Uniform Comfort in the Classroom Setting

[RADIOMAN015]

Interstingly, it was noted this weekend at the ICS 300 course in MA that most of the attendees (and all of the instructor staff), wore the blue golf shirt with grey pants.  Some wore the blue BDU's and just a few wore the AF type uniforms.  Also a few wore the aviator/grey pants combination.  One of them changed to the Golf shirt the 2nd day.

Perhaps the Golf Shirt is just a very comfortable "uniform" for classroom settings
RM   

[The CyBorg is destroyed]

Your point is, other than to push the corporate uniform agenda and place emphasis on how "few," in your opinion, were wearing the AF blues?

I took SLS and CLC wearing the AF blues.

I taught at an SLS wearing the AF blues.

I was never uncomfortable.

Whether you like it or not, the blue uniform is an authorised CAP uniform.  If you want that to change, you know how to forward proposals through your chain of command.

[Spaceman3750]

Interstingly, it was noted this weekend at the ICS 300 course in MA that most of the attendees (and all of the instructor staff), wore the blue golf shirt with grey pants.  Some wore the blue BDU's and just a few wore the AF type uniforms.  Also a few wore the aviator/grey pants combination.  One of them changed to the Golf shirt the 2nd day.

Perhaps the Golf Shirt is just a very comfortable "uniform" for classroom settings
RM   

It is, but no less so than BDU's. Ask a recent NESA GTL grad and they will tell you that you will spend the first 2 days of the course in a classroom - the only thing uncomfortable about that was the chairs they made us sit in!

I'm a huge fan of the golf shirt for its simplicity, but I think that you have an ulterior motive here .

[The CyBorg is destroyed]

I'm a huge fan of the golf shirt for its simplicity, but I think that you have an ulterior motive here .

He does...

[Pylon]

I would argue there's nothing uncomfortable about the blues or their corporate equivalent.  I've worn dress shirts, slacks, and dress shoes to work (aka: an office setting) every day for years.  Heck, most of the time it's with a tie and suit coat or blazer, too.  I don't see much of a difference between the blues or its corporate equivalent and any other dress attire because there isn't really any difference whatsoever, save (the minimum requirements of) one nameplate I have to slap on and the soft shouldermarks.  Hundreds of thousands of Americans wear dress clothes in classroom and office settings every day.


If you eschew the blues or the aviator combo because you find them uncomfortable, perhaps you might consider what's causing the discomfort.  Do your blues or aviator combos fit properly?  Are you trying to wear a giant ribbon stack, four devices, and 8 shirt-stays with a heavily-starched shirt?  Are you wearing a comfortable pair of leather shoes and socks?  If you're cold, you can add appropriate underlayers or even the wooly-pully or cardigan.  If you're warm, the short-sleeve shirt worn open-collar with a nice technical white undershirt are just as cool as a golf shirt.   I guess I don't see what you find uncomfortable about the blues or aviator combo?  Care to expound?

[Duke Dillio]

Perhaps it is simply because the polo shirt is considered more appropriate for that type of training.  For corporate classroom stuff (SLS, CLC, RSC, UCC, TLC) the uniform everyone was in was either the AF or corporate dress uniform.  At almost every single ES classroom (with the exception of those GT type classes), the uniform has been the polo shirt.  GT classes generally tend to have BDU's everywhere.  From my perspective, considering that I am in a wing where the locals are hostile to CAP, we wear the polo because somehow it isn't as "threatening" to the locals.  We seem to fit in better.  These are just my points of view.  YMMV.

[spacecommand]

For comfort, I don't feel anymore uncomfortable wearing whites or blues, they're just fine.

Perhaps the Golf Shirt is just a very comfortable "uniform" for classroom settings
RM   

Perhaps... but perhaps the guy spilled coffee on his white shirt and changed into his next available outfit, (can happen to the polo shirt too).  Perhaps some of them only owned golf shirts because they think that is the "basic" uniform (even though it's not), perhaps a K-9 ate the other guy's blues, or perhaps the Post Office shipped the other guy's whites to Mars instead of Massachusetts. 

[SARDOC]

For Comfort in a class room, I don't wear a uniform at all.  I wear my purple footie pajamas and a snuggie.

[Spaceman3750]

For Comfort in a class room, I don't wear a uniform at all.  I wear my purple footie pajamas and a snuggie.

+1

Also, +1 to the polo being a bit more appropriate for ES classroom settings. Not because "We shouldn't look like the AF", but when everyone else in the room is wearing an agency polo and slacks you fit in better by doing the same.

[The CyBorg is destroyed]

Also, +1 to the polo being a bit more appropriate for ES classroom settings. Not because "We shouldn't look like the AF", but when everyone else in the room is wearing an agency polo and slacks you fit in better by doing the same.

Non-concur...but I've always been the proverbial square peg in the round hole.

I gave a presentation to an ES volunteer group (non-CAP) some years ago wearing my service dress.

I might stand that one on its head...what if everyone else in the room is wearing an AF uniform and you're the only one in the golf shirt?

I still think this goes back to RM's zealousness to get rid of all quasi-military resemblances for CAP.

[Spaceman3750]

Also, +1 to the polo being a bit more appropriate for ES classroom settings. Not because "We shouldn't look like the AF", but when everyone else in the room is wearing an agency polo and slacks you fit in better by doing the same.

