I am in need to make a new wing-patch design as part of a CAC proposal. I've been googling for Air Force Heraldry regulations with little luck. Is there anyone that may have knowledge of or a copy of heraldry guidelines?
Also, I know the two mandatory colors are ultramarine blue and 'air force' yellow and that the patch must be a shield, not a disc (being that echelon is a wing, not a squadron). So, what I don't know is the font type: Is there a particular font I need to use or does it not make a significant difference?
Appreciate it!
http://ilcap.org/ilsups/M39-1ILWGsup1.pdf
AFAIK there is no specification regarding font.
I attempted to attach a PDF file on Air Force heraldry for you but I cannot find an attachment button to post it. Therefore, go to http://www.e-publishing.af.mil/?txtSearchWord=afi84-105&rdoFormPub=rdoPub (http://www.e-publishing.af.mil/?txtSearchWord=afi84-105&rdoFormPub=rdoPub) for the actual file.
Quote from: CAPOfficer on November 15, 2009, 09:25:30 PM
I attempted to attach a PDF file on Air Force heraldry for you but I cannot find an attachment button to post it. Therefore, go to http://www.e-publishing.af.mil/?txtSearchWord=afi84-105&rdoFormPub=rdoPub (http://www.e-publishing.af.mil/?txtSearchWord=afi84-105&rdoFormPub=rdoPub) for the actual file.
You can't attach until you have 100 posts...
This is the site that the ILWG document is borrowed from and where the USAF guidelines are stored.
http://www.afhra.af.mil/
A website that may have some info related to what you want: http://www.usafpatches.com/
A lot covered in there, so you may have to sift through to really discover anything that might be useful. It's focused on collectors, but might have something to help you.
That just might be the most boring current Wing patch out there. Probably time for something new.
Here's (http://www.e-publishing.af.mil/shared/media/epubs/AFI84-105.pdf) the AFI.
So now that I'm on my way, I'm searching for the guidance of a photoshop pro (I have CS4 on hand right now).
I'm looking for a shooting star that would look good on a patch since I don't know if I can really 'draw' one on photoshop. All the good images from google are too small (and become pixelated when enlarged) while the rest are not what'd look good for what I need.
Any ideas, gurus?
Quote from: AvroArrow on November 16, 2009, 12:47:00 AM
So now that I'm on my way, I'm searching for the guidance of a photoshop pro (I have CS4 on hand right now).
I'm looking for a shooting star that would look good on a patch since I don't know if I can really 'draw' one on photoshop. All the good images from google are too small (and become pixelated when enlarged) while the rest are not what'd look good for what I need.
Any ideas, gurus?
Clipart.com, or any of the other and various art foundries, either as a source of the art or a source of ideas.
Right, so I know this isn't professional work. But good thing it's a proposal: we can have a professional fix it up later ;)
Anyways, thoughts? Criticism? Lemme know what you think!
---
edit: Also wanted to add the symbolism information.
•Colors:
»"Air Force" Yellow: Represents the excellence of all KSWG personnel.
»Ultramarine Blue: Represents the sky, the main theatre of operations of the United Stated Air Force and where C.A.P. performs some of its own search and rescue missions.
»Red around cross: Represents valor and success of KSWG personnel. Also represents lives saved by C.A.P. disaster relief and search and rescue missions.
»White and Black: Represents the good and bad times KSWG has gone through.
•Symbols:
»CAP Propeller: Represents KSWG's parent, C.A.P. NHQ
»Shooting star: Represents KSWG's past (what has been done to get to now) and how we have overcome the turmoil and road bumps encountered along the way. The star also represents our future destinations, going off into the distance knowing that there are many more challenges onward.
»Hospital Cross: Represents C.A.P.'s search and rescue, humanitarian, and disaster relief missions and how those missions help, protect, and save others' lives.
Lt Kerfoot,
Good idea so far, but it needs a little more tweaking. My recommendations:
1. Remove the motto from within the shield; mottos properly belong on a scroll. The C.A.P. initials below the prop and triangle are redundant. The 'shooting star' could be stylized similar to that of the astronaut's emblem (without the orbit). If so, it should point the opposite way, with the star toward the wearer's right (left if you're facing the emblem). (As shown going from lower left to upper right (as viewed facing the shield), it denotes illegitimacy in a heraldic blazon.) For contrast, the shooting star could be or (heraldic for 'gold' or yellow) with black outlining.
Remember that in a heraldic blazon, dexter (right) and sinister (left) refer to the wearer's right and left (shown opposite when facing the shield).
