BDU's are dangerous?

cadetesman · August 16, 2011, 11:05:22 PM

I've been wondering lately if BDU's present a risk to members and ground teams. I say this, because of the fact that a woodland camo pattern makes us look like military/police/militia. I know that we wear the orange vests, but still, whats with BDU's, we want to be seen. I know that it's an AF style uniform, but in CAP, SAFETY IS PARAMOUNT. Who else has thought that BBDU's would be a lot more appropriate?

JC004 · August 16, 2011, 11:12:43 PM

Do we have evidence that this has proven a problem, or that looking like the military or whatever is a safety hazard?

BDUs have been authorized for a LONG TIME. If it were a major problem, there would be plenty of evidence right now.

RiverAux · August 16, 2011, 11:46:50 PM

I think we've had a 25 year (or so) test period that has proven that there isn't a safety problem.

There may be other reasons that the BDU may not be the best field uniform for CAP, but safety isn't one of them.

Major Lord · August 17, 2011, 12:00:08 AM

The idea that Ground Teams get lost and are then impossible to spot from the air has been around for a long time, although I have never actually seen this in practice ( of course, GTM's must be wearing their Safety Orange vests at all time in the field

) My pet peeve with BDU's is primarily a Cadet issue: Any starch in the uniform makes them very flammable, and starched collars in the heat can act like a saw, cutting away at your neck until your head rolls off your shoulders. The threat of possible misidentification as Law Enforcement to me is outweighed by the aire of authority we project in proper uniform. If you think walking around an airport flight-line is dangerous in BDU's (especially on a military base) see what happens when you go for a stroll with a weird looking piece of electronic kit in civvies, a haji man-dress, a ski mask, or in some sort of hafast uniform melange'!

Major Lord

JC004 · August 17, 2011, 12:02:57 AM

Quote from: Major Lord on August 17, 2011, 12:00:08 AM
...
Any starch in the uniform makes them very flammable, and starched collars in the heat can act like a saw, cutting away at your neck until your head rolls off your shoulders.
...

cooooooooool

titanII · August 17, 2011, 12:07:01 AM

Quote from: RiverAux on August 16, 2011, 11:46:50 PM
There may be other reasons that the BDU may not be the best field uniform for CAP, but safety isn't one of them.

+1

If visibility were the first thing in mind for CAP utility uniforms, we would probably be wearing bright orange utility-type uniform, complete with reflective strips and strobe lights

Something like this:

I think that the BDU's were picked for their (United States) military look, durability, and (most often) low cost to members (due to availability at bases, surplus stores, etc.). Whether or not BDU's were the right decision is a question I have yet to answer myself.

Eclipse · August 17, 2011, 12:09:06 AM

Quote from: Major Lord on August 17, 2011, 12:00:08 AM...and starched collars in the heat can act like a saw, cutting away at your neck until your head rolls off your shoulders...

I've actually seen this happen, thanks for dredging a horrible memory I had long buried.

I...just...wanted...them...to...look...SHARP! Who knew they would burst into headless, flaming, balls of camouflage horror!

AirDX · August 17, 2011, 12:15:21 AM

It's impossible for words to describe what is necessary to those who do not know what horror means. Horror... Horror has a face... and you must make a friend of horror. Horror and moral terror are your friends. If they are not, then they are enemies to be feared.

zonaman · August 17, 2011, 12:17:15 AM

At this point in time I hardly think that we (CAP) would be confused with Police, Military, or Militias. Almost all Police and Militias have moved to the ACU or some sort of digital uniform (they like to be up with the times). As for the military I think we all know that the BDU is gone. Except of course for the AF, but that will end very soon. On DMAFB there are like 5 Airmen left that wear the BDU.

So, there shouldn't be any confusion here.

Out of the two field uniforms we have, the BBDU's would actually the DANGEROUS uniform, because of the Coast Guard.(according to your standards)

cadetesman · August 17, 2011, 12:43:30 AM

Thank you everyone, your answers and explanations really put things into perspective, just wanted to know, because on a UDF exercise I had bud's complete with orange vest, and I got some looks. A big thank you to Major Lord, because of the flammability issue, will definitely make me use a lot less starch. Thanks for making me much more comfortable about not being misidentified.

Major Lord · August 17, 2011, 12:47:01 AM

Quote from: AirDX on August 17, 2011, 12:15:21 AM
It's impossible for words to describe what is necessary to those who do not know what horror means. Horror... Horror has a face... and you must make a friend of horror. Horror and moral terror are your friends. If they are not, then they are enemies to be feared.

