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CAP Talk  |  General Discussion  |  Uniforms & Awards  |  Topic: It's finally here!
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Author Topic: It's finally here!  (Read 93238 times)
tsrup
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 738
Unit: NCR-SD-031

« Reply #20 on: December 31, 2013, 03:20:29 PM »

I noticed that the US flag patch will no longer be authorized on the BDU.
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Paramedic
hang-around.
Panache
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 1,060
Unit: PAWG

« Reply #21 on: December 31, 2013, 03:24:13 PM »

(regarding wear of cloth occupation badges on BBDU), page 78-79.

Quote
5.2.1.4.6
Aviation and Occupational Badges
(CAP only)
Two Aviation or Occupational badges embroidered in silver on light blue may be worn sewn to the shirt ½ inch above the “Civil Air Patrol tape over the left breast pocket. The second badge will be centered ½ inch above the first badge. Chaplain and CAP aviation badges are mandatory and will always be worn in the highest position. Not more than a combined total of two of these badges will be worn on the wearer’s left. When more than one CAP aviation badge is authorized, only one will be worn. If chaplain badge is worn, it is worn in the higher position. Occupational badges (excluding chaplain) are optional. All light silver on dark blue insignia will have 1/8 inch of blue showing at the widest and tallest point of the insignia.

Emphasis mine.  Contradiction?
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SarDragon
Global Moderator

Posts: 10,508
Unit: NAVAIRPAC

« Reply #22 on: December 31, 2013, 03:25:36 PM »

Am I reading this right...a navy blue beret is authorized for anyone?   (6.2.5, page 91)



Am I reading this right...a navy blue beret is authorized for anyone?   (6.2.5, page 91)

Negative. Blue Berets may be worn by those completing NBB or otherwise authorized by the wing commander (9.4.1.6, page 109).

Confusing. The first reference almost reads as though everyone os allowed to wear it:
Quote
6.2.5 Beret. Navy blue. Position headband straight across the forehead, one inch above the eyebrows. Drape the top over the right ear and the stiffener. Adjust ribbon for comfort, tie in a knot, and tuck inside or cut-off. Appropriate flight cap device will be worn unless worn due to Blue Beret attendance, in which case the member will wear the Blue Beret, beret device.

But then your cite say differently...

One is how to wear. The other is who can wear, and when.
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Dave Bowles
Maj, CAP
AT1, USN Retired
Mitchell Award (unnumbered)
C/WO, CAP, Ret
NIN
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 5,022
Unit: of issue

« Reply #23 on: December 31, 2013, 03:26:08 PM »

Some dark blue probably slipped in via editing (the intent is that eventually the BBDU & ABU will have the same dark blue nametags and other insigina)

Caught a good one:

Pg 137, Figure A5-4. The cadet collar insignia is shown with cut outs. Cadets have worn cadet enlisted grade insignia without CAP cutouts for several years now.

ETA: Also, Figure A5-6.  Shows male cadet cap device as either cloth or metal. That cap device hasn't been cloth for, geez, 20+ years now?
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Darin Ninness, Lt Col, CAP
Sq Bubba, Wing Dude, National Guy
I like to have Difficult Adult Conversations™
The contents of this post are Copyright © 2007-2018 by NIN. All rights are reserved. Specific permission is given to quote this post here on CAP-Talk only.
Panache
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 1,060
Unit: PAWG

« Reply #24 on: December 31, 2013, 03:27:13 PM »

Blue BDU - Black undershirt now required.
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Walkman
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 1,233
Unit: GLR-MI-009

Kris Walker Photography
« Reply #25 on: December 31, 2013, 03:28:39 PM »

Pg 137, Figure A5-4. The cadet collar insignia is shown with cut outs. Cadets have worn cadet enlisted grade insignia without CAP cutouts for several years now.

That looks like the exact same artwork from the current reg. Kinda' hard to comment on new images if most of them aren't even included in this draft.
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Walkman
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 1,233
Unit: GLR-MI-009

Kris Walker Photography
« Reply #26 on: December 31, 2013, 03:30:25 PM »

Blue BDU - Black undershirt now required.

And the photo shows a white shirt...
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Devil Doc
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 855
Unit: MER-NC-162

« Reply #27 on: December 31, 2013, 03:31:00 PM »

Weigh-ins encouraged.

Golf shirt no longer equal to service uniform.

