In CAPR 35-6, reference the award of the Basic GT Badge. It states the
completion of the National Ground Search And Rescue School. Is the National School NESA or something different?
Quote from: Senior on March 06, 2009, 04:26:38 PM
In CAPR 35-6, reference the award of the Basic GT Badge. It states the
completion of the National Ground Search And Rescue School. Is the National School NESA or something different?
Its NESA.
NESA completion allows for wear of the badge regardless of whether you are actually qualified as a GT in your home state (i.e. because of First Aid, radio card, etc.).
Also note...those who go to the NESA advanced course get the senior GT badge even if they are not GTL qualified.
Quote from: Senior on March 06, 2009, 04:26:38 PM
In CAPR 35-6, reference the award of the Basic GT Badge. It states the
completion of the National Ground Search And Rescue School. Is the National School NESA or something different?
Yes, National GSAR School was expanded to become what is currently the NESA as it now has Ground Team, Mission Base, and Aircrew training. Regarding the regulations you cited, the NESA's Basic GSAR course is what would fulfill that requirement. Keep in mind that Wing/Region GSAR schools
could also fulfill the requirement if they are deemed as an equivalent.
4. Requirements for Award of the Ground Team Badges: a. Basic Ground Team Badge: 1) Be qualified as a CAP ground team member in accordance with the CAP 60-series regulations or
2) Graduate from the CAP National Ground Search and Rescue School Basic Course or equivalent program as determined by NHQ CAP/DO and certified by the school/activity director. Each wing and region is encouraged to host ground team schools with the intent of certifying their members. All schools must ensure trainees meet the current regulatory requirements for qualification in the specialty before the rating is awarded.
b. Senior Ground Team Badge: 1) Be qualified as a CAP ground team leader in accordance with the CAP 60-series regulations or
2) Graduate from the CAP National Ground Search And Rescue School Advanced Course or equivalent program as determined by NHQ CAP/DO and certified by the school/activity director. Each wing and region is encouraged to host ground team schools with the intent of certifying their members. All schools must ensure trainees meet the current regulatory requirements for qualification in the specialty before the rating is awarded.
c. Master Ground Team Badge. Be qualified as a CAP ground branch director in accordance with the CAP 60-series regulations.
Hope this helps. Let me know if you have any other questions.
(NGSAR, Former Deputy Commander)
Is there a course at NESA that qualifies you for the Master GTM Badge?
Former Commandant, Advanced NGSAR
1999
Quote from: Stonewall on March 12, 2009, 12:11:04 AM
Is there a course at NESA that qualifies you for the Master GTM Badge?
Former Commandant, Advanced NGSAR
1999
That is a good question, Sir. I remember hearing somewhere that the course offerings are being expanded with the goal being instruction for every ES qualification up through IC, but I'm not sure if this has been developed yet as I don't see a GBD course.
The basic ICSS school http://nesa.cap.gov/bicss.htm. would seem to cover the GBD training as the advanced course lists goals of Section Chief, IC Staff and IC
Quote from: phirons on March 12, 2009, 02:34:06 AM
The basic ICSS school http://nesa.cap.gov/bicss.htm. would seem to cover the GBD training as the advanced course lists goals of Section Chief, IC Staff and IC
It might move things along for you or even help get you qualified, but it doesn't currently award a badge for completion as the other two NESA school do.
^ ?? NESA can qualify you as a GBD. That meets the requirements of 60-3 so you qualify for the Master GT Badge as well.
Quote4. Requirements for Award of the Ground Team Badges:
a. Basic Ground Team Badge:
1) Be qualified as a CAP ground team member in accordance with the CAP 60-series regulations or
2) Graduate from the CAP National Ground Search and Rescue School Basic Course or equivalent program as determined by NHQ CAP/DO and certified by the school/activity director. Each wing and region is encouraged to host ground team schools with the intent of certifying their members. All schools must ensure trainees meet the current regulatory requirements for qualification in the specialty before the rating is awarded.
I know only a few folks that have been to the National School. Most I know, my self included, wear it based on having the qual as stated above from field training or SARex.
Quote from: Short Field on March 12, 2009, 04:09:33 AM
^ ?? NESA can qualify you as a GBD. That meets the requirements of 60-3 so you qualify for the Master GT Badge as well.
Not quite the same thing, grasshopper..
Quote from: CAPR 35-6
4. Requirements for Award of the Ground Team Badges:
a. Basic Ground Team Badge:
1) Be qualified as a CAP ground team member in accordance with the CAP 60-series regulations or
2) Graduate from the CAP National Ground Search and Rescue School Basic Course or equivalent program as determined by NHQ CAP/DO and certified by the school/activity director. Each wing and region is encouraged to host ground team schools with the intent of certifying their members. All schools must ensure trainees meet the current regulatory requirements for qualification in the specialty before the rating is awarded.
b. Senior Ground Team Badge:
1) Be qualified as a CAP ground team leader in accordance with the CAP 60-series regulations or
2) Graduate from the CAP National Ground Search And Rescue School Advanced Course or equivalent program as determined by NHQ CAP/DO and certified by the school/activity director. Each wing and region is encouraged to host ground team schools with the intent of certifying their members. All schools must ensure trainees meet the current regulatory requirements for qualification in the specialty before the rating is awarded.
c. Master Ground Team Badge. Be qualified as a CAP ground branch director in accordance with the CAP 60-series regulations.
Note for the basic and senior badges, graduation from the NESA school is enough to qualify. You don't actually have to be qualified locally (i.e. with a complete SQTR) to wear it. There have been plenty of NESA grads who never get a first aid card, radio card, etc., and never actually get fully qualified, yet can wear the badge because of graduating the school.
