NRA qualifications badge

[PHall]

We should just get rid of the [darn] things already. Not once will a cadet EVER shoot something in CAP outside of NCSA's or visits to the local FATS. What purpose does it serve to have cadets run around with these things? They look dumb, they're a joke, and I'm positive no cadet could make a strong connection between the badge and CAP.

Worse off, what happens when Cadet Johhny Got His-Gun (for those of you who get reference, kudos!) thinks he is all of the sudden wearing a real shooting qualification badge? Allowing stuff like this creates the risk of having cadets say that the skill is used in CAP to someone like, lets say, Mr. and Mrs. Kids O'Parent or to SrA Para Rescue Mann. If we cut it out, we can be assured no cadet is going to say that they are a CAP shooter.

In the good words of a relevant Christmas movie: "You'll shoot your eye out, kid!"

SARCASM WARNING

Well, under that pretense, we should rid ourselves of the Cadet pocket rocket as well. Heaven forbid if one of our cadets passed themselves off as a rocket expert, or some sort of educated young man/woman about aerospace propulsion...

The vast majority of AF members will NEVER fire a weapon in the service (finance, MXS, Ops support, fire fighter). They better do away with the small arms marksmanship ribbon, just in case a real shooter gets confused with them and thinks they can shoot...

You haven't deployed, have you?

[NCRblues]

We should just get rid of the [darn] things already. Not once will a cadet EVER shoot something in CAP outside of NCSA's or visits to the local FATS. What purpose does it serve to have cadets run around with these things? They look dumb, they're a joke, and I'm positive no cadet could make a strong connection between the badge and CAP.

Worse off, what happens when Cadet Johhny Got His-Gun (for those of you who get reference, kudos!) thinks he is all of the sudden wearing a real shooting qualification badge? Allowing stuff like this creates the risk of having cadets say that the skill is used in CAP to someone like, lets say, Mr. and Mrs. Kids O'Parent or to SrA Para Rescue Mann. If we cut it out, we can be assured no cadet is going to say that they are a CAP shooter.

In the good words of a relevant Christmas movie: "You'll shoot your eye out, kid!"

SARCASM WARNING

Well, under that pretense, we should rid ourselves of the Cadet pocket rocket as well. Heaven forbid if one of our cadets passed themselves off as a rocket expert, or some sort of educated young man/woman about aerospace propulsion...

The vast majority of AF members will NEVER fire a weapon in the service (finance, MXS, Ops support, fire fighter). They better do away with the small arms marksmanship ribbon, just in case a real shooter gets confused with them and thinks they can shoot...

You haven't deployed, have you?

Indeed I have. Twice to Iraq. Only AF SF  did anything outside the wire... never seen someone outside AF SF member forced to fire the weapons...

[AngelWings]

We should just get rid of the [darn] things already. Not once will a cadet EVER shoot something in CAP outside of NCSA's or visits to the local FATS. What purpose does it serve to have cadets run around with these things? They look dumb, they're a joke, and I'm positive no cadet could make a strong connection between the badge and CAP.

Worse off, what happens when Cadet Johhny Got His-Gun (for those of you who get reference, kudos!) thinks he is all of the sudden wearing a real shooting qualification badge? Allowing stuff like this creates the risk of having cadets say that the skill is used in CAP to someone like, lets say, Mr. and Mrs. Kids O'Parent or to SrA Para Rescue Mann. If we cut it out, we can be assured no cadet is going to say that they are a CAP shooter.

In the good words of a relevant Christmas movie: "You'll shoot your eye out, kid!"

SARCASM WARNING

Well, under that pretense, we should rid ourselves of the Cadet pocket rocket as well. Heaven forbid if one of our cadets passed themselves off as a rocket expert, or some sort of educated young man/woman about aerospace propulsion

And I think we should get rid of the pocket rocket too. I hate the thing, it is a useless badge, even if it is actually relevant to CAP. I've actually hated the thing for a long time. And there is nothing wrong with a cadet saying they know a thing or two about rockets OR guns, but I've never heard a cadet say they are a USAF Space Defense cadet, while I've heard a cadet say he's a CAP field shooter that protects ground teams out in the field.

Claiming to be a rocket scientist seems to be much less appealing than saying you shoot at things to kids looking to try to impress people. As others have stated, I'd love to see a CAP gun safety program that involves similar shooting requirements for cadets to earn a badge. It could be turned into an NCSA that I'm sure would be highly popular.

