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CAP Talk  |  General Discussion  |  Uniforms & Awards  |  Topic: Army adopts "Pinks and Greens" for 2020
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Author Topic: Army adopts "Pinks and Greens" for 2020  (Read 7521 times)
Eclipse
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« on: November 12, 2018, 08:35:36 PM »

Start the clock and take pool reservations on the Air Force service dress.

My guess is the USAF implements a new service dress design with a first-wear of FY20
and a sundown at the same time as the ABU in 2021. Which would then mean that
CAP isn't wearing anything the USAF is, offering additional opportunities to fix the multiform.



https://www.stripes.com/news/army/what-s-old-is-new-army-rolls-out-pinks-and-greens-service-uniform-1.556302
The new uniform, which officials said would be “cost-neutral” to enlisted soldiers and would not come at an
added cost to taxpayers, is expected to be fielded to soldiers reporting to their first units beginning in summer 2020.
All soldiers will be required to have the uniform for wear eight years after that.


https://www.armytimes.com/news/your-army/2018/11/11/for-veterans-day-the-army-has-a-present-a-long-awaited-new-service-uniform/

"The Army was able to straighten out its congressionally mandated notification requirements in time to announce on
Sunday, Veterans Day, that the much anticipated “Army Greens” will indeed be your next service uniform.

Formerly known as the “pinks and greens,” the World War II-era officers uniform could go Army-wide as soon as 2020,
according to a release that was posted Sunday to the Army’s website but was not shared through any of its social media channels.

“The current Army Blues Uniform will return to being a formal dress uniform, while the Army Greens will become the everyday
business-wear uniform for all soldiers,” the release said.

The new uniform will be “cost-neutral,” according to the Army, though details of the budgeting plan were not immediately available.

Sergeant Major of the Army Dan Dailey told Army Times in September that while higher quality materials translated to a dollar-for-dollar more expensive uniform, the fielding plan would negate some of those extra costs in the aggregate."


FWIW I like the crush caps...




Prototypes from earlier in the year.

« Last Edit: November 12, 2018, 09:26:49 PM by Eclipse » Report to moderator   Logged


TheSkyHornet
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« Reply #1 on: November 12, 2018, 08:42:41 PM »

I already saw last night a post on social media where someone said "I wish CAP would adopt the greens; they're so classy."

I hesitated to reply with "If you want to wear them so bad, you should have enlisted."

I have enough of a problem with constant uniform changes. I have an even greater issue when non-military members begin to insert themselves into discussions on military uniforms and how they wish they got to wear them, too.

Sorry for the soap box here. This is a real peeve.
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abdsp51
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« Reply #2 on: November 12, 2018, 10:09:21 PM »

The Army just went to blues not that long ago.  Seriously there better ways to invest in ones time and budget.
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NIN
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« Reply #3 on: November 12, 2018, 11:22:14 PM »

The Army just went to blues not that long ago.  Seriously there better ways to invest in ones time and budget.

Terrible decision, IMHO. Greens were just fine, but someone got caught up in the "good idea fairy" of uniform changes.

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CAPDepCom
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« Reply #4 on: November 12, 2018, 11:31:25 PM »

Great change and best looking style of uniform the Army ever issued, imo.
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Hawk200
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« Reply #5 on: November 12, 2018, 11:39:43 PM »

The Army just went to blues not that long ago.  Seriously there better ways to invest in ones time and budget.

That was eight years ago, and it was always supposed to be an interim uniform. The interim is now over, and we're getting a uniform with class. The greens were fine, but were not considered the best. Pinks and greens are classy. I'm looking forward to getting them. Hopefully, issued.

That being said, CAP doesn't need them. Our identity is linked to the Air Force, and should follow the Air Force in whatever uniform it chooses. 
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hfriday
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« Reply #6 on: November 12, 2018, 11:46:51 PM »

Wonderful uniform with such great historical connotation. Blues as a service uniform for the army puzzled me; I understand the tenuous connection to cavalry and all, but blue always seemed more associated with every other branch to me than the army.

You’re right that the Air Force and, by ripple effect, CAP, should not be going this direction. If the army’s glory days were beating Hitler, the Air Force’s were keeping the Russian bear at bay for a half century. Cold War-style, Curtis LeMay blues are what the Air Force belongs in.
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Hawk200
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« Reply #7 on: November 12, 2018, 11:52:14 PM »

Wonderful uniform with such great historical connotation. Blues as a service uniform for the army puzzled me; I understand the tenuous connection to cavalry and all, but blue always seemed more associated with every other branch to me than the army.