There is no such allowance for Ground Team Master (GBD) - you're either fully qualified, or you're not, but there is no allowance in the reg that allows you to graduate a school for the badge.
Quote from: Major Carrales on March 12, 2009, 04:18:01 AM
Quote4. Requirements for Award of the Ground Team Badges:
a. Basic Ground Team Badge:
1) Be qualified as a CAP ground team member in accordance with the CAP 60-series regulations or
2) Graduate from the CAP National Ground Search and Rescue School Basic Course or equivalent program as determined by NHQ CAP/DO and certified by the school/activity director. Each wing and region is encouraged to host ground team schools with the intent of certifying their members. All schools must ensure trainees meet the current regulatory requirements for qualification in the specialty before the rating is awarded.
I know only a few folks that have been to the National School. Most I know, my self included, wear it based on having the qual as stated above from field training or SARex.
This is a good point. I too earned mine as a result of being a GTM (back in the '90s). I think too many people forget the "or" at the end of the line and feel they need to go to NESA/NGSAR
and be qualified. While NESA is a great program, if someone just wants to earn the badge, then they could probably accomplish the required GTM training in their Squadron or Group.
Quote from: DBlair on March 12, 2009, 04:36:12 AM
This is a good point. I too earned mine as a result of being a GTM (back in the '90s). I think too many people forget the "or" at the end of the line and feel they need to go to NESA/NGSAR and be qualified. While NESA is a great program, if someone just wants to earn the badge, then they could probably accomplish the required GTM training in their Squadron or Group.
Probably?
The vast majority of GTM's earn their badge locally. Very few members go to NESA.
Quote from: Eclipse on March 12, 2009, 05:00:21 AM
Quote from: DBlair on March 12, 2009, 04:36:12 AM
This is a good point. I too earned mine as a result of being a GTM (back in the '90s). I think too many people forget the "or" at the end of the line and feel they need to go to NESA/NGSAR and be qualified. While NESA is a great program, if someone just wants to earn the badge, then they could probably accomplish the required GTM training in their Squadron or Group.
Probably?
The vast majority of GTM's earn their badge locally. Very few members go to NESA.
Agreed. Forgive my word choice. I used 'probably' only out of consideration *if* their Squadron or Group did not regularly hold such training. I agree that local GTM training is the easiest way to earn the GT Badge. I myself had GTM (NJGSAR/NJAGSAR Schools) quite a while before NGSAR existed and while it has been less than a year since I re-joined CAP (as a Senior), my current Group seems to have held ES/GT training quite regularly, but I wasn't sure if other Wings did likewise.
Quote from: Eclipse on March 12, 2009, 04:30:34 AM
Note for the basic and senior badges, graduation from the NESA school is enough to qualify. You don't actually have to be qualified locally (i.e. with a complete SQTR) to wear it. There have been plenty of NESA grads who never get a first aid card, radio card, etc., and never actually get fully qualified, yet can wear the badge because of graduating the school.
There is no such allowance for Ground Team Master (GBD) - you're either fully qualified, or you're not, but there is no allowance in the reg that allows you to graduate a school for the badge.
I think I can perhaps clear up some of the confusion. NESA NGSAR does qualify three specialties: GTM3 (Basic School), GTM2/1/UDF (Advanced School) and GTL (Team Leader school). All three schools accomplish exactly what the 60-3/task guide/SQTR require - all tasks, BCUT training (where applicable), First Aid (where applicable), two missions, and whatever 170 is required. The only thing not covered during the week is the ICS 100/200/700/800 and GES. Those are are listed as prerequisites. Its a busy week for all three schools.
Anyone that graduates from one of the schools automatically has all the tasks and qualifications input into OpsQuals at both the task and achievement levels. There are students each year in all three schools who do not pass, and thus do not qualify or get the badge. In addition, we always have a handful of students who pass all the tasks, but yet we do not believe are quite ready for the qualification. In such cases, all their tasks are input, we just withhold the mission credit. That way, their "home" wing can work with them on FTXs, SAREXs, etc. to give them additional experience.
GBD might be possible to obtain through the ICSS school - however, the goal of that school is to accomplish ICS training, NOT to obtain ratings. The ICS Commandant will work with students to help them get through some tasks, but it is not the primary goal of that school.
It is true that CAPR 35-6 allows the senior ground team badge to be worn by AGSAR graduates. This is a holdover from the days where AGSAR was the Team Leader school. When they May 2004 task guide was published, we created a special Team Leader school, and Advanced became the school to obtain the GTM2/1/UDF ratings. The 35-6 was never updated to reflect that. That is why you have a few under 18 cadets floating around wearing the star.
Quote from: husker on March 12, 2009, 01:39:22 PM
GBD might be possible to obtain through the ICSS school - however, the goal of that school is to accomplish ICS training, NOT to obtain ratings. The ICS Commandant will work with students to help them get through some tasks, but it is not the primary goal of that school.
I guess I don't understand what consitutes ICS training. Each ICSS class (Basic and Advance) is a week long. Last summer, ICSS Basic included ICS 300 and ICSS Advance included ICS 400. The course materal was presented in the normal 2-3 days for each course, but included many hours of CAP specific training on those days as well - 12 hour days helped.
I can only speak for the Advanced course, but after the first two days when ICS 400 was completed, the rest of the class was devoted to CAP specific training and exercises. The exercises allowed you to earn additional Mission Base qualifications. They can sign off all qualifcations except for ICs. Most of the class had very specific Ops Achievements they wanted to qualify in before going home.