CAP Talk

General Discussion => The Lobby => Topic started by: Pylon on December 29, 2008, 04:11:53 PM

Title: Vision 2009: What I hope CAP will accomplish
Post by: Pylon on December 29, 2008, 04:11:53 PM
In the spirit of the New Year's resolutions and building off my wish list from last year (http://captalk.net/index.php?topic=3948.0), here's a list of things I would love to see Civil Air Patrol as an organization accomplish in the coming year.  If we checked off these items by the end of 2009, I'd consider it a stellar year of advancement.  Some of these are still on the list from 2008, many have changed due to a shift in focus or priorities.   Please post your own hopes for 2009!

Public Affairs & Communications/Marketing

Information Technology

Recruiting/Retention

CAP Foundation/development/institutional advancement

Cadet Programs

Professional Development

Member Services

Operations

So I guess we'll see how 2009 goes.  Is this too ambitious?  Way off the mark?  What are your ideas?
Title: Re: Vision 2009: What I hope CAP will accomplish
Post by: arajca on December 29, 2008, 05:12:09 PM
Here are couple of simple items reference providing a consistant image:
1. Develop AND DISTRIBUTE a Word wizard/template to create a standard CAP business card. Make a version for Open Office. You know, fill in the blanks (name, unit, grade, address, etc), select the print material (# cards per page), and the program creates your cards.

2. Ditto for letterhead, except change member information to unit information.

3. Enter a national contract with Fedex/Kinko's or other major nation-wide copy shop to provide printing services for PD courses. The director sends in the form, designates the local shop, and national sends and pays for the print order. The director (or designee) picks up the materials a couple days before the class. Expand this to cover UCC and TLC in addition to SLS and CLC.

4. Get a CAP instructor course going!!! We need one, not just to check the box on the PDO Master rating, but we do not have many trained instructors. Most of our current trained instructors are getting on in years and will be leaving/slowing down within a few years. We need trained replacements.

I disagree with dropping the CAP emblem. It has significant historical value.
Title: Re: Vision 2009: What I hope CAP will accomplish
Post by: Pumbaa on December 29, 2008, 05:18:11 PM
I vote PYLON as our next commander!

HAIL PYLON!!!!
Title: Re: Vision 2009: What I hope CAP will accomplish
Post by: JAFO78 on December 29, 2008, 05:27:21 PM
 :o :o

::) ::)

>:D >:D
Title: Re: Vision 2009: What I hope CAP will accomplish
Post by: RiverAux on December 29, 2008, 11:09:44 PM
I didn't see anything major I would quibble about in Pylon's agenda.  It is a little focused on smaller details of running CAP rather than the "big picture", but those details often need attention and I don't think anything he suggested couldn't be done within this year. 

Title: Re: Vision 2009: What I hope CAP will accomplish
Post by: Eclipse on December 29, 2008, 11:45:51 PM
Quote from: arajca on December 29, 2008, 05:12:09 PM
Here are couple of simple items reference providing a consistent image:
1. Develop AND DISTRIBUTE a Word wizard/template to create a standard CAP business card. Make a version for Open Office. You know, fill in the blanks (name, unit, grade, address, etc), select the print material (# cards per page), and the program creates your cards.

No thank you, we're fine with what we (don't) have - as a matter of fact, there is little consistency in the military for business cards, either.

Quote from: arajca on December 29, 2008, 05:12:09 PM
2. Ditto for letterhead, except change member information to unit information.

Ditto for this - the Tongue and quill gives us all we need to know, and both the above would be another unfunded, unenforcible mandates.

Quote from: arajca on December 29, 2008, 05:12:09 PM
3. Enter a national contract with Fedex/Kinko's or other major nation-wide copy shop to provide printing services for PD courses. The director sends in the form, designates the local shop, and national sends and pays for the print order. The director (or designee) picks up the materials a couple days before the class. Expand this to cover UCC and TLC in addition to SLS and CLC.

