So I have noticed that there seems to be a drift between the old and the young in CAP. I am not talking about the cadets and for this discussion it is not what would like to hear back on that discussion has had its place a few times here. What I am interested in knowing is why the segregation of its SM. At my squadron it isnt a huge deal being that we meet with one another and know one another. How ever I was at an event with one of the older SM in the group, 42 and I am 25, and other people were more apt to come up and talk to him and introduce them self to him rather than me. Now I am not scary or come across wrong towards people, at least I dont think I do. The people I noticed talking to me were prior military and my army wings stick out in a group like that. I would introduce myself to others and would go through the pleasantries but then that was it. So my question I am putting up for discussion is why is it that us as SM have this segregation? Is it lack of things in common? Some resentment because I have all my hair? What is it? This is by no means a grip I am just wondering
I feel the same way. I'm 19. *I promise I won't complain about the Flight Officer system* At my squadron, the age range, besides myself and two others my age that occasionally show up, is mid-30s to early 80s...no joke. To make things worse, I am one of a few non-pilot SMs. So when the Senior Members do meet, we (meaning they) talk about the plane and pilot stuff. Don't get me wrong I love CAP and I love being a SM more than being a Cadet, but the hole age thing gets old quick. Just my 2 cents
I think this thread will be a very interesting read :)
Bill: I don't think that there is any particular move on the part of either the young or the older to be segregationist. It is perfectly natural to tend to drift toward someone your own age or at least nearly in your age group. I get tickled at your comment that your SM of 42 is an older guy, but I guess that when you are 25, that is OLDER. Think about meeting me: I am 72 and am a vet of Viet Nam. I also served in Korea and Germany during the Cold War(in fact, got shot at in Korea). You and I have different experiences in life and it is sometimes hard to relate to folks who don't have similar life experiences.
You and I would have similar interests in CAP and the Army, but a lot of folks in CAP have never served in the RM nor in the Middle East, so they can't imagine what you have been through. That is even more relevant with folks who have no military or aviation background. I have been flying for almost 50 years and very few of my friends have any concept of what it is like to fly. That brings a lot of conversations to a quick halt.
Don't spend too much time worrying about what you encountered. Make the most of what other folks have to say and try to have them understand what you are all about.
Hooah.
I see your point and was not meaning to cause offense. But there is a generational gap between him and I and we get along fine. While he is a pilot and I am maintainer and we have CAP and a few other things in common. While the job was completed fine and there were no issues, I still wonder what can be done to bridge that gap. I am sure there is valuable information that I can learn from the SM not in my generation group and would be great to know. It took one conversation with a Nam era Huey Pilot to understand the weapons systems thought processes with the Apache. We talk about mentoring the Cadets and working with them and while I have 10 years on them we are still in the same generational group per say but why is this idea not given to the younger SM? So a non military young SM is a little heavy and lacks some leadership skills why dont one of the older aged more experienced SM teach him something, especially if he is prior military and has this knowledge. While I am not expecting this more season SM to go out the the club and shake his butt with the younger on the weekends or go and have coffee once a week but for us to function better as a group. When we have Group functions I can count on an older Vet to come talk to me because he knows I am Army and he a retired Infantry NCO, we click while we only see one another once every 5 or so months. The people I see monthly or more so, who I have done training with have nothing to say?
Am I just expecting to much and that our age difference is stronger than our things we have in common being CAP? If I had no clue on AE stuff and needed help mentoring a Cadet wouldn't it be better for me to have the contacts with some of the Pilots not in my generational group?
Could it just be they were talking to the older SM, because they knew him??
When I came back into CAP I was 27 or 28 and I never really felt any real generational bias. I think that for some new young senior members they are experiencing the same thing that a new member that was 65 would have to face - that of proving yourself to other CAP members. That can sometimes take a while. The other thing that can cause some issues is that younger members are often anxious to see things change which can cause consternation among the older members.
I was always accepted pretty easy and when I was squadron commander I don't think there were but 2-3 seniors younger than me (they were all fairly recent cadet to senior changes) and never had any problems that I thought were age related.
I never really felt the age gap between SM's when I was in the "FO" grades. I do think that it is very similar to what happens in social groups anywhere else. What I have noticed is the pilots and non pilots will group together in separate groups.
I know someone who doesn't feel he fits in in CAP because he is neither a former cadet or former military, even though he's an "old dude" and a pilot. There probably is a tendency to gravitate toward people who are "like you".
Hopefully the new Organizational Excellence Mentoring will help with some of this. You have a good point; I learned a lot listening to more experienced folks when I was a young crewdog sitting alert. Those opportunities are valuable.
For every 10 of my CAP elders that didn't seem to like a young former cadet showing up wanting to play with the big boys, there was one senior member who helped push me along. Like hatentx, it took a couple years to really be accepted as a senior member rather than a young dude trying to show off to cadets. Unfortunately, there are quite a few of this type of new/young seniors, especially junior enlisted guys.
I'm not knocking you, I was one too. I was an E-3 and 20 when I convererted over to the senior member side, and I'm fairly certain that people didn't think I would last and that I was simply there to show off to cadets who were a year or two younger than me. I'm sure a part of me did, but at the end of the day, I really just wanted to be in CAP. Things will change as time passes and people get to know you. Trust me.
I've never had an issue with an age related type of bias in CAP. I tend to talk to the non-pilots and prior military members more, but there are some non-prior service members that are pretty squared away that I have an easy comraderie with. One member in my unit that I get along with best has never been military, but I thought he was by the way he wears a uniform and carries himself.
Pilots and aircrew tend to cluster, as do those that aren't. Even those who wear the more formal uniforms (blues, aviator) tend to associate with each other more than those in golf shirts. I think it's pretty much on the spot what someone said about people gravitating to those with similar experiences and preferences.
Really interesting to hear some more perspective on this topic thank you. While I can see the thought of the younger guys showing off is a valid argument and I can Imagine seeing that. I am sure I have done this as well while not being my intentions.
I understand the likeness and people trying to find people like them. That is how we all work. I know at 25 it is one of those ages where you are past all the drunk parties and chasing women but still young enough to not be dealing with everything aspect of adult hood as one would tend to do in their 30. You are not a kid but not an adult really. While I understand that I am still relatively unknown still being newish, and my Paid Vacation to the Middle East isn't going to help me being the new guy either, I would have to say that the mid 20s group really is a small number of us and are in the odd limbo stage.