Black A-2?

[Abby.L]

A number of USAF pilots are quite sensitive about the flight suit and its appearance. There are those among them who think ONLY PILOTS should wear them. Though then they have to concede to people who fly on the airplane who aren't pilots, but they tend to be dismissive of them.

Frankly, in my opinion, the flight suit is a reasonably comfortable, fairly-functional, low-MX uniform. I don't really care who can or can't wear it. I am glad I get to wear mine, but I don't lose sleep over who else gets to. Frankly, one of the best things about some of the other career fields that wear them is it [aggravates the emotionally insecure and self-righteous] who feel all entitled about it.  :angel:

[SarDragon]

I would imagine that the fire retardant treatment would make the fabric less permeable to dies after manufacturing.

Nomex flight suits do not get a fire retardant treatment, like soaking a cotton coverall in boric acid solution. The fire resistance is inherent in the Nomex fiber itself, It doesn't wash out. It doesn't wear out. The same goes for the color. It's inherent in the fiber when manufactured.

Since it is a synthetic fiber, it doesn't have the same ability as animal fibers to soak up dies, etc. You get the same result trying to dye polyester and other synthetics.

[Brad]

I would imagine that the fire retardant treatment would make the fabric less permeable to dies after manufacturing.

Nomex flight suits do not get a fire retardant treatment, like soaking a cotton coverall in boric acid solution. The fire resistance is inherent in the Nomex fiber itself, It doesn't wash out. It doesn't wear out. The same goes for the color. It's inherent in the fiber when manufactured.

Since it is a synthetic fiber, it doesn't have the same ability as animal fibers to soak up dies, etc. You get the same result trying to dye polyester and other synthetics.

UV light will break it down over time though. That's why I keep my Nomex flash hood in the pocket of my bunker pants instead of hanging out where it will absorb all that light. The less exposure time it gets, the longer it will last.

http://siri.org/msds/mf/dupont/nomex.html

[SarDragon]

Agreed.

UV will break down most plastics that aren't UV-passivated.

[Newslick]

Nor is a flight jacket, I found out to my dismay.

CAPM 39-1 page 34 paragraph 9:

The Air Force brown leather flight jacket is NOT authorized with this or any Air Force style uniform. The MA-1 flight jacket or the CWU-45/P or CWU-36/P Nomex flight jackets may be worn.

Emphasis mine. Flight jackets are authorized with Air-Force style uniforms, specifically the green nomex flight suit, just not the leather A-2 flight jackets.

I actually have an A-2 that my mother-in-law got from a thrift store for me, and I turned it into a flight jacket to wear when I got trooping with the 501st Legion as a TIE Pilot. Have unit patches and TIE Pilot wings on it, heh.

I collect A-2s. I have one nice brown goatskin Cooper, one black one, and several knockoffs. I got the black one for $5.00 at the Sal-i-vation Army store, it was hardly worn. Had the local leather guy sew velcro on it, got name tag  and CAP patch from Scamguard,  and there it was. I also favor an A-2 for motorcycle riding in the summer, though it would not give much protection in a crash.
My son was always trying to heist my Cooper from me, so I got him ANOTHER brown one from a flea market, and he loves it. His has an escape map in the liner. It is centered on Cleveland, which I find funny.
Anyway, I only wear my black A-2 with the polo shirt/grey pants. I love to find old A-2s at thrift stores, resurrect them with the mink oil treatment, and present them to friends. I am a pilot, though I don't have CAP wings yet. The black A-2 looks great and is one of the privileges of being a pilot.

Ten points if you know exactly why A-2s have shoulder straps so securely sewn on.   

[Brad]

Nor is a flight jacket, I found out to my dismay.

CAPM 39-1 page 34 paragraph 9:

The Air Force brown leather flight jacket is NOT authorized with this or any Air Force style uniform. The MA-1 flight jacket or the CWU-45/P or CWU-36/P Nomex flight jackets may be worn.

Emphasis mine. Flight jackets are authorized with Air-Force style uniforms, specifically the green nomex flight suit, just not the leather A-2 flight jackets.

I actually have an A-2 that my mother-in-law got from a thrift store for me, and I turned it into a flight jacket to wear when I got trooping with the 501st Legion as a TIE Pilot. Have unit patches and TIE Pilot wings on it, heh.

I collect A-2s. I have one nice brown goatskin Cooper, one black one, and several knockoffs. I got the black one for $5.00 at the Sal-i-vation Army store, it was hardly worn. Had the local leather guy sew velcro on it, got name tag  and CAP patch from Scamguard,  and there it was. I also favor an A-2 for motorcycle riding in the summer, though it would not give much protection in a crash.
My son was always trying to heist my Cooper from me, so I got him ANOTHER brown one from a flea market, and he loves it. His has an escape map in the liner. It is centered on Cleveland, which I find funny.
Anyway, I only wear my black A-2 with the polo shirt/grey pants. I love to find old A-2s at thrift stores, resurrect them with the mink oil treatment, and present them to friends. I am a pilot, though I don't have CAP wings yet. The black A-2 looks great and is one of the privileges of being a pilot.