You’re right that the Air Force and, by ripple effect, CAP, should not be going this direction. If the army’s glory days were beating Hitler, the Air Force’s were keeping the Russian bear at bay for a half century. Cold War-style, Curtis LeMay blues are what the Air Force belongs in.

Very tenuous connections. A white shirt ruined that. If they'd gone with a royal blue shirt, and flipped the stripes (as tested,) the Army would have had a much closer connection.

Don't recall what the Lemay uniform design was, at the moment. Probably pretty classy too, I would imagine.
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Eclipse
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« Reply #8 on: November 12, 2018, 11:58:17 PM »

^ That would basically be the 4-pocket "I Dream of Jeannie" style still worn by CAP and USAFA cadets.





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PHall
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« Reply #9 on: November 13, 2018, 12:05:25 AM »

The Air Force has been working on a replacement for the current Mc Peak Special Service Dress Uniform for over 10 years now.
The Army changing their uniform won't make the slightest differance at all.
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Eclipse
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« Reply #10 on: November 13, 2018, 12:28:47 AM »

The Air Force has been working on a replacement for the current Mc Peak Special Service Dress Uniform for over 10 years now.
The Army changing their uniform won't make the slightest differance at all.

Chief Wright has been quoted as recently as Aug that they are working on a
new service uniform and that he favors the traditional styles.

Conjecture is piloting in 2019.  Considering how fast he moved on the OCPs,
it's highly likely.

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Hawk200
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« Reply #11 on: November 13, 2018, 12:35:33 AM »

^ That would basically be the 4-pocket "I Dream of Jeannie" style still worn by CAP and USAFA cadets still wear.....

I remember that one, wore it while in the Air Force. (It was actually phased out about a month and half before I left the Air Force.)

I was thinking Lemay had designed one of his own. Was wondering why nothing different was coming up.

At least the Air Force is looking at ditching the McPeak design. Never liked it. I am very glad that someone wants to get rid of it.
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PHall
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« Reply #12 on: November 13, 2018, 01:42:48 AM »

The Air Force has been working on a replacement for the current Mc Peak Special Service Dress Uniform for over 10 years now.
The Army changing their uniform won't make the slightest differance at all.

Chief Wright has been quoted as recently as Aug that they are working on a
new service uniform and that he favors the traditional styles.

Conjecture is piloting in 2019.  Considering how fast he moved on the OCPs,
it's highly likely.

Chief Wright's predecessor and his predecessor both said that too. There were threads here on CAP Talk about the "new" uniforms too.
Will believe it when I see it because they (they being the HAF Uniform folks) have said many more times then once that the new uniform is just around the corner.
Must be a really long block!
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etodd
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« Reply #13 on: November 13, 2018, 02:02:44 AM »

105,941 posts in the Uniform Forum. More than any other.  Obviously it's what is most important to so many CAP members. How many members would we lose if we just went to jeans and a t-shirt, and concentrated on the missions instead? Sad to think of what the number would be. To each his own.
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OldGuy
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« Reply #14 on: November 13, 2018, 03:09:39 AM »

No one probably cares, but in my opinion, the classiest uniform combo was the Ike Jacket with the long sleeved 1549 shade shirt and same shade trousers.

http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/199974-usaf-midnight-blue-dress-shirt/
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Holding Pattern
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« Reply #15 on: November 13, 2018, 06:15:35 AM »

105,941 posts in the Uniform Forum. More than any other. Obviously it's what is most important to so many CAP members.
Better would be to do an analysis to see if it is the same 17 posters making up 90% of those posts first...

How many members would we lose if we just went to jeans and a t-shirt, and concentrated on the missions instead? Sad to think of what the number would be. To each his own.

If you want to wear jeans and a tshirt and just focus on the mission, there are orgs for that.

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Hawk200
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« Reply #16 on: November 13, 2018, 10:40:25 AM »

No one probably cares, but in my opinion, the classiest uniform combo was the Ike Jacket with the long sleeved 1549 shade shirt and same shade trousers.

http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/199974-usaf-midnight-blue-dress-shirt/

I've always liked the Ike, and I've seen a few pics of the 1549 shirt(including a hospital commander that wore one with service dress for his Commander's photo,) and actually saw one in a surplus store downtown. That was a nice looking shirt.

It would be pretty sweet to see the old four pocket come back, with an Ike option, and the old dark blue shirt. Going back to the old classy uniforms.

How many members would we lose if we just went to jeans and a t-shirt, and concentrated on the missions instead? Sad to think of what the number would be. To each his own.