Instead of the red-outlined white cross, you may want to select a distinctive symbol, such as a sheaf of wheat or other item that commonly denotes the state of Kansas.
Again, good work.
Quote from: AlphaSigOU on November 16, 2009, 12:02:19 PM
Instead of the red-outlined white cross, you may want to select a distinctive symbol, such as a sheaf of wheat or other item that commonly denotes the state of Kansas.
Agreed, there's nothing on it that really says "Kansas". Of course, neither does the new FLWG patch, but it's got a nice hearldry to it.
Is this a project for the whole CAC, or are you taking it on by yourself? I'm not criticizing, just curious.
Good luck, I look forward to seeing the final product.
DN
For now, the image is 1 one of 5 other 'propsoal' from other KSWG CAC folks. (The project is a task assigned by the Wing CAC Chair for all council members).
I'll take the suggestions and forward them on in addition to the original submition.
Thanks!
Also, if you haven't already, read through this thread:
http://captalk.net/index.php?topic=572.0
You'll find a lot of good info there that will speak to many of your questions.
Also, if you're going to represent one of your missions on the Wing patch (i/e: Operations, with the cross) doesn't that leave out your other two missions from being represented (cadet programs and aerospace education)? I suppose you could argue that CP and AE can be represented somehow by the comet, though. Just a thought.
I have to agree about taking out the "CAP", the motto, and any other text from the field of the emblem. It should be purely symbolic with either the motto, or the unit name on the scroll. I've seen at least one USAF unit with a heater-shield emblem and only a motto on the scroll, if you're looking for precedent on that.
I'll take all these in mind at the upcoming meeting:
- Remove the motto to the scroll or erase it enitrely
- Add something more "Kasnas"
- Move the star from left-to-right to right-to-left
- Perhaps a better color scheme
I've appreciated the feedback. Keep it coming! ;)
I'm also for the "more Kansas" suggestions.
It's kind of a knee-jerk instinct for members when creating a Civil Air Patrol emblem, to try and represent ALL of what our organization is. The three missions, our ties to the Air Force, etc. There are hundreds, and I mean HUNDREDS of CAP unit patches out there that represent what our organization is very well - but not the actual unit that wears it!
So, think down, not up... Symbolize the wing and its subordinate units, not who Kansas is a part of - ie. North Central Region or the Air Force.
Representing the people that will use the emblem is the goal, using visual cues that identify what is UNIQUE about Kansas Wing - its own personnel, its own territory, its own missions, its own history. The "shooting star" concept is a good attempt at this.
But maybe think more possitively... A shooting star is burning out and about to die, which is the opposite of what is being conveyed by your description. Perhaps a "rising star" or even a sun.
Perhaps some ideas from the state flag - a popular go-to place for CAP wing patches, as well as guard and reserve patches. The Kansas Flag has a unique auqa and gold torse (the rope looking thing) that might be incorporated somehow.
If you've never been to it, scan through the CAP Patches website and maybe pick up some ideas...
http://www.incountry.us/cappatches/
The USAF Patches website mentioned above is also worth browsing through a bit.
Good luck to you and the CAC on this venture!
I'll give you a good example of a wing patch that hits close to home for me.
(http://www.157arw.ang.af.mil/shared/media/ggallery/hires/AFG-080916-042.jpg)
This is the patch for the 157th Air Refueling Wing, which is the New Hampshire Air National Guard.
I think it does everything that you're looking for in your Kansas proposal above.
1: It integrated the State Motto into the shield without it being in the field.
2: The Old Man of the Mountain is quintessential New Hampshire.
3: 13 stars represent 13 colonies, with the larger one representing NH.
etc, etc. I like it very much...
To Avro Arrow, Please consider ultramarine blue and golden orange. They look great together and just happen to be the original AAF colors.
Quote
2: The Old Man of the Mountain is quintessential New Hampshire.
He should have had Life Alert!
Good looking, simple design patch. And great use of dirrectional elements.
I am also a member of the committee that is responsible for the wing patch design for KSWG CAC. While I do not have an actual picture that I can show you, I do have an idea that alot of other cadets like. It would be a shield. The design would be as follows:
- Half (to 2/3) the main field would be Ultramarine blue to represent the sky and the other part (the bottom) would be gold which can represent multiple things like the KS wheat and excellence
- In the center of the blue field a windmill (or turbine depending on what looks better) with the propellers being the CAP 3-prop design to show the three-fold mission of CAP. The windmill represents the ever-moving wind and people of the KSWG. The windmill would be either white or silver.