Ten points if you know exactly why A-2s have shoulder straps so securely sewn on.

Not sure, but now I'm curious.

Here's a pic of mine (and my little one ). We went to the aquarium on Saturday, she loved it!



Mine is a Pack-In Products, Inc. 647 SM. Has the faux natural sheep fleece on the inside. Nice and comfy!

[Newslick]

Cute Kid.

A-2s vary as to how faithful to the original they are. Yours looks like it has extra pocket on the left sleeve, which IMHO is a good addition (pen, mini maglite with red filter). Most now have side entry pockets next to the hidden snap flap ones on front. They did not originally have those, lest personnel walk around with their hands in their pockets.

When the A-2 was originally designed in the 30s, primary military flight instruction was in open cockpit biplanes. The straps, with the distinctive boxed x stitch on the end towards the neck, served as handles strong enough to pull a pilot out of a wreck!

If anyone makes it to the Udvar-Hazy Museum, there is a nice display of vintage and celebrity A-2s in glass cases on the ground floor, Chuck Yeager, etc.

[Newslick]

Also, the A-2 is a summer weight flying jacket, so the sheepskin lining, faux or otherwise, is a rather broad interpretation. A-2's had silk linings.
The sheepskin lined winter flying jacket was a B-3, seen in my youth on the TV show "12 O'Clock High".

[vento]

Here's a pic of mine (and my little one ). We went to the aquarium on Saturday, she loved it!



Mine is a Pack-In Products, Inc. 647 SM. Has the faux natural sheep fleece on the inside. Nice and comfy!

Are you wearing a Stormtrooper (or is it called the Imperial pilot) wing?

[Brad]

Are you wearing a Stormtrooper (or is it called the Imperial pilot) wing?

Yep. My 501st character is a Tie Pilot. I don't have my black helmet and armor bits yet, but finishing the payments soon. The wings are some swag items we can get if we want. 501st members only though per our policy and Lucasfilm though, so sorry.

[Sapper168]

Are you wearing a Stormtrooper (or is it called the Imperial pilot) wing?

Yep. My 501st character is a Tie Pilot. I don't have my black helmet and armor bits yet, but finishing the payments soon. The wings are some swag items we can get if we want. 501st members only though per our policy and Lucasfilm though, so sorry.

Many years ago before the 501st got huge and let clone troopers in I was a member of the Midwest Garrison, Designation number TR-113.

[Brad]

Are you wearing a Stormtrooper (or is it called the Imperial pilot) wing?

Yep. My 501st character is a Tie Pilot. I don't have my black helmet and armor bits yet, but finishing the payments soon. The wings are some swag items we can get if we want. 501st members only though per our policy and Lucasfilm though, so sorry.

Many years ago before the 501st got huge and let clone troopers in I was a member of the Midwest Garrison, Designation number TR-113.

I tend to ignore the Clone Troopers and their ilk. I'm original trilogy all the way

And yea that's what I figured the shoulder straps were for.

[ol'fido]

I was 13 and became involved with CAP the year the original Star Wars came out. The sci-fi of my real youth was the original Star trek, Jonny Quest, and Space Angel.

Down here in Southern Illinois, one of the local stations produced a 1/2 hour children's show called The Funny Company that was hosted by a character called Cactus Pete. Later on the host was Uncle Briggs. It was through this show I learned about the Three Stooges, Bugs Bunny, Charlie Chaplin, Deputy Dawg, Clutch Cargo, and Space Angel. Pre-WIWAC!

[blackrain]

Frankly, one of the best things about some of the other career fields that wear them is it [aggravates the emotionally insecure and self-righteous] who feel all entitled about it.  :angel:

The other day I saw a T-shirt with a UAV (Global Hawk I believe) Caption said "pilots and crew chiefs have been around forever. One of these is now irrelevant" Even as a CAP pilot I found it humerous

As far as the leather jacket, the biggest difference I've seen is the seam down the middle of the back on most commercial jackets where two pieces of leather are used for he jacket instead of one. All the actual aircrew A-2s I've seen have a one piece back.

[Newslick]

I am pretty sure you are correct about the back, but I have seen pix of a guy in the Korean War clearly wearing an A-2 with a two piece back. The jacket may have been from WWII, but they let personnel wear them if they already had them, I guess. Or the guy bought it from a civilian supplier in the 50s and used it as uniform. They certainly made them commercially by then.

They stopped issuing leather A-2s in 1943, but they were so much in demand that a cottage industry arose in England to make A-2s for personnel who could not get them any more! I am sure some of those civilian/uniform jackets had two piece backs.

I have seen as many as five pieces used to make the back of a cheap copy A-2, and some are even made of many leather scraps, which they like to call "diamond plate". I'd never attempt to use one of those for a uniform item, or anything else for that matter.