More time spent talking about when not to wear a uniform then when to wear it.

No mention of ABUs, however Chapter 7 "not used" which is where it would probably go.

Canonizes terms "Class A", etc.

Features a "National Paid Staff" rocker?  so staff are wearing uniforms now?

Features the "new" NCO insignia.

Changes tapes on BBDU to dark blue - still has metal grade on hat (why?)

RADMON, NEAT, and Member 200 patches retired.

Cadet first Sgt diamond now approved.

Clarified NRA badge.

Cool, But with "Weigh Ins" There going to be a Gray area for Scales that are not Calibrated? Example: "Scale at homes says I Weigh xxx, but this scale says xxx"
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Captain Brandon P. Smith CAP
Former HM3, U.S NAVY
Too many Awards, Achievments and Qualifications to list.

NIN
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 5,022
Unit: of issue

« Reply #28 on: December 31, 2013, 03:32:09 PM »

Cool, But with "Weigh Ins" There going to be a Gray area for Scales that are not Calibrated? Example: "Scale at homes says I Weigh xxx, but this scale says xxx"

The E-4 Mafia is strong in you....
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Darin Ninness, Lt Col, CAP
Sq Bubba, Wing Dude, National Guy
I like to have Difficult Adult Conversations™
The contents of this post are Copyright © 2007-2018 by NIN. All rights are reserved. Specific permission is given to quote this post here on CAP-Talk only.
JeffDG
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 3,157

« Reply #29 on: December 31, 2013, 03:33:22 PM »

Cool, But with "Weigh Ins" There going to be a Gray area for Scales that are not Calibrated? Example: "Scale at homes says I Weigh xxx, but this scale says xxx"
Specifically says no particularly calibrated scale needed.  Repeat weigh-in must be at least 30 days later, and not authorized USAF style until you pass.
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NIN
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 5,022
Unit: of issue

« Reply #30 on: December 31, 2013, 03:36:53 PM »

The feedback on the new manual is not the place to recommend this particular policy change, but I'm going to float it here and see what people think.

CAP cadets in the grade of C/Amn to C/CMSgt have not worn cut outs for several years on their uniforms.

Yet we require them to purchase & wear two cutouts on their uniform when they're a C/AB, and then they wouldn't wear a CAP cutout again until they become a cadet officer.

Considering our 1st year and subsequent retention rates, etc, this is kind of silly.  More that 75% of our cadets don't make it to the Mitchell, so they'd wear CAP cutouts only a few times as a C/AB and then never again.

We've made a change to the "SM w/o Grade" flight cap so that they can purchase and wear the "officer" flight cap to avoid buying a 2nd flight cap after six months.  Why not reduce the cost for new cadets a little?
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Darin Ninness, Lt Col, CAP
Sq Bubba, Wing Dude, National Guy
I like to have Difficult Adult Conversations™
The contents of this post are Copyright © 2007-2018 by NIN. All rights are reserved. Specific permission is given to quote this post here on CAP-Talk only.
Walkman
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 1,233
Unit: GLR-MI-009

Kris Walker Photography
« Reply #31 on: December 31, 2013, 03:37:22 PM »

Cool, But with "Weigh Ins" There going to be a Gray area for Scales that are not Calibrated? Example: "Scale at homes says I Weigh xxx, but this scale says xxx"

Quote
1.2.1.6 Weigh-ins may occur on any commercially available scale and no specific scale is required to be purchased.

This could get sticky. My wife was in a weight-loss competition at her gym a couple of years ago and there was a difference of 3-5 pounds between the two scales.

I'm right on the line below H/W, sometimes (like during the holidays  ;D) I nudge over a pound or two on my scale. I also weigh myself in the morning before I eat anything. I've noticed that I can gain several pounds during the day after meals then be back to normal in the next morning.
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Eclipse
Too Much Free Time Award

Posts: 29,338

« Reply #32 on: December 31, 2013, 03:43:30 PM »

Seriously, no one "on the line" is going to have an issue, and in my opinion tie should always go to the runner.

Just the prospect of weigh-ins will be enough to fix 1/2 the issues.
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Eclipse
Too Much Free Time Award

Posts: 29,338

« Reply #33 on: December 31, 2013, 03:44:32 PM »

The feedback on the new manual is not the place to recommend this particular policy change, but I'm going to float it here and see what people think.

CAP cadets in the grade of C/Amn to C/CMSgt have not worn cut outs for several years on their uniforms.