I might stand that one on its head...what if everyone else in the room is wearing an AF uniform and you're the only one in the golf shirt?

I'm not talking about CAP-only or CAP-USAF situations. I'm talking about inter-agency things like ICS classes, SAR council meetings, etc.

And TBH, even on "blues" night I still wear my polo. My whites only come out for things like conferences and squadron banquets. Sue me.

[Pylon]

I actually think that's more than fine, because in this instance one is choosing to wear the polo because it's the appropriate attire for the occasion.  We should be choosing the uniform we select for the occasion based on what's most appropriate; we should not be making it first and foremost a comfort-based decision.  I have no problem with the polo -- as you aptly point out, sometimes it makes good sense for the situation.  I was merely pointing out that I felt the OP was suggesting the polo is inherently more comfortable to wear than the blues or aviator combo and therefore should replace it for routine wear.

[Larry Mangum]

While teaching ICSS classes at NESA, I primarily wear BDU's, and occassionaly the Polo and Grey slack combination, but that is just me.  Probably 50% of the instructors wore polo's or aviators, and the only thing I cared about, was that no matter what uniform they wore, it was worn correctly.

[rustyjeeper]

For comfort, I don't feel anymore uncomfortable wearing whites or blues, they're just fine.

Perhaps the Golf Shirt is just a very comfortable "uniform" for classroom settings
RM   

Perhaps... but perhaps the guy spilled coffee on his white shirt and changed into his next available outfit, (can happen to the polo shirt too).  Perhaps some of them only owned golf shirts because they think that is the "basic" uniform (even though it's not), perhaps a K-9 ate the other guy's blues, or perhaps the Post Office shipped the other guy's whites to Mars instead of Massachusetts.

OKAY- finally one I  can answer with 100% certainty that the answer cant be wrong!
I was the guy in the aviator shirt on day one who went to the polo on day two
The reason plain and simple for my not wearing the AF uniform is I DO NOT meet the weight requirements for the AF uniform so I wear the white/gray combo when a dress uniform is required. So for day one I chose to follow the lead of my unit's command and wear the same uniform because I had it. Two others from my unit do not own the aviator and they chose to wear the polo combo on day one so as to be in uniform and get the training.
Kudo's to them for stepping up and spending their time (and money) in getting something IMPORTANT accomplished rather than spending money on unneccesary uniforms. Everyone's resources are limited- money can be spent on uniforms or to attend training with what you have. Event had a cost, transportation did, and so did lodging/ for me it was a hundred and fifty dollar weekend!

NONE from my unit wore BDU's those were not appropriate for the event, per the MASAR commandant's written instruction where "corporate attire" was specified as the UOD and this was a MASAR event- my unit respected that direction given.

DAY two all of the member's of my unit wore the same uniform to the training for two reasons:
1- uniformity and that is what the Squadron Commander chose to wear.
2-it simply is more comfortable to wear during "death by powerpoint" events LOL and though I say that I felt that the instructors did an outstanding job of taking very DRY material and getting us all to learn and stay awake.

So my reason was twofold/ uniformity with my Squadron and also COMFORT-- in truth if it were all comfort the polo would have been worn with jeans and sneakers but that would not be professional or within regulation.

No need for taking a great training event and being critical over CHICKEN-S__T uniform policies. AND I hope RADIOMAN15 was simply commenting and not being critical he is not the only military vetran of our attendee's from my unit FOUR were military vets myself included in that and my MOS was one which specialized in CHICKEN-S--T petty regulation enforcement as a part of the job. There is no personal offense taken by RM's comment on my part- I hope this was simply an observation and not criticism, if it were intended that way I would be very upset.

[rustyjeeper]

And as further observation:
The instructor for the event wore the POLO combination and he is the National ES Officer---
so my guess is that the POLO was indeed appropriate for this setting

[Larry Mangum]

Absolutely, the polo combination was appropriate.  Anyone who says otherwise is incorrect.  As one of those guys who represents CAP in state EOC's, I also agree that a polo combination is more akin to what the paid professionals, with the exceptional of the guard or active components are wearing.  The standard uniform in most EOC's seems to consist of 511 tactical pants and polos.

[Al Sayre]

Unless your state EOC puts you in with the Guard and AD folks, then the polo stands out like the proverbial turd in the punchbowl. Last time I worked the EOC, our area was a pretty good mix of flight suits, ACU's, ABU's, BDU's, and Navy Khaki's...

[rustyjeeper]

Myself on day one when in the white shirt, I was wishing I was in the Polo especially at lunchtime. White and I just dont get along very well for some reason.......
And I just knew that the food would likely be italian. It was, and the sauce landed where I also knew it would. I must be psychic

[spacecommand]

My argument isn't which uniform is appropriate but rather that somehow the aviator or blues are not comfortable for a classroom setting, which I disagree with.  Blues and whites are just as comfortable for that type of setting.  Though RM generally has some sort of other motive that we should all be wearing golf shirts no matter what.

[Eclipse]

When representing CAP to an outside organization in a classroom setting, I generally wear a more formal business attire (ss whites / blues), then adjust the rest of the time as appropriate.

It's always easier to be less formal later, and still set a proper tone initially, then vice-versa.