CAP Talk

General Discussion => Uniforms & Awards => Topic started by: majdomke on July 11, 2019, 11:05:37 PM

Title: ABU Supply Drying Up
Post by: majdomke on July 11, 2019, 11:05:37 PM
Has anyone else discovered their base has no or next to no ABUs in stock? Although the AF has given a 3-year phase in that hasnít stopped local commanders from implementing or authorizing wear of the new style. As a result, the aisle at the Travis AFB uniform store went from all ABUs, to 1/2 ABUs, and now just last month about a 12í section of male/female combined. Most were crazy/odd sizes like Extra Tall which we know will never help us. Others were just big sizes teens generally wonít fit. I move to my backup Kel-Lac that now is discounting their ABUs with small sizes sold out. That leaves Vanguard that now has Tru-Spec but sold in generic sizes. My concern is that all other options are drying up and how long will Vanguard get these uniforms. Eventually, very soon I imagine, they will be the only customer for Tru-Spec which means less demand and higher prices. In just three short years, CAP has gone from BDUs that continues to be regularly available, to ABUs worn only by USAF who is now phasing them out. Since itís not likely in the 5-10 yrs weíre going to be approved for the new uniform, weíre about to run into trouble outfitting our cadets and ourselves.
Title: Re: ABU Supply Drying Up
Post by: Kayll'b on July 12, 2019, 01:30:29 AM
Yup, noticed that a year ago.
Title: Re: ABU Supply Drying Up
Post by: PHall on July 12, 2019, 02:40:13 AM
March ARB, LA AFB and Edwards AFB still have lots of ABU's.
Title: Re: ABU Supply Drying Up
Post by: majdomke on July 12, 2019, 06:16:17 AM
Send them up to us Phil. Last time we got anything from Edwards it was all female sizes and small.


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Title: Re: ABU Supply Drying Up
Post by: shuman14 on July 12, 2019, 01:27:50 PM
As I've said before, time to get the OCP ball rolling.

Get ahead of this escalating problem BEFORE it becomes a real problem.

Dark Blue tapes and insignia will look just fine on OCP... as will black boots.  ;)
Title: Re: ABU Supply Drying Up
Post by: RangerConlin on July 12, 2019, 05:36:53 PM
I've found lately that EBay is a good source for ABUs. Can find used ones for a decent price as well.

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Title: Re: ABU Supply Drying Up
Post by: Dwight Dutton on July 12, 2019, 08:31:05 PM
Send them up to us Phil. Last time we got anything from Edwards it was all female sizes and small.

When I picked up the supply we got from El Segundo it was:

1. Maternity uniforms
2. Tops we could use, but with no pants that matched.
3. Pants we could use but no tops.
4. Complete uniforms, but not in a size anyone in CAP was actually authorized to wear.

We had put out to the groups to provide us with a spreadsheet of just what sizes they needed.  I was able to outfit exactly one female cadet 1st LT with ABU's that fit.

I think 80% of that stuff is still crammed in storage.
Title: Re: ABU Supply Drying Up
Post by: Fester on July 13, 2019, 05:05:06 AM
Is the ABU supply at Vanguard drying up? Why not just buy from Vanguard?
Title: Re: ABU Supply Drying Up
Post by: I_Am_Twigs on July 13, 2019, 07:31:17 AM
As I've said before, time to get the OCP ball rolling.

Get ahead of this escalating problem BEFORE it becomes a real problem.

Dark Blue tapes and insignia will look just fine on OCP... as will black boots.  ;)

+1

I think OCPís would be our best bet, not because of ďoh they look cool,Ē or ďletís follow the USAF because total force,Ē rather, itíd be because itís cheap, readily available, presents a good picture to the public (if worn right, but thatís what clear regs and reg enforcement is for), and because it would maintain, if not help our R&R rates.

The dark blue nametapes, Velcro fleece nametapes available through scamguard vanguard specifically, would look perfectly fine on OCPís. I am not a huge fan of the black boots with OCPís, although, they would look better than black boots and ABUís.

I've found lately that EBay is a good source for ABUs. Can find used ones for a decent price as well.

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The only problem with that is that the uniforms, in the right sizes, are often few and far between. For you they may be easy to find, but for someone like my brother, who is fairly short and skinny, those uniforms will be extremely hard to find.