[PHall]

We should just get rid of the [darn] things already. Not once will a cadet EVER shoot something in CAP outside of NCSA's or visits to the local FATS. What purpose does it serve to have cadets run around with these things? They look dumb, they're a joke, and I'm positive no cadet could make a strong connection between the badge and CAP.

Worse off, what happens when Cadet Johhny Got His-Gun (for those of you who get reference, kudos!) thinks he is all of the sudden wearing a real shooting qualification badge? Allowing stuff like this creates the risk of having cadets say that the skill is used in CAP to someone like, lets say, Mr. and Mrs. Kids O'Parent or to SrA Para Rescue Mann. If we cut it out, we can be assured no cadet is going to say that they are a CAP shooter.

In the good words of a relevant Christmas movie: "You'll shoot your eye out, kid!"

SARCASM WARNING

Well, under that pretense, we should rid ourselves of the Cadet pocket rocket as well. Heaven forbid if one of our cadets passed themselves off as a rocket expert, or some sort of educated young man/woman about aerospace propulsion...

The vast majority of AF members will NEVER fire a weapon in the service (finance, MXS, Ops support, fire fighter). They better do away with the small arms marksmanship ribbon, just in case a real shooter gets confused with them and thinks they can shoot...

You haven't deployed, have you?

Indeed I have. Twice to Iraq. Only AF SF  did anything outside the wire... never seen someone outside AF SF member forced to fire the weapons...

Yeah, I wouldn't tell that to the CE  and Trans guys and the other folks who got sucked into the "In Lieu Of" assignments who were running the convoys.
Nagh, they weren't outside the wire at all...

[NCRblues]

We should just get rid of the [darn] things already. Not once will a cadet EVER shoot something in CAP outside of NCSA's or visits to the local FATS. What purpose does it serve to have cadets run around with these things? They look dumb, they're a joke, and I'm positive no cadet could make a strong connection between the badge and CAP.

Worse off, what happens when Cadet Johhny Got His-Gun (for those of you who get reference, kudos!) thinks he is all of the sudden wearing a real shooting qualification badge? Allowing stuff like this creates the risk of having cadets say that the skill is used in CAP to someone like, lets say, Mr. and Mrs. Kids O'Parent or to SrA Para Rescue Mann. If we cut it out, we can be assured no cadet is going to say that they are a CAP shooter.

In the good words of a relevant Christmas movie: "You'll shoot your eye out, kid!"

SARCASM WARNING

Well, under that pretense, we should rid ourselves of the Cadet pocket rocket as well. Heaven forbid if one of our cadets passed themselves off as a rocket expert, or some sort of educated young man/woman about aerospace propulsion...

The vast majority of AF members will NEVER fire a weapon in the service (finance, MXS, Ops support, fire fighter). They better do away with the small arms marksmanship ribbon, just in case a real shooter gets confused with them and thinks they can shoot...

You haven't deployed, have you?

Indeed I have. Twice to Iraq. Only AF SF  did anything outside the wire... never seen someone outside AF SF member forced to fire the weapons...

Yeah, I wouldn't tell that to the CE  and Trans guys and the other folks who got sucked into the "In Lieu Of" assignments who were running the convoys.
Nagh, they weren't outside the wire at all...

Well, lets be honest though... Those "in lieu of" posistions were rare and the AF was not pleased with the use of those members (or so says the former CMSGT of the AF)

[abdsp51]

All of my deployments from 2005 on were ILO or JET missions and they sucked and did not win points withe the Army or Marines.  They still happen now and a good chunk is EOD heading out.  While a good chunk of the outside the wire missions were conducted by Security Forces alot of the convoys running in Iraq were other AFSCs.  While NCRblues is correct in the aspect that many of the OTW are conducted by SF they were actually outnumbered in Iraq on the convoy runs. 

To the topic at hand the way the current manual is written the current badge is not authorized, and there is nothing in any ICL indicating it as well.  With 39-1 being revamped maybe it will be included but we should wait and see if that change will happen.

[a2capt]

With 39-1 being revamped maybe it will be included but we should wait and see if that change will happen.

Except that it's still two-fold. A 39-1 rewrite would include the authorization to wear the badge. If the badge name has changed. That would need to be revised to indicate the old badge, unless that badge is not wearable by Senior Members, because once the cadets age-out, the badge is a moot point. But it would need to reflect whatever it is currently called.

