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CAP Talk  |  Operations  |  Aviation & Flying Activities  |  Topic: Do cadets need FAA medical and written test for flight training? (not O flights)
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jfkspotting
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« on: December 27, 2018, 12:48:30 AM »

can cadets immediately start flying, or do they need the medical and the written exam?

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mdickinson
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« Reply #1 on: December 27, 2018, 02:18:10 AM »

No one (cadet or otherwise) needs to take an FAA medical exam before beginning their flight training. The medical exam is only needed in order to solo a powered airplane.

No one (cadet or otherwise) needs to complete the FAA knowledge test ("written") before beginning flight training. The knowledge test is only needed in order to take an FAA checkride (in an airplane or a glider).

In the past, wings have other requirements before a cadet can begin flight training. However the current regulation 70-1 specifically says "6.1.3.3. No additional written authorization or approval to receive flight instruction with a CAP Instructor Pilot is required for cadets IAW this regulation." Based on that, I guess a cadet can start flying as soon as s/he finds an instructor who is willing. I wonder how well wings will obey this new line in the regulation.

Having seen how many cadet dreams of flight training die out before completing training, I always like to get a letter from the cadet first, stating their calculation of the total cost to complete the private certificate, and acknowledging the time commitment (number of hours of dual; of solo; of studying for the knowledge test; of driving back and forth to the airport). Since it's not a "written authorization," I intend to continue to ask for this preliminary weeding-out step before starting training - I think most instructors agree that they would rather not invest ten or twenty hours on someone who is going to run out of time or money halfway through the training.
« Last Edit: December 27, 2018, 02:21:15 AM by mdickinson » Report to moderator   Logged
OldGuy
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« Reply #2 on: December 27, 2018, 06:10:55 AM »

Having seen how many cadet dreams of flight training die out before completing training, I always like to get a letter from the cadet first, stating their calculation of the total cost to complete the private certificate, and acknowledging the time commitment (number of hours of dual; of solo; of studying for the knowledge test; of driving back and forth to the airport). Since it's not a "written authorization," I intend to continue to ask for this preliminary weeding-out step before starting training - I think most instructors agree that they would rather not invest ten or twenty hours on someone who is going to run out of time or money halfway through the training.

My appreciation of the sacrifices many made to get me a flight scholarship 42 years ago is boundless, and I am especially glad that my CFI - Capt. Washington, if I recall correctly, did not share that opinion. I never solo'd, but my whole life was impacted by my 10 hours of "stick time" with that patient, extraordinary man. That my budget did not extend beyond the scholarship mattered not, so far as I could tell. What mattered was my earnest desire to fly, to learn - and I did. And those lesson have stayed with me my whole life.

Lesson one - prepare for the journey. Armor yourself with knowledge.

Lesson two - checklists matter. What a life lesson.

Lesson three - fuel matters, check it yourself. Inspect everything yourself.

Lesson four - "Where will you land NOW?" Not where are you going, not what are you hoping, but right now - where will you land?

Lesson five - clean up and make everything ready for the next person.

Lesson final - this took a long time, be grateful, show gratitude. Sadly I suspect I never told Capt. Washington what a gift he was to me, but I also suspect he knew the truth from the very first flight.

To every pilot, to every donor, to every single senior member who has ever helped foster the love of flight in a young heart - thank you, from me and from them. It was worth it.

(P.S. I am back in the cockpit again, MS qualified, AP and MO trainee and thinking about a private license. The license may never happen, but the joy of flight remains. As does my true gratitude. Merry Christmas to one and all.)
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etodd
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« Reply #3 on: December 27, 2018, 08:13:43 PM »


Having seen how many cadet dreams of flight training die out before completing training, I always like to get a letter from the cadet first, stating their calculation of the total cost to complete the private certificate, and acknowledging the time commitment (number of hours of dual; of solo; of studying for the knowledge test; of driving back and forth to the airport). Since it's not a "written authorization," I intend to continue to ask for this preliminary weeding-out step before starting training - I think most instructors agree that they would rather not invest ten or twenty hours on someone who is going to run out of time or money halfway through the training.

^^^ THIS .... is what makes me wonder how all the new scholarship funding will be doled out. If the idea is to produce future commercial pilots, then the funding for PPL should go to Cadets who have the financial backing from parents or others to continue their training up to CFI or better. How many will just get their free PPL and then stop?
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Eclipse
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« Reply #4 on: December 27, 2018, 08:19:44 PM »


Having seen how many cadet dreams of flight training die out before completing training, I always like to get a letter from the cadet first, stating their calculation of the total cost to complete the private certificate, and acknowledging the time commitment (number of hours of dual; of solo; of studying for the knowledge test; of driving back and forth to the airport). Since it's not a "written authorization," I intend to continue to ask for this preliminary weeding-out step before starting training - I think most instructors agree that they would rather not invest ten or twenty hours on someone who is going to run out of time or money halfway through the training.

^^^ THIS .... is what makes me wonder how all the new scholarship funding will be doled out. If the idea is to produce future commercial pilots, then the funding for PPL should go to Cadets who have the financial backing from parents or others to continue their training up to CFI or better. How many will just get their free PPL and then stop?

And how, exactly, would you ascertain that?

Just because mom and dad have a nice house, they are not obligated to fund college or anything else.

Or does CAP start giving out "means-based" scholarships only to cadets who don't need the money?