Is the ABU supply at Vanguard drying up? Why not just buy from Vanguard?

The ABUís that scamguard vanguard provides are not true ABUís, and from what I have heard they are not very durable.
Title: Re: ABU Supply Drying Up
Post by: abdsp51 on July 13, 2019, 12:56:38 PM
OCPs are not by any means cheap.  It would have cost me about 300 bucks to outfit myself with one set.
Title: Re: ABU Supply Drying Up
Post by: Ozzy on July 13, 2019, 01:37:02 PM
OCPs are not by any means cheap.  It would have cost me about 300 bucks to outfit myself with one set.

$300? I'm assuming that is adding in the boots and getting a bunch of patches sew onto them rather than velcro'd on. I bought two sets  (No boots) when the Army started allowing them and both cost me less then $250. And that included all new velcro patches.
Title: Re: ABU Supply Drying Up
Post by: SAREXinNY on July 13, 2019, 06:22:29 PM
We should be wearing whatever the Air Force is wearing, for numerous reasons. Just add 2 (or so) years onto the phase out date of the older uniform and call it a day. Stop the guessing games. Stop the "we should switch to..." nonsense. Make it simple and automatic...when they change, we change.
Title: Re: ABU Supply Drying Up
Post by: etodd on July 13, 2019, 06:42:40 PM
We should be wearing whatever the Air Force is wearing ...when they change, we change.


Hopefully the polo will not change anytime soon. Relatively cheap even with my name and Senior MP wings on them.  I have four that I alternate that still look brand new. Hoping to get several years out of them. :)
Title: Re: ABU Supply Drying Up
Post by: MSG Mac on July 13, 2019, 07:23:32 PM
Problem is that the AF wonít allow CAP to have OCPs until they have outfitted every AF member first.
Title: Re: ABU Supply Drying Up
Post by: abdsp51 on July 13, 2019, 11:07:28 PM
OCPs are not by any means cheap.  It would have cost me about 300 bucks to outfit myself with one set.

$300? I'm assuming that is adding in the boots and getting a bunch of patches sew onto them rather than velcro'd on. I bought two sets  (No boots) when the Army started allowing them and both cost me less then $250. And that included all new velcro patches.

300 including 1 top 1 bottom a hat boots etc
Title: Re: ABU Supply Drying Up
Post by: francisderosa16 on July 14, 2019, 12:35:13 AM
Hanscom AFB has TONS of ABUs!
Title: Re: ABU Supply Drying Up
Post by: PHall on July 14, 2019, 01:25:22 AM
Is the ABU supply at Vanguard drying up? Why not just buy from Vanguard?

Because they sell crap, that's why.
Title: Re: ABU Supply Drying Up
Post by: etodd on July 14, 2019, 02:39:42 AM
OK. I'm the guy who doesn't know jack about uniforms, so I'll ask the question that pops into mind. Has the AF at any time pondered the idea of just coming up with specific CAP outdoor uniform, so that we would not have to chase what they wear and have these issues? And maybe while they are at it, make it reflective orange, instead of the non-sensible camo?  Design it to be the uniform for the next 50 years, no matter what the enlisted AF members wear?
Title: Re: ABU Supply Drying Up
Post by: PHall on July 14, 2019, 03:50:58 AM
No they haven't. Why would they?
Title: Re: ABU Supply Drying Up
Post by: etodd on July 14, 2019, 03:54:41 AM
No they haven't. Why would they?

Well for one .... so we wouldn't continually have these shortage issues every time the AF decides to change "theirs".  And could eliminate hundreds of threads about the problems of finding uniforms. LOL
Title: Re: ABU Supply Drying Up
Post by: JayT on July 14, 2019, 04:08:28 AM
No they haven't. Why would they?

Well for one .... so we wouldn't continually have these shortage issues every time the AF decides to change "theirs".  And could eliminate hundreds of threads about the problems of finding uniforms. LOL

BDU's lasted from the late 80s to very recently, Air Force wise. ABU's were kind of an aberrant thing. I imagine that the USAF will be sticking with OCP's for a good while now.
Title: Re: ABU Supply Drying Up
Post by: MSG Mac on July 14, 2019, 04:19:32 AM
OK. I'm the guy who doesn't know jack about uniforms, so I'll ask the question that pops into mind. Has the AF at any time pondered the idea of just coming up with specific CAP outdoor uniform, so that we would not have to chase what they wear and have these issues? And maybe while they are at it, make it reflective orange, instead of the non-sensible camo?  Design it to be the uniform for the next 50 years, no matter what the enlisted AF members wear?