Yet we require them to purchase & wear two cutouts on their uniform when they're a C/AB, and then they wouldn't wear a CAP cutout again until they become a cadet officer.

Considering our 1st year and subsequent retention rates, etc, this is kind of silly.  More that 75% of our cadets don't make it to the Mitchell, so they'd wear CAP cutouts only a few times as a C/AB and then never again.

We've made a change to the "SM w/o Grade" flight cap so that they can purchase and wear the "officer" flight cap to avoid buying a 2nd flight cap after six months.  Why not reduce the cost for new cadets a little?

I don't disagree, but we're still making SMWOG wear cutouts, right?

I know a lot of units just have loaner pins for this reason.
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NIN
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 5,022
Unit: of issue

« Reply #34 on: December 31, 2013, 03:44:39 PM »

Cool, But with "Weigh Ins" There going to be a Gray area for Scales that are not Calibrated? Example: "Scale at homes says I Weigh xxx, but this scale says xxx"

Quote
1.2.1.6 Weigh-ins may occur on any commercially available scale and no specific scale is required to be purchased.

This could get sticky. My wife was in a weight-loss competition at her gym a couple of years ago and there was a difference of 3-5 pounds between the two scales.

I'm right on the line below H/W, sometimes (like during the holidays  ;D) I nudge over a pound or two on my scale. I also weigh myself in the morning before I eat anything. I've noticed that I can gain several pounds during the day after meals then be back to normal in the next morning.

If you got on the scale in your uniform and you were a pound over, I might be inclined to give you the benefit of the doubt.

If you were 5lbs over, probably not.
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Darin Ninness, Lt Col, CAP
Sq Bubba, Wing Dude, National Guy
I like to have Difficult Adult Conversations™
The contents of this post are Copyright © 2007-2018 by NIN. All rights are reserved. Specific permission is given to quote this post here on CAP-Talk only.
NIN
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 5,022
Unit: of issue

« Reply #35 on: December 31, 2013, 03:45:53 PM »

I don't disagree, but we're still making SMWOG wear cutouts, right?

I know a lot of units just have loaner pins for this reason.

Are we? Didn't I read something about blank shoulder marks?

You make a good point about loaner cutouts.

Still:  what is really wrong with a newbie having a slick collar?
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Darin Ninness, Lt Col, CAP
Sq Bubba, Wing Dude, National Guy
I like to have Difficult Adult Conversations™
The contents of this post are Copyright © 2007-2018 by NIN. All rights are reserved. Specific permission is given to quote this post here on CAP-Talk only.
Walkman
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 1,233
Unit: GLR-MI-009

Kris Walker Photography
« Reply #36 on: December 31, 2013, 03:45:57 PM »

Just the prospect of weigh-ins will be enough to fix 1/2 the issues.

Agreed.
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Eclipse
Too Much Free Time Award

Posts: 29,338

« Reply #37 on: December 31, 2013, 03:46:58 PM »

If you got on the scale in your uniform and you were a pound over, I might be inclined to give you the benefit of the doubt.

If you were 5lbs over, probably not.

Yep.  Want to argue the point? Bring your own scale from home and we'll use yours for everyone next time.

1Lbs?  Take off your 500 ribbons, wallet, massive janitor keys and ego.  That should be enough.
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Eclipse
Too Much Free Time Award

Posts: 29,338

« Reply #38 on: December 31, 2013, 03:47:27 PM »

Still:  what is really wrong with a newbie having a slick collar?

Nothing, really.
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Panache
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 1,060
Unit: PAWG

« Reply #39 on: December 31, 2013, 03:50:44 PM »

6.1.9.2.1 - Metal grade insignia authorized with the blue USAF topcoat as long as it's pinned onto a gray epaulette sleeve for SM Officers and NCO's.

6.2.12.2 - "Officers will center rank on the front of the [Blue BDU] cap.  Officers and cadet officers will wear embroidered grade insignia on dark blue material."   Seems to contradict an earlier section that said SM officers can wear metal pin-on rank insignia on the Blue BDU cap.

6.2.12.4 - No rank/grade insignia authorized for blue boonie cap.

8.2.3 - People wearing the green flight suit are still stuck with plastic-encased rank insignia, without the option for embroidered insignia.



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CAP Talk  |  General Discussion  |  Uniforms & Awards  |  Topic: It's finally here!
 


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