If you want to wear jeans and a tshirt and just focus on the mission, there are orgs for that.

I'll second that.
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NIN
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« Reply #17 on: November 13, 2018, 12:17:35 PM »

No one probably cares, but in my opinion, the classiest uniform combo was the Ike Jacket with the long sleeved 1549 shade shirt and same shade trousers.

http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/199974-usaf-midnight-blue-dress-shirt/

Combination Three (1549 shirt & trousers) was my *favorite* combo as a cadet. Only wore it like 3 times. Stuck out like a sore thumb.

If I was going to build a "historical uniform combo," that would be it.
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OldGuy
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« Reply #18 on: November 13, 2018, 01:04:17 PM »

No one probably cares, but in my opinion, the classiest uniform combo was the Ike Jacket with the long sleeved 1549 shade shirt and same shade trousers.

http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/199974-usaf-midnight-blue-dress-shirt/

Combination Three (1549 shirt & trousers) was my *favorite* combo as a cadet. Only wore it like 3 times. Stuck out like a sore thumb.

If I was going to build a "historical uniform combo," that would be it.
:) Truly a sharp as a razor combo!
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SarDragon
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« Reply #19 on: November 13, 2018, 08:35:53 PM »

I, like Nin, really liked the 1549 shirt combo. It looked great, and was very comfortable.
As for the Ike jacket, I thought it was uncomfortable, but it might have been due to fit issues while I was a cadet. I never wore it as an adult.
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Dave Bowles
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Eclipse
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« Reply #20 on: November 13, 2018, 09:13:40 PM »

https://usafflagranks.com/usaf_service_dress_ike_jacket.html
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MIKE
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« Reply #21 on: November 13, 2018, 09:18:19 PM »

Combination Three (1549 shirt & trousers) was my *favorite* combo as a cadet. Only wore it like 3 times. Stuck out like a sore thumb.

If I was going to build a "historical uniform combo," that would be it.

I have the Coast Guard version "Winter Dress Blue".  Looks really sharp, can only wear it November thru March... It's really warm as it is.
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Mike Johnston
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« Reply #22 on: November 14, 2018, 01:32:37 AM »

No one probably cares, but in my opinion, the classiest uniform combo was the Ike Jacket with the long sleeved 1549 shade shirt and same shade trousers.

http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/199974-usaf-midnight-blue-dress-shirt/

How did you manage to wear a uniform like that?

The Ike jacket was gone by 1966 and 1549’s didn’t come along until 1967.


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« Reply #23 on: November 14, 2018, 01:38:50 AM »

There were cadets wearing Ike Jackets in the 1980s in my area, still.

Might not have been authorized, but I doesn't mean there wasn't overlap. Our unis don't phase out at the same time as AF unis.
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OldGuy
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« Reply #24 on: November 14, 2018, 01:41:36 AM »

No one probably cares, but in my opinion, the classiest uniform combo was the Ike Jacket with the long sleeved 1549 shade shirt and same shade trousers.

http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/199974-usaf-midnight-blue-dress-shirt/

How did you manage to wear a uniform like that?

The Ike jacket was gone by 1966 and 1549’s didn’t come along until 1967.


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CAP often has old uniforms in stock. My first encampment (1973) we still wore khakis, IIRC. (And it may be my memory is malleable, an odd effect of age. If so, my apologies.)
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OldGuy
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« Reply #25 on: November 14, 2018, 02:05:52 AM »

Posted sans comment.
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Eclipse
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« Reply #26 on: November 14, 2018, 02:15:22 AM »

^ Just for clarity, those are the Feb 2018 prototypes and may not be the final version of the uniforms.
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NIN
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« Reply #27 on: November 14, 2018, 02:17:27 AM »



Just wish they'd gotten the SMA a hat that fit better here.. :)
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shuman14
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« Reply #28 on: November 14, 2018, 08:20:13 PM »

Of the rumors I've heard, the third picture that Eclipse posted, with the pleated breast pocket and the waist belt is the tunic/blouse/coat design they decided to go with.

The Woman's version will come with the upper false pocket flaps unattached so the Soldier can have them sewn on in a position appropriate their anatomy. This will help them line up their nametag, awards and decorations better than previous tunics/blouses/coats that did not have upper pockets of false flaps. This was asked for by the Female Soldiers that took part in the wear testing.

Both Barracks and Garrison Covers will be authorized and berets for everyone will be going away. (Thank God)

Enlisted Soldiers will sew their rank on their shirt sleeves and unit patches, Skill Tabs and SSI-FWTS will also be worn on the shirt shoulder sleeves by Enlisted and Officers alike.