There is an alternative "Blue" BDU uniform available.
Title: ABU Supply Drying Up
Post by: Mitchell 1969 on July 14, 2019, 07:41:04 AM

Hopefully the polo will not change anytime soon. Relatively cheap even with my name and Senior MP wings on them. 

A pet peeve, if I may:

I donít know why people keep calling wings by names that donít fit their actual description. There are no ďSenior MPĒ wings, for example. They are ďSenior PilotĒ wings. One does not need to be a MP in order to be a Senior Pilot. Anyway, thanks for reading.



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Title: Re: ABU Supply Drying Up
Post by: PHall on July 14, 2019, 04:04:46 PM
OK. I'm the guy who doesn't know jack about uniforms, so I'll ask the question that pops into mind. Has the AF at any time pondered the idea of just coming up with specific CAP outdoor uniform, so that we would not have to chase what they wear and have these issues? And maybe while they are at it, make it reflective orange, instead of the non-sensible camo?  Design it to be the uniform for the next 50 years, no matter what the enlisted AF members wear?

There is an alternative "Blue" BDU uniform available.

Not for cadets. The only time cadets can wear "corporate" uniforms is if they don't meet the height-weight standards and they are 18 or older.
Title: Re: ABU Supply Drying Up
Post by: Eclipse on July 14, 2019, 05:20:20 PM
Which could be simply and easily changed with another improperly published memo.
Title: Re: ABU Supply Drying Up
Post by: etodd on July 14, 2019, 11:24:07 PM
Which could be simply and easily changed with another improperly published memo.

.... in a Dropbox.  ;)
Title: Re: ABU Supply Drying Up
Post by: shuman14 on July 15, 2019, 06:26:14 PM
Problem is that the AF wonít allow CAP to have OCPs until they have outfitted every AF member first.

Which, by my observation, should be about the end of this year.

Seriously, if you go to any Army Exchange you will not find any ACU or ABU pattern... anything... left on the shelves. It's OCP only now. Been to Knox, Hood, Drum and Camp Atterbury in the last six months and it's all the same... OCP only with ones-twoies left in ABU or ACU.

So if you can access an Army Base, same issue CAP has getting on Air Bases applies, the Army Clothing and Sales will happily sell you OCPs.

Now, someone needs to authorize CAP to wear OCPs... but I digress.
Title: Re: ABU Supply Drying Up
Post by: Eclipse on July 15, 2019, 06:43:35 PM
Since MCSS and AAFES are non-factors for the majority of CAP members, whether or
not you can get ABUs at those locations, vs. CAP's official supplier, should be irrelevant to
any decisions about changing the uniforms.

Considering you can buy them on Amazon, and have them delivered next day, it's not
exactly a crisis.
Title: Re: ABU Supply Drying Up
Post by: PHall on July 15, 2019, 06:50:00 PM
Problem is that the AF wonít allow CAP to have OCPs until they have outfitted every AF member first.

Which, by my observation, should be about the end of this year.

Seriously, if you go to any Army Exchange you will not find any ACU or ABU pattern... anything... left on the shelves. It's OCP only now. Been to Knox, Hood, Drum and Camp Atterbury in the last six months and it's all the same... OCP only with ones-twoies left in ABU or ACU.

So if you can access an Army Base, same issue CAP has getting on Air Bases applies, the Army Clothing and Sales will happily sell you OCPs.

Now, someone needs to authorize CAP to wear OCPs... but I digress.


Actually, no they won't. AAFES can not sell OCP's to Air Force personnel, and I have lumped CAP into the Air Force personnel category for the sake of argument, until a date to be determined.
Title: Re: ABU Supply Drying Up
Post by: arajca on July 15, 2019, 07:16:09 PM
Actually, AAFES can sell OCPs to AF personnel. It just depends which base you're at.
Title: Re: ABU Supply Drying Up
Post by: abdsp51 on July 15, 2019, 08:02:14 PM
Problem is that the AF wonít allow CAP to have OCPs until they have outfitted every AF member first.

Which, by my observation, should be about the end of this year.