A different regulation would authorized the wear of the badge, as it does now. 39-1 says it goes here, something else says you're allowed to wear it if XXX is met.

It takes two tango.

[Devil Doc]

I was NAVY left the wire everyday, even slept outside the wire numerous times. Random houses, humvee, mortar pit, defense fox hole (yes, we still dug them). Spain' how i did that? LOL. I was no SF. Btw this is sarcasm.

[That Anonymous Guy]

[/quote]
I've heard a cadet say he's a CAP field shooter that protects ground teams out in the field.
[/quote]From what?

[LTC Don]

39-1 should have never referenced a 3rd party organization which can change and rename parts and pieces anytime it so desires.  That was just asking for trouble and cofusion.

If anything needs to be referenced in 39-1 in terms of shooting proficiency and training awards, they should list qualified/competent organizations and generically list awards and leave it at that.

If any organization and it's awards system has to be 'specified' or listed, it should have been or should be this one, as specified in Federal Law --

http://www.odcmp.com/


About Us

The Civilian Marksmanship Program (CMP) is a national organization dedicated to training and educating U. S. citizens in responsible uses of firearms and airguns through gun safety training, marksmanship training and competitions. The CMP is a federally chartered 501(c)(3) corporation that places its highest priority on serving youth through gun safety and marksmanship activities that encourage personal growth and build life skills. Links on this page will lead you to more detailed information about the CMP and its programs.
Statutory mission. The federal law enacted in 1996 (Title 36 U. S. Code, 0701-40733) that created the Corporation for the Promotion of Rifle Practice and Firearms Safety, Inc. (CPRPFS, the formal legal name of the CMP) mandates these key "functions for the corporation:

(1) To instruct citizens of the United States in marksmanship;

(2) To promote practice and safety in the use of firearms;

(3) To conduct competitions in the use of firearms and to award trophies, prizes, badges, and other insignia to competitors.

The law specifically states: In carrying out the Civilian Marksmanship Program, the corporation shall give priority to activities that benefit firearms safety, training, and competition for youth and that reach as many youth participants as possible.

I think firearms proficiency should be taught, and participation in the various shooting sports should be encouraged as it presents a plethora of opportunites to do lots of different, positive things.

[manfredvonrichthofen]

Everyone in a combat zone has a job to do, so long as they know what that is, and can do it, good... The unit I was in, is a BCT (Brigade Combat Team). We had every MOS we needed for a deployment, cooks, mechanics, finance,  just about everything, except MPs, thankfully. We didn't have much need for AF or Navy, and we had a couple of dog handlers from the marines. The dogs went out with us a bit, and a group of mechanics went out for wreckers on QRF, but no one else did, except the SEAL team. They went out quite a bit. Great group of guys.

If we had other guys, from AF and Navy, we would not let them go out with us I'm sure. We had enough missions for QRF for marines on the other side of the city.

[cap235629]

MP's Thankfully?

[Phil Hirons, Jr.]

39-1 should have never referenced a 3rd party organization which can change and rename parts and pieces anytime it so desires.  That was just asking for trouble and cofusion.

If anything needs to be referenced in 39-1 in terms of shooting proficiency and training awards, they should list qualified/competent organizations and generically list awards and leave it at that.

I think it would be safe to list the new NRA program by name. Winchester just forked over $500,000 to put it's name on it.

[Devil Doc]

With all this "BAN" assault rifles and the NRA getting the 5th degree. It may hinder the success of the NRA badges. Just my .02.

[Garibaldi]

With all this "BAN" assault rifles and the NRA getting the 5th degree. It may hinder the success of the NRA badges. Just my .02.

...how so? I'm just curious. The Army ROTC unit at my college used pellet guns for practice. I don't see how a ban on assault rifles would impact this NRA program. I don't even think we can use assault rifles even with DoD supervision at encampment like we used to.

[Eclipse]

With all this "BAN" assault rifles and the NRA getting the 5th degree. It may hinder the success of the NRA badges. Just my .02.

How?

I don't even think we can use assault rifles even with DoD supervision at encampment like we used to.

You shoot whatever is available, there's no specific rules on the CAP side.

Few encampments can offer any live-fire training, but a number have access to the laser-based simulations of one kind or another.
We've shot laser M16's for at least a decade at Great Lakes (though they aren't air-charged, bummer).

[manfredvonrichthofen]

MP's Thankfully?