The debate for Officer Shirts is to either pin a Rank and a Branch insignia on the shirt collars (see the female Major in Eclipse's first picture) or to add epaulets to the shirt and wear brown Rank slides (see the major in OldGuy's picture in the Pregnancy Uniform), similar to the black slides that are currently worn with the Blues and with the old Greens. This would mean they'd have two different shirts for Officers and Enlisted or Enlisted would have epaulets that were not used on their shirts.

I hope they go with the slides, they're just easier.
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Hawk200
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« Reply #29 on: November 15, 2018, 12:06:41 AM »

The Woman's version will come with the upper false pocket flaps unattached so the Soldier can have them sewn on in a position appropriate their anatomy. This will help them line up their nametag, awards and decorations better than previous tunics/blouses/coats that did not have upper pockets of false flaps. This was asked for by the Female Soldiers that took part in the wear testing.

That should look a lot better, although it would add time for females to get them ready. They're probably happy about it.

Both Barracks and Garrison Covers will be authorized and berets for everyone will be going away. (Thank God)

Second on that. Used to think berets were cool. Until I had to wear one. PITA.

Enlisted Soldiers will sew their rank on their shirt sleeves and unit patches, Skill Tabs and SSI-FWTS will also be worn on the shirt shoulder sleeves by Enlisted and Officers alike.

I like that. Definite throwback, but a welcome one. No reason that you shouldn't be able to identify someone's unit just because they're only wearing a shirt.

The debate for Officer Shirts is to either pin a Rank and a Branch insignia on the shirt collars (see the female Major in Eclipse's first picture) or to add epaulets to the shirt and wear brown Rank slides (see the major in OldGuy's picture in the Pregnancy Uniform), similar to the black slides that are currently worn with the Blues and with the old Greens. This would mean they'd have two different shirts for Officers and Enlisted or Enlisted would have epaulets that were not used on their shirts.

I'd like to see them go with branch and rank on the collars. Slides are OK, but I like the historical significance. Maybe ditch epaulets altogether, the shirts might be a tad cheaper.
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Mitchell 1969
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« Reply #30 on: November 15, 2018, 08:33:19 AM »

No one probably cares, but in my opinion, the classiest uniform combo was the Ike Jacket with the long sleeved 1549 shade shirt and same shade trousers.

http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/199974-usaf-midnight-blue-dress-shirt/

How did you manage to wear a uniform like that?

The Ike jacket was gone by 1966 and 1549’s didn’t come along until 1967.


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CAP often has old uniforms in stock. My first encampment (1973) we still wore khakis, IIRC. (And it may be my memory is malleable, an odd effect of age. If so, my apologies.)

They weren’t khakis. They were 1505 “silver tans.”


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« Reply #31 on: November 15, 2018, 08:41:59 AM »

There were cadets wearing Ike Jackets in the 1980s in my area, still.

Might not have been authorized, but I doesn't mean there wasn't overlap. Our unis don't phase out at the same time as AF unis.

I recognize that USAF uniform phase out dates don’t always match CAP phase out dates.

But...Ike jackets in the 80’s? No way was CAPs phase out date that late. I remember seeing nobody wearing Ike jackets in 1967, and a pile of them in squadron supply in 1968, with somebody saying “Yeah, we have to get rid of those. We milked them way beyond the deadline.”

Not that my eyes are the only collection source, but not only did I never see Ike jackets worn past 1967, I never even saw a photo of anyone wearing them. And that includes both CAP Times and CAP News, with their notorious uniform gaffes.

Sounds like you were in a renegade unit if you saw them worn in CAP in 1980 and beyond.


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« Reply #32 on: November 15, 2018, 01:09:59 PM »

Sounds like you were in a renegade unit if you saw them worn in CAP in 1980 and beyond.

Yup. Macomb Group III, the MI Wing group with the squadrons ranked 1, 2 & 3 in the nation one year. Bunch of renegades.

What I suspect happened is that this cadet found an Ike jacket that fit her at a surplus store and wore that instead of her Detroit Lions jacket when it got cold. "I mean, its Air Force, its blue, whats wrong with this?"

I'm not saying it was right, and I'm 100% sure (as are you) that it was way, way beyond authorized (I have a copy of the 39-1 from that time frame. Nope, not authorized). But I sure did see it.