Colonel Kurtz, is that you? I am glad that you clarified that; I always thought I was supposed to make Whores my friends, but your way is much better!

Major Lord

JC004 · August 17, 2011, 01:16:40 AM

Quote from: cadetesman on August 17, 2011, 12:43:30 AM
Thank you everyone, your answers and explanations really put things into perspective, just wanted to know, because on a UDF exercise I had bud's complete with orange vest, and I got some looks. A big thank you to Major Lord, because of the flammability issue, will definitely make me use a lot less starch. Thanks for making me much more comfortable about not being misidentified.

If you walk around with a DF unit in any type of clothing, people will look at you strange. If you are pulled over on the side of the road looking at maps in any clothing, some people will look at you. As a senior member wisely pointed out to me as a C/AB, don't be self-conscious about the uniform. A lot of people do not care and because someone is looking at you and you are wearing a BDU doesn't mean they wouldn't be looking at you if you weren't wearing it.

Thrashed · August 17, 2011, 01:23:25 AM

We wear the BDU because of the military connection. Sure, we wear the old style woodland camo, which I prefer over the modern ones. The ironic thing to me in PA is that we dress in camouflage (which is to not be seen) and head into the woods covered in orange (to be seen). Who really cares in the end?

JC004 · August 17, 2011, 01:49:05 AM

Quote from: Thrash on August 17, 2011, 01:23:25 AM
We wear the BDU because of the military connection. Sure, we wear the old style woodland camo, which I prefer over the modern ones. The ironic thing to me in PA is that we dress in camouflage (which is to not be seen) and head into the woods covered in orange (to be seen). Who really cares in the end?

Isn't that what hunters do?

JayT · August 17, 2011, 01:49:40 AM

Quote from: cadetesman on August 16, 2011, 11:05:22 PM
I've been wondering lately if BDU's present a risk to members and ground teams. I say this, because of the fact that a woodland camo pattern makes us look like military/police/militia. I know that we wear the orange vests, but still, whats with BDU's, we want to be seen. I know that it's an AF style uniform, but in CAP, SAFETY IS PARAMOUNT. Who else has thought that BBDU's would be a lot more appropriate?

Cops wear blue BDU's all the time.

Thrashed · August 17, 2011, 02:05:17 AM

Quote from: JC004 on August 17, 2011, 01:49:05 AM
Quote from: Thrash on August 17, 2011, 01:23:25 AM
We wear the BDU because of the military connection. Sure, we wear the old style woodland camo, which I prefer over the modern ones. The ironic thing to me in PA is that we dress in camouflage (which is to not be seen) and head into the woods covered in orange (to be seen). Who really cares in the end?

Isn't that what hunters do?

That depends on the state, game hunted, and type of season. But yes, that is mostly true.
Archery hunters not moving need no orange. If they move, they have to have a certain amount of orange. Rifles always need orange showing in PA.

Smokey · August 17, 2011, 02:36:48 AM

Titan....WHY oh WHY did you post that picture...

Don't you realize you provide Radioman with ammo?

??

Now he will push for that outfit so that he can remind everyone that we are not the military (therfore not worthy of the BDU). Of course he would add in large letters on the back...."This person is not to be confused with a member of the military"

PHall · August 17, 2011, 02:44:17 AM

Quote from: Smokey on August 17, 2011, 02:36:48 AM
Titan....WHY oh WHY did you post that picture...

Don't you realize you provide Radioman with ammo???

Now he will push for that outfit so that he can remind everyone that we are not the military (therfore not worthy of the BDU). Of course he would add in large letters on the back...."This person is not to be confused with a member of the military"

Only if it had CIVIL Air Patrol on the back!

titanII · August 17, 2011, 03:02:10 AM

Quote from: Smokey on August 17, 2011, 02:36:48 AM
Titan....WHY oh WHY did you post that picture...

Don't you realize you provide Radioman with ammo???

Now he will push for that outfit so that he can remind everyone that we are not the military (therfore not worthy of the BDU). Of course he would add in large letters on the back...."This person is not to be confused with a member of the military"

Knights of Columbus!!! What a terrible mistake!

zonaman · August 17, 2011, 03:19:30 AM

Quote from: Smokey on August 17, 2011, 02:36:48 AM
Titan....WHY oh WHY did you post that picture...

Don't you realize you provide Radioman with ammo???

Now he will push for that outfit so that he can remind everyone that we are not the military (therfore not worthy of the BDU). Of course he would add in large letters on the back...."This person is not to be confused with a member of the military"

+1