No thank you.  In this day and age, why anyone would be spending the exorbitant amounts these places charge for printing is beyond me.  I could literally buy a new printer and a ream of paper, and dispose of it afterward for less than they would charge. 

First, the materials aren't really needed for the classes anyway, second, they are all available online.  Send participants the links, and print one or two to have on hand.  If they want them, they can print them, or bring them on their notebooks, PDA, or Kindle.

As of this minute, besides donuts or lunch, SLS/CLC/TLC, etc., should be held at ZERO MEMBER COST. 
Title: Re: Vision 2009: What I hope CAP will accomplish
Post by: Eclipse on December 29, 2008, 11:48:51 PM
My wish list would be for them to troll this board and CS, find every "nails on the chalkboard", "rubs you the wrong way", minutia complaint, and solidify the regulatory verbiage so that we can all stop arguing about it and move on to other nags and complaints.
Title: Re: Vision 2009: What I hope CAP will accomplish
Post by: PhoenixRisen on December 30, 2008, 01:14:12 AM
Question:  Is anyone doing anything about these (i.e. pitching them to the appropriate people), or is this purely for discussion?

This question brings me up to something I'd like to see (in regards to suggestions).  To my knowledge, CAP doesn't have anything like this at the moment, but correct me if we do.  I'd like to see a way in which John Doe CAP member (Cadets and seniors alike) can submit suggestions and ideas themselves .  Maybe in the form of an eServices module of some sort, where you select the appropriately involved area of CAP (i.e. CP, ES, AE, IT, PD, etc.) and your comments / ideas are forwarded directly to someone within that area at NHQ.  I'll bet some of the best ideas lie within the general membership - but there's no organized way to get suggestions to the right people.

YMMV.
Title: Re: Vision 2009: What I hope CAP will accomplish
Post by: Timbo on December 30, 2008, 01:31:44 AM
Quote from: PhoenixCadet on December 30, 2008, 01:14:12 AM
.......I'd like to see a way in which John Doe CAP member (Cadets and seniors alike) can submit suggestions and ideas themselves .  Maybe in the form of an eServices module of some sort, where you select the appropriately involved area of CAP (i.e. CP, ES, AE, IT, PD, etc.) and your comments / ideas are forwarded directly to someone within that area at NHQ. 

At an employer many years ago, we had a suggestion box.  All that ever went inside were half eaten ham sandwiches and cigarette butts.  I would argue that Cap's suggestion "box" would be the same. 

We are supposed to propose our suggestions through the Chain of Command, now if your Commanders at various levels do anything with them that is a totally different matter.   
Title: Re: Vision 2009: What I hope CAP will accomplish
Post by: Pylon on December 30, 2008, 01:37:40 AM
Quote from: PhoenixCadet on December 30, 2008, 01:14:12 AM
....but there's no organized way to get suggestions to the right people.

A memorandum addressed to the appropriate NHQ component submitted through your chain of command would be the established, organized way to theoretically get suggestions to the right people.

Quote from: Eclipse on December 29, 2008, 11:45:51 PM
No thank you, we're fine with what we (don't) have - as a matter of fact, there is little consistency in the military for business cards, either.

Yep and it slowly degrades their branding, too.  Doesn't make it right.  The Air Force ran into the same "leave-me-to-my-own-devices"-itis when they rolled out the Air Force Public Web project.  Lots of units thought they had better websites.  Many probably did.  The Air Force template is nice, but certainly not the best website ever.  But mandating it for everyone brings every AF unit website to a very good middle-ground and builds a consistent message and identity; they're not 1,000 independently-acting units and bases, they're one Air Force.  Many units had to give up a little bit of their local pride and stubbornness to achieve this important goal.  But now when you see an AF website, you know you're on an Air Force website.   The same should ring true of our websites, business cards, fliers and letterhead.  Otherwise, you're not building brand equity with your existing efforts.  This would be covered on day 1 in any communications management graduate course.