I will have to see if one of my buddies from her squadron has any pics.
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« Reply #33 on: November 15, 2018, 02:46:10 PM »

<snippage>
Both Barracks and Garrison Covers will be authorized and berets for everyone will be going away. (Thank God)

Second on that. Used to think berets were cool. Until I had to wear one. PITA.

Yeah, no kidding. :(

WIWAC, I was all about the beret (as most cadets are, right?). 

Then, on active duty, I learned about how the "nail the sticks out gets pounded" and how "everybody looking the same" is a thing. Patrol caps forever! Yay! (or, occasionally, a boonie in the field when warranted)

Years later, when I went in the USAC, I was like "Oh boy, berets! And everybody has them, so yeah!"

About 15 minutes into that whole thing, after about the 3rd time I had to try to put the stupid thing on one-handed while going outside, I was like "Who's @#$% stupid idea was this? Shinseki!"

Bout a million years ago (it seems) got a little loopy with Photoshop one day:





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Lakeshore-CAP-Ret
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« Reply #34 on: November 15, 2018, 05:13:42 PM »


Does anyone know that this uniform was only for officers, 1930s-1950s?



I already saw last night a post on social media where someone said "I wish CAP would adopt the greens; they're so classy."

I hesitated to reply with "If you want to wear them so bad, you should have enlisted."

I have enough of a problem with constant uniform changes. I have an even greater issue when non-military members begin to insert themselves into discussions on military uniforms and how they wish they got to wear them, too.

Sorry for the soap box here. This is a real peeve.
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« Reply #35 on: November 15, 2018, 08:11:15 PM »

Actually, later than 1930! More like 1941-1950.

A book I have on US Army uniforms states the service coat was a modernization of the old WWI blouse made by opening up the collar, and approved by Chief of Staff, MacArthur. Yep, the same who would later become famous in the Pacific. There were several versions, itg getting updated later with broader shoulders, belt holders, and other modifications. The trousers were the same brown of the coat. It was not until 1940 or later that combination was worn!
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« Reply #36 on: November 16, 2018, 09:21:47 AM »

Sounds like you were in a renegade unit if you saw them worn in CAP in 1980 and beyond.

Yup. Macomb Group III, the MI Wing group with the squadrons ranked 1, 2 & 3 in the nation one year. Bunch of renegades.

What I suspect happened is that this cadet found an Ike jacket that fit her at a surplus store and wore that instead of her Detroit Lions jacket when it got cold. "I mean, its Air Force, its blue, whats wrong with this?"

I'm not saying it was right, and I'm 100% sure (as are you) that it was way, way beyond authorized (I have a copy of the 39-1 from that time frame. Nope, not authorized). But I sure did see it.

I will have to see if one of my buddies from her squadron has any pics.

That explanation makes sense, now that the context is clearer. The first post led me to believe that cadets were wearing Ike jackets in the 1980’s as part of the uniform, with badges, patches etc.

The second post clarifies that they were worn as a FORMER uniform item, morphing into what had become a civilian item used to keep the chill off cold cadets in the absence of a uniform coat. I’m assuming that the insignia had been removed.

I saw something similar in 1967. The former uniform item informally known as the “Jungle Jim” (a khaki bush jacket), once devoid of insignia, became a popular motorcycle jacket for cadets who wore them with the silver tan 1505 uniform. Once the jacket was in and the helmet replaced the uniform cap, the effect was a kid on a motorcycle  wearing tan clothes. Once at the meeting the jacket came off, helmet came off, flight cap or service cap went on and that was it.


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« Reply #37 on: November 16, 2018, 05:07:02 PM »

Who ever ok’d the Pinks and Greens must have been a Texas A&M graduate.
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« Reply #38 on: November 16, 2018, 06:30:04 PM »

Who ever ok’d the Pinks and Greens must have been a Texas A&M graduate.

I don't think the SMA went to A&M but I could be mistaken.
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« Reply #39 on: November 17, 2018, 10:20:35 PM »

No one probably cares, but in my opinion, the classiest uniform combo was the Ike Jacket with the long sleeved 1549 shade shirt and same shade trousers.

http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/199974-usaf-midnight-blue-dress-shirt/

How did you manage to wear a uniform like that?

The Ike jacket was gone by 1966 and 1549’s didn’t come along until 1967.


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CAP often has old uniforms in stock. My first encampment (1973) we still wore khakis, IIRC. (And it may be my memory is malleable, an odd effect of age. If so, my apologies.)

They weren’t khakis. They were 1505 “silver tans.”


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Indeed they were! Darned good looking uniforms, in my opinion!
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« Reply #40 on: November 18, 2018, 08:39:48 PM »

I already saw last night a post on social media where someone said "I wish CAP would adopt the greens; they're so classy."