We had issues with them in Kuwait, and other FOBs. They expected us to walk around garrisonized, berets, clean shaven, all kinds of craziness that you shouldn't need to worry about. We didn't even pack PT belts, it is a useless item for a deployment, yet they expected us to have them at all times. Not to mention the issue of us having ammo, they expected us to not have a single round on us, whereas on our outpost we had one in the chamber at all times. So they wanted us to hand over our grenades and ammo, and buy a PT belt, yeah.... Not happening. Why is an MP even worried about these issues? Seems like they got bored and felt they needed something to gripe about.

We lived on a combat outpost. Everyone there was 11 series, except a few mechanics, our medics, one SEAL team, and a couple of weatherman, oh and like three seabees. Other than that, nothing. No one griped if you didn't shave for a week, you wore body armor any time you left your building, and moved around like you were constantly being watched and always prepared for an attack. Food was mostly MRE, or brought in by mermites. Completely combat focused, you were never really off duty.

There was no need for MPs.
What did you do during your deployments?

[cap235629]

MP's Thankfully?

We had issues with them in Kuwait, and other FOBs. They expected us to walk around garrisonized, berets, clean shaven, all kinds of craziness that you shouldn't need to worry about. We didn't even pack PT belts, it is a useless item for a deployment, yet they expected us to have them at all times. Not to mention the issue of us having ammo, they expected us to not have a single round on us, whereas on our outpost we had one in the chamber at all times. So they wanted us to hand over our grenades and ammo, and buy a PT belt, yeah.... Not happening. Why is an MP even worried about these issues? Seems like they got bored and felt they needed something to gripe about.

We lived on a combat outpost. Everyone there was 11 series, except a few mechanics, our medics, one SEAL team, and a couple of weatherman, oh and like three seabees. Other than that, nothing. No one griped if you didn't shave for a week, you wore body armor any time you left your building, and moved around like you were constantly being watched and always prepared for an attack. Food was mostly MRE, or brought in by mermites. Completely combat focused, you were never really off duty.

There was no need for MPs.
What did you do during your deployments?

MP's only enforce the standards dictated by command.  They weren't bored, they were following orders.  The majority of the MP's in theater were NOT in a garrison environment.  They were manning FOB's, conducting patrols in villages and towns, running convoy security or EPW operations.

When my buddy deployed back in '03 with the 39th BCT attached to 1/7 Cav, the job they were doing was verbatim the MP Combat Mission

[GroundHawg]

MP's Thankfully?

We had issues with them in Kuwait, and other FOBs. They expected us to walk around garrisonized, berets, clean shaven, all kinds of craziness that you shouldn't need to worry about. We didn't even pack PT belts, it is a useless item for a deployment, yet they expected us to have them at all times. Not to mention the issue of us having ammo, they expected us to not have a single round on us, whereas on our outpost we had one in the chamber at all times. So they wanted us to hand over our grenades and ammo, and buy a PT belt, yeah.... Not happening. Why is an MP even worried about these issues? Seems like they got bored and felt they needed something to gripe about.

We lived on a combat outpost. Everyone there was 11 series, except a few mechanics, our medics, one SEAL team, and a couple of weatherman, oh and like three seabees. Other than that, nothing. No one griped if you didn't shave for a week, you wore body armor any time you left your building, and moved around like you were constantly being watched and always prepared for an attack. Food was mostly MRE, or brought in by mermites. Completely combat focused, you were never really off duty.

There was no need for MPs.
What did you do during your deployments?

Sounds like we served at the same AO. The only difference between my deployments in 04 and 06 with the Army, and my deployments in 08 and 09 with the Air Force is that the last two I wore ABUs instead of ACUs. I had the awesome pleasure of being a USAF Transportation type assigned to the Army, and as such had to go get the mermites EVERY SINGLE DAY. I hated it and got shot at alot because I had to leave the wire so much. As soon as we came into a major facility like JBB or BIA, we had to put on our reflective belts, shave, and take the mags out of our weapons. They didnt bust our stones too much except when your PT shirt wasnt tucked in, and I did have a very fresh 2LT get on my butt about wearing sunglasses in the commissary (they were prescription oakleys much to his dismay)

[Devil Doc]

I have a feeling this whole NRA thing is going to get bigger than we realize. If the govt get there way, we will be neutered of our gun rights.  It will be a "Police State" You think the "Average" person in america on this gun ban craze wants there kids to learn about guns? PrisonPlanet.com and InfoWars.com, should give you more info.