Quote from: Eclipse on December 29, 2008, 11:45:51 PM
Quote from: arajca on December 29, 2008, 05:12:09 PM
2. Ditto for letterhead, except change member information to unit information.

Ditto for this - the Tongue and quill gives us all we need to know, and both the above would be another unfunded, unenforcible mandates.

Unfunded, unenforcible?  What are you talking about?

You simply make a word template that reflects the format set by CAPR 10-1.  In other words, it's a template that says "This is exactly how your letterhead should be set-up.  You can't screw it up, the seal won't be in the wrong place, you won't be using the wrong logo graphic or the wrong header wording.  Just type in the unit name where it says <<UNIT NAME>> and address where it says <<ADDRESS>>, etc."

Too many units insert incorrect logos, make up wording that is inconsistent with CAPR 10-1, or just plain invent their own letterhead.  Making an electronic word template, distributing it to all echelons by email with an ICL saying "Use this for all official correspondence from here forward." doesn't sound like it needs to be funded too much, nor does it sound impossible to mandate.  Again, "leave-me-to-my-own-devices!"-itis doesn't get the overall whole organization very far.

Quote from: RiverAux on December 29, 2008, 11:09:44 PM
I didn't see anything major I would quibble about in Pylon's agenda.  It is a little focused on smaller details of running CAP rather than the "big picture", but those details often need attention and I don't think anything he suggested couldn't be done within this year. 

Yep.  I'm not sure where organizationally we can best head to keep ourselves relavent, effective and useful.   I think we can have dozens of those discussions (and I think we have had many of them here) and never come to a consensus. I'm also not privy to the talk that goes on at the highest levels.  This post is more like a low-level member's wish list of tweaks that would make life easier and better for the general membership and the organization at those lower-levels, in my opinion.   But please, feel free to add your wish list and thoughts!  :)

Quote from: arajca on December 29, 2008, 05:12:09 PM
I disagree with dropping the CAP emblem. It has significant historical value.

Red epaulet straps and khakis have significant historical value, yellow plane paint jobs have significant historical value, and we can appreciate all of our historically significant past without still having to actively use it.  But we could use the round logo for our external logo, then, and do away with the command shield for everything but the flight suit patch.  That works, too.  The point is that we get what the Air Force and other services have:  an official seal for internal use, and an external/general-use logo for the public affairs and recruiting efforts.  Not 7 different seals/logos/shields/roundels that we use at random, at will and without rhyme or reason.
Title: Re: Vision 2009: What I hope CAP will accomplish
Post by: Pumbaa on December 30, 2008, 02:14:23 AM
QuoteIt is a little focused on smaller details of running CAP rather than the "big picture",

I will ask this question.. How do you eat an elephant?  One bite at a time....

There is so much wrong with CAP today... So many BIG elephants so to speak.  If we start with small bites and keep on eating away I think this organization can be turned back into what it was intended to be.

Here's an additional question.  Why can't those who are like minded institute some of these ideas?  For example, have the WORD/ OPEN OFFICE template for BC's and LH.  Distribute them around with a letter of explanation.  Perhaps as Martin Luther was able to ignite the reformation, squadrons can do the same thing?

Title: Re: Vision 2009: What I hope CAP will accomplish
Post by: Eeyore on December 30, 2008, 02:19:44 AM
^ Eventually someone will carry the grassroots idea on up to NHQ as they move their way up and mandate it because it is what they have been using for years. Sounds like a good plan.
Title: Re: Vision 2009: What I hope CAP will accomplish
Post by: RiverAux on December 30, 2008, 03:10:31 AM
Quote from: Pumbaa on December 30, 2008, 02:14:23 AM
QuoteIt is a little focused on smaller details of running CAP rather than the "big picture",

I will ask this question.. How do you eat an elephant?  One bite at a time....