I hesitated to reply with "If you want to wear them so bad, you should have enlisted."

I have enough of a problem with constant uniform changes. I have an even greater issue when non-military members begin to insert themselves into discussions on military uniforms and how they wish they got to wear them, too.

Sorry for the soap box here. This is a real peeve.
I agree

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« Reply #41 on: November 18, 2018, 08:40:14 PM »

The Army just went to blues not that long ago.  Seriously there better ways to invest in ones time and budget.

Terrible decision, IMHO. Greens were just fine, but someone got caught up in the "good idea fairy" of uniform changes.
True

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« Reply #42 on: November 18, 2018, 08:50:27 PM »

Of the rumors I've heard, the third picture that Eclipse posted, with the pleated breast pocket and the waist belt is the tunic/blouse/coat design they decided to go with.

The Woman's version will come with the upper false pocket flaps unattached so the Soldier can have them sewn on in a position appropriate their anatomy. This will help them line up their nametag, awards and decorations better than previous tunics/blouses/coats that did not have upper pockets of false flaps. This was asked for by the Female Soldiers that took part in the wear testing.

Both Barracks and Garrison Covers will be authorized and berets for everyone will be going away. (Thank God)

Enlisted Soldiers will sew their rank on their shirt sleeves and unit patches, Skill Tabs and SSI-FWTS will also be worn on the shirt shoulder sleeves by Enlisted and Officers alike.

The debate for Officer Shirts is to either pin a Rank and a Branch insignia on the shirt collars (see the female Major in Eclipse's first picture) or to add epaulets to the shirt and wear brown Rank slides (see the major in OldGuy's picture in the Pregnancy Uniform), similar to the black slides that are currently worn with the Blues and with the old Greens. This would mean they'd have two different shirts for Officers and Enlisted or Enlisted would have epaulets that were not used on their shirts.

I hope they go with the slides, they're just easier.
Psss! Similar to the Marine Corps. JUST SAYING

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« Reply #43 on: November 19, 2018, 06:34:36 PM »

Quote
Psss! Similar to the Marine Corps. JUST SAYING

The Army and Marine Corps have always shared similar uniforms.

At the turn of the last Century, the uniforms of the Army Field Artillery and Coastal Artillery were nearly identical to the Marine Corps Uniform except for Buttons Collar devices and Hat Badge.

During WWI, Marines were issued Army Uniforms for ease of the Logistical requirements of both Services in France.

The colors of the WWII Pinks and Greens were clearly different from the Forrest Green of the Marine Service Uniform, the same will be true of these modern versions and the current Marine Service Uniform.
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« Reply #44 on: November 19, 2018, 07:23:34 PM »

The uniforms of the Coastal Artillery and the Field Artillery had to be the same or similar, and they were the same uniforms the rest of the US Army ground forces were wearing! After all, Field Artillery and Coast Artillery were part of the US Army...

A bit more of history.

The Coast Artillery came to existence when the War Department split the Field Artillery around 1905.

Believe me, I volunteered at Battery Gunnison, Fort Hancock New Jersey for the Army Ground Forces Association for about 5 years. We restored that battery to how it looked in 1943. And had to purchase a lot of gear. Winter Service Uniform. Summer Service Uniform. Fatigue uniform. And the Army Blue fatigues as well. Field pack. Etc. I still have my collection of DUIs.

And in support of all that I had to read a lot. A lot of manuals, Coast Artillery Journals, and other books.


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« Reply #45 on: November 19, 2018, 08:43:27 PM »

Quote
The uniforms of the Coastal Artillery and the Field Artillery had to be the same or similar, and they were the same uniforms the rest of the US Army ground forces were wearing! After all, Field Artillery and Coast Artillery were part of the US Army...

I'm referring to the fact that Army uniforms had piping on the tunic and the trouser leg striping that matched the respective Branch color for which they served in (i.e. Cavalry - Yellow, Infantry - Light Blue, Signal Corps - Orange, etc.).

Field Artillery and Coastal Artillery Branch color was RED so the tunic piping and trouser stripe would be nearly identical to the piping and trouser stripe of the Marine Corps.

Artillerymen


Marine


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« Reply #46 on: November 19, 2018, 09:54:35 PM »

Sorry but it was not clear.

You are right, the colors of the Coast Artillery were gold and crimson. Or yellow and red. As was the Artillery. The DUI of the different Coast Artillery districts were, all yellow and red:

1 shell, in a diamond, First Coast Artillery District. Protected Maine, Ct, RI.

