Activities that qualify for community service credit CAPR 39-3 (21)(i)?

[Майор Хаткевич]

It's an odd write up, that's all. As mentioned, wouldn't we benefit from doing something as CAP for the community, giving us much needed visibility + benefiting community? I get that a lot of people are involved with their churches, schools, other organizations, etc. By why not then give the option for units to do non-core CAP service for the community? Liability insurance? Must be the only thing that makes sense.

[Eclipse]

That's part of it - if you're in uniform and you mess up, CAP is going to be on the hook - even filing a response by a lawyer that
CAP wasn't involved costs money.

Further, CAP isn't, and shouldn't be seen supporting religious, business (even some other 501cs), or personal interests, and a
lot of community service "stuff" is sponsored by one or all of those.

It would curl your hair to know about some of the requests I've seen to do things as CAP activities.

[Майор Хаткевич]

That's part of it - if you're in uniform and you mess up, CAP is going to be on the hook - even filing a response by a lawyer that
CAP wasn't involved costs money.

Further, CAP isn't, and shouldn't be seen supporting religious, business (even some other 501cs), or personal interests, and a
lot of community service "stuff" is sponsored by one or all of those.

It would curl your hair to know about some of the requests I've seen to do things as CAP activities.

I've heard of some interesting ones already.


That said...the rule is probably there to not do things as "CAP" to protect CAP Inc. I get that.


If we want people to serve their communities, then go to soup kitchens, clean up a park, shovel snow for the elderly in the winter (my city has an organization for that!), etc.


For me, the flip of that coin is stuff like "Paint the church", which certainly gets credit as community service for the CSR and I know an insane amount of Eagle scouts who did just that for their project to wrap that up. Sure it helps the community, more specifically a congregation, but not the community at large.

[Private Investigator]

Now let's say there is a clean up effort in a park near the Random Cadet Squadron^TM. For PR purposes would we be better off having 6 cadets in civilian clothes participating or the same 6 with a Senior member in uniform helping out? As the CSR reg is written it's "better" for the cadets to not be in uniform.


A bunch of cadets with 1 more ribbon.

In this scenario, could the CSR be upgraded to a Unit Citation if the Head Park Ranger wrote a letter saying cleaning the park made it safer for the public. 

[Phil Hirons, Jr.]

Now let's say there is a clean up effort in a park near the Random Cadet Squadron^TM. For PR purposes would we be better off having 6 cadets in civilian clothes participating or the same 6 with a Senior member in uniform helping out? As the CSR reg is written it's "better" for the cadets to not be in uniform.


A bunch of cadets with 1 more ribbon.

In this scenario, could the CSR be upgraded to a Unit Citation if the Head Park Ranger wrote a letter saying cleaning the park made it safer for the public. 

Almost any idea can be taken to extremes. No Yogi, the Ranger can not give you that Unit Citation Basket.

Eclipse brought up the religion / business issue while in uniform. That would really limit the options.

[Jaison009]

I think Cadet Rae was pretty outstanding and definitely fit the criteria for a SMOV. Pretty bad A and proud we could/can claim him.

Active CAP membership >is< community service, and we're supposed to be encouraging our membership
to participate in CAP, not other organizations. 

Seriously?

Where is that written in any of our regulations or doctrine?

I obviously agree that CAP membership is community service, but we have always been about encouraging our members to engage outside of CAP service.

The mission of CAP is not supporting CAP.  It is something to the effect of service to our community, state, and nation.  Nowhere does it say that we can or should only do that through direct CAP service.

Just speaking for the largest mission in CAP -- CP -- our stated mission is "transform youth into dynamic Americans and aerospace leaders." (CAPR 52-16, para 1-2.)  If we simply produce 26,000 Spaatz cadets a year who do not engage in their communities as leaders, we will not have succeeded; we will have failed in our mission.

We encourage cadets to engage in their schooling by requiring good grades.

We encourage cadets to engage with their faith communities through things like "CAP Sunday."

We encourage cadets to engage with other youth organizations through things like Red Ribbon Week and Wreaths Across America.

And the list goes on . . .

But even more importantly, the fact that cadets need to engage in other community service beyond CAP in order to succeed as a dynamic American and aerospace leader is self -evident.

A cadet applying to the Air Force Academy or a AFROTC scholarship with a Spaatz, a 4.0, and nothing else is going to be less successful than another cadet with a Spaatz, a 3.8, varsity letters, student government experience, and a strong history of volunteering in her/his community.

