the CAP unit's building custodian -- meaning I wasn't the cleaner but was responsible for the building where the CAP maintained two headquarters.

I maintained my CAP membership mostly through my Air Force career, retiring in 1994. Free of that side, I went back to the CAP, retiring in 2015 with 44 1/2 years service.

No CAP/RAP for overseas units.

Then that means the IMA's program manager or assignment leadership would have a role in determining CAP participation and if it could be used toward the points and M-days.

Seems funny that there are no CAPRAP positions overseas when I knew one during my tour overseas -- but that was 1978-80. I realize that times change.
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Eclipse
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« Reply #18 on: April 12, 2019, 09:19:48 PM »

Seems funny that there are no CAPRAP positions overseas when I knew one during my tour overseas -- but that was 1978-80. I realize that times change.

The program has shrunk significantly in just the last 10 years.

BITD there was an NCO and Officer as LO's in every wing, now there are less then eight LR-ADOs nationally (last I checked).

Same goes for RAPS, they used to be all over the place, now they can be hard to come by.
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PHall
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« Reply #19 on: April 12, 2019, 10:40:59 PM »

AFRC had to cut manpower positions 10 years ago. Wanna guess one of the first places they made cuts was?
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flyboy53
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Posts: 923

« Reply #20 on: April 15, 2019, 01:04:38 PM »

AFRC had to cut manpower positions 10 years ago. Wanna guess one of the first places they made cuts was?

Worse than in 1994? That was the first major cut and it directly impacted me.
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