- On either side of the windmill, the letters "K" and "S" are symbolized in gold. The staff of the letter "K" would have the design of beardless wheat.
- In the banner of the shield, the state motto "Ad Adstra Per Aspera" is written in black
What do you think? Could somebody maybe try to draw this up for me? I am presenting this design to the committee this weekend.
Boy, I feel late to this party.
A few thoughts, and some of this may be redundant to earlier posts, so please bear with me:
— Air Force heraldry guidelines say new emblems should not borrow elements. The CAP triangle and the cross should, by that standard, be out the door. (In fact, too many CAP emblems have the same redundant elements and should be yanked.)
— Wings with mottos put the mottos in the scroll. Leave any and all type out of the shield itself — reserve that space for the graphic element.
— Find things that are genuinely Kansan. But don't get too many elements involved, lest it look like it was designed by committee and ultimately mean nothing to anyone.
— Photoshop? Really? Big no-no. If you want to design an emblem that is crisp at any imaginable size, you need to bust out Illustrator and do it right.
— BRAINSTORM! Heck, do a cartoon of a Kansas jayhawk soaring, looking vigilant with a pair of binoculars around its neck. The silly ideas will come out first, and let them, because at some point good ideas will surface. (The "vigilant jayhawk" was a quick thought, but feel free to use it for a prototype.)
One thing that bothers me about this new rash of wing emblems is that previous heritage is thrown out the door. Florida's new emblem takes some serious explaining to make sense as a Florida emblem and not a SPACECOM wing patch. It doesn't say "Florida" at all. There was nothing wrong with Zack Mosley's alligator, except that over time it looked worse and worse (apparently, contractors weren't given access to the original drawing to keep it crisp). Nevada's patch is a copout, full of clipart (blasphemy!). Mississippi's new one should be illegal, it's such a piece of garbage. It's the Pontiac Aztek of CAP wing patches.
Many of the heritage wing emblems could be translated into the Air Force boiler shield rather easily (Ohio's, I've seen that way, and it's kickass). Kansas' emblem isn't one of them, but surely there's something unique to Kansas Wing CAP that could visually define it.
Keep working on it, mock up several, discuss the merits and disadvantages, seek advice (there's a couple of professional designers on this forum, folks, in addition to all the amateur Photoshop warriors) and you'll come up with something you'll be really proud of, as will your fellow Kansans.
</soapbox>
Quote from: BuckeyeDEJ on November 19, 2009, 04:10:36 AM
— Photoshop? Really? Big no-no. If you want to design an emblem that is crisp at any imaginable size, you need to bust out Illustrator and do it right.
CAP doesn't need them at "any imaginable size". We're not wrapping busses or billboards.
While I agree that vector may give you more options with vendors using outdated equipment, most stuff built with current technology can use bitmapped graphics just fine.
Just draw it in PS about 5 times larger than the patch and you'll have no issues. You won't see any loss in anything you'll ever do with it, and you won't have to deal with the hassle of vector.
If a vendor says they can't use your art, find a different one.
Hey Ace, the image for the new MS Wing patch on your web site isn't loading...
Quote from: Eclipse on November 19, 2009, 04:25:17 AM
Quote from: BuckeyeDEJ on November 19, 2009, 04:10:36 AM
— Photoshop? Really? Big no-no. If you want to design an emblem that is crisp at any imaginable size, you need to bust out Illustrator and do it right.
CAP doesn't need them at "any imaginable size". We're not wrapping busses or billboards.
Squadron and group emblems are sometimes used on large banners and displays. Raster images can be lossy, as well as a real pain to edit, even in layers. Photoshop for graphic design is like using an adjustable wrench to drive screws. If you're doing a photo illustration, that's one thing. But when you're dealing with what's essentially line art, Photoshop isn't adequate — never was, never has been, never will be.
To put my money where my mouth is, I offer my services to the Kansas cadets.
NOTE: Buses are motor vehicles. Busses are probably verboten under CPPT. ;D
I've made our company logo in PS, and it's mostly used on 5x8 cards and 3x5 business cards.
Then again, the original image made in PS is also 2ft by 3ft. :)
Quote from: BuckeyeDEJ on November 19, 2009, 05:27:21 AMTo put my money where my mouth is, I offer my services to the Kansas cadets.
Well, if you'd really like to, I can give you an email address that you may contact. The CAC Chair would love to hear that he has an expert on board for the proposal ;D
Expert... LOL... I've mouse-jockeyed Illustrator, FreeHand and Photoshop since Christ was a corporal. Somehow I always kept a job ;D
Let me know what you need. PM me for more info.