2 shells, in a parallelogram, Second Coast Artillery District. Protected NY, DE, NJ. And the Delaware River all the way to Philadelphia. Why did PA, away from the coast, needed CA protection? PA Navy Yard, and all the Dupont chemical plants, all on the DE river...

3 shells, in a circle, Third Coast Artillery District. Protected Virginia, all the way down south.

4 shells, in a diamond, Fourth CA District.

1 shell atop a 9-point star, Ninth CA District. Protected the Pacific Coast.

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« Reply #47 on: November 19, 2018, 11:33:47 PM »

Terrible decision, IMHO. Greens were just fine, but someone got caught up in the "good idea fairy" of uniform changes.

This is one of the best and most sensible uniform decisions the Army has made during my service...
Going to a unisex uniform is a HUGE step in the right direction.
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« Reply #48 on: November 20, 2018, 06:46:59 PM »

Terrible decision, IMHO. Greens were just fine, but someone got caught up in the "good idea fairy" of uniform changes.

This is one of the best and most sensible uniform decisions the Army has made during my service...
Going to a unisex uniform is a HUGE step in the right direction.

It's not unisex...  :o
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« Reply #49 on: November 20, 2018, 10:04:46 PM »

Terrible decision, IMHO. Greens were just fine, but someone got caught up in the "good idea fairy" of uniform changes.

This is one of the best and most sensible uniform decisions the Army has made during my service...
Going to a unisex uniform is a HUGE step in the right direction.

Oh, I agree this change will be good. Not sure if I was clear:  ASU was awful.

:)
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« Reply #50 on: November 21, 2018, 01:28:06 PM »

Quote
ASU was awful.

It was alright as a Dress Uniform but a PIA for a Service Uniform, looking forward to the new Uniform.
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« Reply #51 on: November 21, 2018, 02:00:53 PM »

So does this mean the beret is going away?  IMO, it was a major eyesore with the ASU.  It looked like crap with a beret.

Picture it...Pinks and greens with black beret......   >:D
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« Reply #52 on: November 21, 2018, 02:53:08 PM »

The beret is history.
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« Reply #53 on: November 21, 2018, 02:56:12 PM »

It was alright as a Dress Uniform but a PIA for a Service Uniform, looking forward to the new Uniform.

When I was doing the Army Cadets gig, I had Class A's and then Dress Blues. Dress blues were excellent and I liked them a bunch.

We made the switch to ASU and I never wore Class B ASU after that. I was unmoto to switch.  If it wasn't ACUs or ASU, I wasn't doing it.

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« Reply #54 on: November 21, 2018, 03:30:09 PM »

So does this mean the beret is going away?  IMO, it was a major eyesore with the ASU.  It looked like crap with a beret.

Picture it...Pinks and greens with black beret......   >:D

Yes, if you're not in a Ranger, Airborne, Special Forces units or the Security Force Assistance Brigade no more Beret.

The question is, when the ASU goes back to being just a optional Dress Uniform again, what headgear (Cover) will Specialists and below wear?
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« Reply #55 on: November 21, 2018, 03:57:33 PM »

So does this mean the beret is going away?  IMO, it was a major eyesore with the ASU.  It looked like crap with a beret.

Picture it...Pinks and greens with black beret......   >:D

Yes, if you're not in a Ranger, Airborne, Special Forces units or the Security Force Assistance Brigade no more Beret.

The question is, when the ASU goes back to being just a optional Dress Uniform again, what headgear (Cover) will Specialists and below wear?

Same thing they wore before the change.
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« Reply #56 on: November 21, 2018, 04:40:18 PM »

Quote
Same thing they wore before the change.

So we hope.

When the ASU was the Dress Blue Uniform, everyone wore a Barracks Cover and had Gold Striping on the Trouser legs. When it became the ASU, Specialists and below lost the Gold Striping and only Corporals and above were authorized the Barracks Cover.

I hope some good idea faery doesn't decide to keep the Beret for Dress wear.

I'd like to see the Barracks Cover and Trouser striping come back for everyone.
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« Reply #57 on: November 21, 2018, 11:08:19 PM »

From the sounds of it, the garrison cap will be standard issue, service cap as an option.

Already read something about the appropriate color jump boots being commissioned.

I have a sneaking suspicion that the Airborne patch may make a comeback as well. It would be nice to see it again.
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« Reply #58 on: November 22, 2018, 12:04:10 AM »

Well, selection is not up to me but I predict those boot's color will be...