If the goal is commercial pilots, let the airlines pay for them
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Mitchell 1969
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« Reply #5 on: December 27, 2018, 09:58:36 PM »


Having seen how many cadet dreams of flight training die out before completing training, I always like to get a letter from the cadet first, stating their calculation of the total cost to complete the private certificate, and acknowledging the time commitment (number of hours of dual; of solo; of studying for the knowledge test; of driving back and forth to the airport). Since it's not a "written authorization," I intend to continue to ask for this preliminary weeding-out step before starting training - I think most instructors agree that they would rather not invest ten or twenty hours on someone who is going to run out of time or money halfway through the training.

^^^ THIS .... is what makes me wonder how all the new scholarship funding will be doled out. If the idea is to produce future commercial pilots, then the funding for PPL should go to Cadets who have the financial backing from parents or others to continue their training up to CFI or better. How many will just get their free PPL and then stop?

And how, exactly, would you ascertain that?

Just because mom and dad have a nice house, they are not obligated to fund college or anything else.

Or does CAP start giving out "means-based" scholarships only to cadets who don't need the money?

If the goal is commercial pilots, let the airlines pay for them

There are many commercial pilots who have never entered and who never will enter the flight deck of an airliner. Why would the airlines possibly want to pay for them?


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CAP has been bery, bery good to me.
Mitchell 1969
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« Reply #6 on: December 27, 2018, 10:13:09 PM »


Having seen how many cadet dreams of flight training die out before completing training, I always like to get a letter from the cadet first, stating their calculation of the total cost to complete the private certificate, and acknowledging the time commitment (number of hours of dual; of solo; of studying for the knowledge test; of driving back and forth to the airport). Since it's not a "written authorization," I intend to continue to ask for this preliminary weeding-out step before starting training - I think most instructors agree that they would rather not invest ten or twenty hours on someone who is going to run out of time or money halfway through the training.

^^^ THIS .... is what makes me wonder how all the new scholarship funding will be doled out. If the idea is to produce future commercial pilots, then the funding for PPL should go to Cadets who have the financial backing from parents or others to continue their training up to CFI or better. How many will just get their free PPL and then stop?

This brings up an oft-forgotten fact from the past.

During the “Cadet Flying Encampment Days,” of the 60’s-70’s, cadets were expected to report with 1). A passing score on the Private Pilot Written (there was no time to get it administered at the flight school and get the score back - and a failing score in the field  resulted in no Airman’s Certificate), and, 2). A student pilot/medical certificate showing that the cadet had passed a SECOND class Medical. The idea was that the  free* PPL would eventually lead to getting paid to fly - turning out weekend flyers who could only fly friends and family (or even CAP people)  didn’t help
the “train them for a career” mission.

* It wasn’t totally free. We had to pay $98 for a meal card, plus buy an E6B and a plotter, so about $115 for a Private Pilot Airman’s Certificate.


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Bernard J. Wilson, Major, CAP

Mitchell 1969; Earhart 1971; Eaker 1973. Cadet Flying Encampment, License, 1970. IACE New Zealand 1971; IACE Korea 1973.

CAP has been bery, bery good to me.
Eclipse
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« Reply #7 on: December 27, 2018, 10:15:19 PM »

There are many commercial pilots who have never entered and who never will enter the flight deck of an airliner. Why would the airlines possibly want to pay for them?

I was thinking and assuming etodd was referring to airline pilots, which I realize aren't the only "commercial" pilots.
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etodd
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« Reply #8 on: December 27, 2018, 10:54:45 PM »

There are many commercial pilots who have never entered and who never will enter the flight deck of an airliner. Why would the airlines possibly want to pay for them?

I was thinking and assuming etodd was referring to airline pilots, which I realize aren't the only "commercial" pilots.

Yes I could have worded it better. But the talk at Hdqs of how they want to use CAP to help with the "pilot shortage" situation, and is getting more funding for it, stills makes one wonder how the funds will be doled out, so that it actually helps with the shortage?  Give it to the poorest, and will they just stop after PPL? Give it to the rich, will they stop as well?  No crystal ball.  IOW, no way to predict if any of this will actually give us any more pilots to help with the shortage.  I would really like Hdqs to chime in with what I'm missing that will make all this work ...
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Live2Learn
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« Reply #9 on: December 28, 2018, 01:06:00 AM »

... Give it to the poorest, and will they just stop after PPL? Give it to the rich, will they stop as well?  ...

Interesting take.  Last I looked, it ain't "poor", nor is it "rich" that causes people to invest themselves in what it takes to be become pilots.  It's motivation and innate drive.  Money in the (parent's) bank can help, but isn't the last word.  Just wondering at this particular proposed model for creating commercial pilots.
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etodd
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« Reply #10 on: December 28, 2018, 03:56:27 AM »


Interesting take.  Last I looked, it ain't "poor", nor is it "rich" that causes people to invest themselves in what it takes to be become pilots.  It's motivation and innate drive.

Yep.  Lets hope the people that give out the funding will be able to discern which Cadets have the "motivation and innate drive".  ;D
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OldGuy
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« Reply #11 on: December 28, 2018, 06:04:49 AM »

Pre judgment is foolish. Give our cadets the opportunity, know that some will flourish, others not - for a while and some never. Trying to judge the future is a bootless exercise. Judge the now and do the best you can with what you have. My opinion, ymmv.
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etodd
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« Reply #12 on: December 28, 2018, 05:32:13 PM »

Pre judgment is foolish. Give our cadets the opportunity, know that some will flourish, others not - for a while and some never. Trying to judge the future is a bootless exercise. Judge the now and do the best you can with what you have. My opinion, ymmv.

Oh I agree completely. There really isn't a way to pre-judge, no crystal ball.  If all we wind up with are some Cadet PPLs that might be some of our next generation Senior Member Mission Pilots, that in itself would be a very good thing.  And would certainly inspire other Cadets to follow their lead. :)
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