Seriously, if you go to any Army Exchange you will not find any ACU or ABU pattern... anything... left on the shelves. It's OCP only now. Been to Knox, Hood, Drum and Camp Atterbury in the last six months and it's all the same... OCP only with ones-twoies left in ABU or ACU.

So if you can access an Army Base, same issue CAP has getting on Air Bases applies, the Army Clothing and Sales will happily sell you OCPs.

Now, someone needs to authorize CAP to wear OCPs... but I digress.


Actually, no they won't. AAFES can not sell OCP's to Air Force personnel, and I have lumped CAP into the Air Force personnel category for the sake of argument, until a date to be determined.

Actually they will and have been for some time now.
Title: Re: ABU Supply Drying Up
Post by: PHall on July 15, 2019, 09:54:57 PM
Problem is that the AF wonít allow CAP to have OCPs until they have outfitted every AF member first.

Which, by my observation, should be about the end of this year.

Seriously, if you go to any Army Exchange you will not find any ACU or ABU pattern... anything... left on the shelves. It's OCP only now. Been to Knox, Hood, Drum and Camp Atterbury in the last six months and it's all the same... OCP only with ones-twoies left in ABU or ACU.

So if you can access an Army Base, same issue CAP has getting on Air Bases applies, the Army Clothing and Sales will happily sell you OCPs.

Now, someone needs to authorize CAP to wear OCPs... but I digress.


Actually, no they won't. AAFES can not sell OCP's to Air Force personnel, and I have lumped CAP into the Air Force personnel category for the sake of argument, until a date to be determined.

Actually they will and have been for some time now.

Depending on the base you're at. Currently AF personnel can not buy them at March ARB, Los Angeles AFB and Edwards AFB.
Subject to change if AAFES and DLATS ever get their acts together.
Title: Re: ABU Supply Drying Up
Post by: abdsp51 on July 15, 2019, 10:29:13 PM
Problem is that the AF wonít allow CAP to have OCPs until they have outfitted every AF member first.

Which, by my observation, should be about the end of this year.

Seriously, if you go to any Army Exchange you will not find any ACU or ABU pattern... anything... left on the shelves. It's OCP only now. Been to Knox, Hood, Drum and Camp Atterbury in the last six months and it's all the same... OCP only with ones-twoies left in ABU or ACU.

So if you can access an Army Base, same issue CAP has getting on Air Bases applies, the Army Clothing and Sales will happily sell you OCPs.

Now, someone needs to authorize CAP to wear OCPs... but I digress.


Actually, no they won't. AAFES can not sell OCP's to Air Force personnel, and I have lumped CAP into the Air Force personnel category for the sake of argument, until a date to be determined.

Actually they will and have been for some time now.

Depending on the base you're at. Currently AF personnel can not buy them at March ARB, Los Angeles AFB and Edwards AFB.
Subject to change if AAFES and DLATS ever get their acts together.

They can at Travis and here at Tinker. 
Title: Re: ABU Supply Drying Up
Post by: PHall on July 16, 2019, 01:34:31 AM
Problem is that the AF wonít allow CAP to have OCPs until they have outfitted every AF member first.

Which, by my observation, should be about the end of this year.

Seriously, if you go to any Army Exchange you will not find any ACU or ABU pattern... anything... left on the shelves. It's OCP only now. Been to Knox, Hood, Drum and Camp Atterbury in the last six months and it's all the same... OCP only with ones-twoies left in ABU or ACU.

So if you can access an Army Base, same issue CAP has getting on Air Bases applies, the Army Clothing and Sales will happily sell you OCPs.

Now, someone needs to authorize CAP to wear OCPs... but I digress.


Actually, no they won't. AAFES can not sell OCP's to Air Force personnel, and I have lumped CAP into the Air Force personnel category for the sake of argument, until a date to be determined.

Actually they will and have been for some time now.

Depending on the base you're at. Currently AF personnel can not buy them at March ARB, Los Angeles AFB and Edwards AFB.
Subject to change if AAFES and DLATS ever get their acts together.

They can at Travis and here at Tinker.

Which is why the OP in the first post said he couldn't find ABU's at Travis.
Title: Re: ABU Supply Drying Up
Post by: shuman14 on July 16, 2019, 01:34:35 PM
Actually, AAFES can sell OCPs to AF personnel. It just depends which base you're at.

Exactly.