BROWN!

Based my prediction in that the US Army wore Brown shoes and boots when they wore the old Pinks and Greens...



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« Reply #59 on: November 22, 2018, 04:06:11 PM »

Well, selection is not up to me but I predict those boot's color will be...

BROWN!

Based my prediction in that the US Army wore Brown shoes and boots when they wore the old Pinks and Greens...

The Army has already said they're brown. There is a brown jump boot out there already:  Corcoran Historical Jump Boot . Hopefully, the Army will be smart, and just go with that one. No need to reinvent the wheel, but you never know with the government.

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« Reply #60 on: November 22, 2018, 11:33:09 PM »

Well, selection is not up to me but I predict those boot's color will be...

BROWN!

Based my prediction in that the US Army wore Brown shoes and boots when they wore the old Pinks and Greens...

Predict? Prediction? I don’t think you know what those words mean.


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« Reply #61 on: November 23, 2018, 02:03:12 AM »

Play nice, please.
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« Reply #62 on: November 23, 2018, 03:07:31 AM »

Sadly, this is mostly nice.
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« Reply #63 on: November 23, 2018, 04:28:44 AM »

It's actually quite civil, for this place and the internet in general. ::)
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« Reply #64 on: November 23, 2018, 10:29:17 AM »

Play nice, please.

Sorry, but when it’s already reported that the color will be brown, anything labeled a “prediction” that it will be brown is hardly a prediction, is it?


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« Reply #65 on: November 26, 2018, 12:28:11 AM »

It's not unisex...  :o
It is as close to unisex as anyone has come yet...

Well, selection is not up to me but I predict those boot's color will be...
BROWN!

Yes...
The boots will indeed be brown.
The walking models have been wearing brown boots as an option.
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« Reply #66 on: November 26, 2018, 04:32:05 PM »

It's not unisex...  :o
It is as close to unisex as anyone has come yet...

I'm not tracking.

The buttons remain on opposite sides, thus requiring belts to go in different directions. The blouses have different pocket arrangements (males have a large breast pocket, whereas females essentially have a non-usable pocket flap). They're cut differently, so you could not (as a male) grab a female blouse off the hangar and put it on. Skirts are still optional wear. Optional tie tabs still exist. Women can choose to wear heels. Garrison caps will be worn differently.

There are literally two uniforms for each variation: a male version, and a female version. Virtually no different than how it's been all along.

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« Reply #67 on: December 11, 2018, 04:30:30 PM »

No one probably cares, but in my opinion, the classiest uniform combo was the Ike Jacket with the long sleeved 1549 shade shirt and same shade trousers.

http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/199974-usaf-midnight-blue-dress-shirt/
Looks too much like the coast guard's Johnny Cash uniform. Also too confusable with navy uniforms.
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« Reply #68 on: December 12, 2018, 10:55:05 PM »

But it's much closer than the ASU.
I am sure males will very soon have the option to wear skirts too..

The buttons remain on opposite sides, thus requiring belts to go in different directions. The blouses have different pocket arrangements (males have a large breast pocket, whereas females essentially have a non-usable pocket flap). They're cut differently, so you could not (as a male) grab a female blouse off the hangar and put it on. Skirts are still optional wear. Optional tie tabs still exist. Women can choose to wear heels. Garrison caps will be worn differently.

There are literally two uniforms for each variation: a male version, and a female version. Virtually no different than how it's been all along.
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« Reply #69 on: December 12, 2018, 11:48:05 PM »

Quote
I am sure males will very soon have the option to wear skirts too..


It's called a Kilt Laddy.  ;)




 ;D
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« Reply #70 on: December 13, 2018, 09:09:41 PM »

Shuman,

We know that kilts =/= skirts. So I am sure he KNOWS about kilts. He says "Men will have the option to wear skirts." So CAPLTC is adding another option. He is saying that males will also wear skirts.
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« Reply #71 on: December 14, 2018, 01:20:27 PM »

Shuman,

We know that kilts =/= skirts. So I am sure he KNOWS about kilts. He says "Men will have the option to wear skirts." So CAPLTC is adding another option. He is saying that males will also wear skirts.

WHOOOSH
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« Reply #72 on: December 18, 2018, 12:11:31 AM »

Quote
WHOOOSH

Jeff: "Hey Peanut, did you lose a shoe?"

Peanut: "No Man, I found one."

 ;D
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« Reply #73 on: December 19, 2018, 01:59:32 PM »

It feels like this conversation has gone its course Time to lock it gentlemen and ladies.
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