We need to be sure that our cadets have a broad and active sense of committment to service.  And it sure doesn't hurt for our seniors to do so as well.

So, yes, CAP does have similar motives for encouraging volunteer community service as do our military service colleagues -- development of the individual through additional selfless service, support to our communities, and improved relations between the communities and the parent service, which in our case is CAP.

CAP decorations should be for CAP service.  Let other organizations recognize their people and never the twain meet.

So you don't support CAP decorations for valor or lifesaving if the actions don't happen to occur during CAP activities? 

Like, for example, the example set by Cadet Adam Rae of Colorado Wing who came across a car crash in August of 2005:

Cadet Adam T. Rae, CAP, distinguished himself by conspicuous, heroic action when he risked his own life to save another on 20 August 2005. While driving home with two of his friends, Cadet Rae witnessed a horrific car crash. The car hit two trees at an extremely high rate of speed, and actually broke in half. Rae stopped his car and jumped out. He ran to the nearest portion of the wreck, and saw a passenger inside who obviously had not survived. Then Adam heard a woman bystander scream that the driver was trapped inside the front half, and the vehicle had caught on fire. With disregard for his own safety, Rae ran to the car and was able to open the door. He managed to unfasten the driver's seat belt, burning his hands in the process. He dragged the driver out and away from the burning wreck. His two friends, meanwhile, ran to a nearby restaurant and got two fire extinguishers. As Rae examined the driver he noted the man was unconscious, and had massive wounds and profuse bleeding. An arriving Colorado State Trooper gave Rae a set of medical gloves and he attempted to stem the blood flow by asking for shirts from the gathering spectators. Cadet Rae noticed that the man was having trouble breathing because of an accumulation of blood in his airway. He immediately began CPR. As his friends attempted to extinguish the fire, flame-ups twice exploded, knocking all three to the ground. With continued disregard to his own personal safety Rae performed CPR on the victim for 12 minutes until firefighters arrived. A firefighter took over CPR and Rae intubated the victim and operated the bag valve mask while also tending to the victim's massive head wounds. Cadet Adam Rae remained cool in an emergency and exhibited a courage and perseverance. He is credited by the emergency personnel at the scene and by the American Red Cross with saving a life at obvious peril to his own. Cadet Rae's quick thinking, heroic action and complete disregard for his own personal safety reflects great credit upon himself, Thompson Valley Composite Squadron, the Colorado Wing, and Civil Air Patrol.

So we have no business recognizing such heroism?

Really?

[lordmonar]

It's an odd write up, that's all. As mentioned, wouldn't we benefit from doing something as CAP for the community, giving us much needed visibility + benefiting community? I get that a lot of people are involved with their churches, schools, other organizations, etc. By why not then give the option for units to do non-core CAP service for the community? Liability insurance? Must be the only thing that makes sense.

This stems from how the reg used to be written.

The idea was not to use thing like an Air Show or doing SAR to be part of the community service ribbon.   I think they went to far....by saying any community service "conducted by CAP" does not count.   Like many have pointed out....CAP often gets asked by community organizations for assistance.   VFW, BSA, GSA, Earthday just to name a few.   If the unit decides to support these efforts....then the hour don't count.  So what happens......the unit may tell their people about the volunteer opportunity but does not organize a unit participation. 

That's a loose....loose in my opinion.

IMHO, we need to go the other direction.  We should require our cadets and member to get community service hours, and we should be encouraging our units to participate in these activities as UNITS.

That way it is a win-win.....the community gets a direct impact from units beyond just ES.......members are encouraged to further serve their communities (as is part of the cadet oath).   CAP get's the visibility of "helping the community" in ways that don't involve death, injury or disaster.

That's the end of my rant.

Unit their is a change in the regulations.......if it is "conducted by CAP" then it does not count for the CSR, even if CAP does not directly benefit from the service. 

[Private Investigator]

Now let's say there is a clean up effort in a park near the Random Cadet Squadron^TM. For PR purposes would we be better off having 6 cadets in civilian clothes participating or the same 6 with a Senior member in uniform helping out? As the CSR reg is written it's "better" for the cadets to not be in uniform.


A bunch of cadets with 1 more ribbon.

In this scenario, could the CSR be upgraded to a Unit Citation if the Head Park Ranger wrote a letter saying cleaning the park made it safer for the public. 

Almost any idea can be taken to extremes. No Yogi, the Ranger can not give you that Unit Citation Basket.

Can Yogi get the Unit Citation Basket, if the Ranger wrote to MG Carr?