There is so much wrong with CAP today... So many BIG elephants so to speak.  If we start with small bites and keep on eating away I think this organization can be turned back into what it was intended to be.
I wasn't complaining.....we've got plenty of pie-in-the-sky wishlist threads on CAPTalk, many of which we come nowhere near consensus on.  The items he mentioned wouldn't revolutionize CAP, but would nibble around the edges at some minor issues.  Nothing wrong with that at all. 
Title: Re: Vision 2009: What I hope CAP will accomplish
Post by: Eclipse on December 30, 2008, 03:48:16 AM
Quote from: Pylon on December 30, 2008, 01:37:40 AM
Quote from: arajca on December 29, 2008, 05:12:09 PM
2. Ditto for letterhead, except change member information to unit information.

Ditto for this - the Tongue and quill gives us all we need to know, and both the above would be another unfunded, unenforcible mandates.

Unfunded, unenforcible?  What are you talking about?

A "new" standard where one didn't exist will require anyone who has already paid for business cards, etc., to have to buy new ones - on the member's dime, and invariably those units that have spent time on trying to look professional will suffer because they will have to conform to an LCD identity.

Its unenforcible, because all this stuff is, especially when technology and ability allow for members to do whatever they want, regardless.  We live in a world today where actual meaningful regulations are ignored to no effect, do you think forcing a business card template and letterhead, where general guidelines already exist is going to make a bit of difference?

Units like mine will adhere, regardless, because those are the rules, and then we'll have to sit and watch as all those with no taste for the rules do their own thing, perhaps in a way which is more appropriate anyway.

Unless you're talking about a full-on, hammer-down enforcement of a brand-identity, with painful ramifications, don't add lip-service where its not needed.
Title: Re: Vision 2009: What I hope CAP will accomplish
Post by: RiverAux on December 30, 2008, 03:51:17 AM
You're missing the point that everything has gone in so many different directions because of a lack of specific guidance rather than people violating the generic recommendations we have now. 
Title: Re: Vision 2009: What I hope CAP will accomplish
Post by: Pylon on December 30, 2008, 03:56:25 AM
Quote from: Eclipse on December 30, 2008, 03:48:16 AM
A "new" standard where one didn't exist will require anyone who has already paid for business cards, etc., to have to buy new ones - on the member's dime, and invariably those units that have spent time on trying to look professional will suffer because they will have to conform to an LCD identity.

Its unenforcible, because all this stuff is, especially when technology and ability allow for members to do whatever they want, regardless.  We live in a world today where actual meaningful regulations are ignored to no effect, do you think forcing a business card template and letterhead, where general guidelines already exist is going to make a bit of difference?

Units like mine will adhere, regardless, because those are the rules, and then we'll have to sit and watch as all those with no taste for the rules do their own thing, perhaps in a way which is more appropriate anyway.

Unless you're talking about a full-on, hammer-down enforcement of a brand-identity, with painful ramifications, don't add lip-service where its not needed.

The exact same could be said about all of our uniform regulations.  

Just like uniforms, new requirements to move our professional image forward sometimes comes at a cost to the member - usually our most active members.  CAP is usually very generous in allowing long phase-out periods for members to get the most out of existing materials, but the organization can't be expected to never make progress if it means creating small incidental costs along the way.

And the same with uniforms, yes -- it is sometimes a pain to be the ones complying with the sometimes frustrating new regulations buy buying that new command patch or ensuring you add a "U.S. Civil Air Patrol" tape to your next uniform only to take it off again.  And also with uniforms, it's frustrating to see those who flaunt the regs or totally pretend they don't exist.   Members who ignore the rules will always happen, whether we're talking about uniforms, or correspondence formats, or pencil-whipped SQTRs and Specialty Ratings, or a communications style guide.  That doesn't mean we don't stop doing our best to improve our uniforms, or specialty track requirements or external communications.

We still try our best, though. Even with 75% of the members in compliance with one standard, we're already better off than having 1,000 different standards and levels of quality.
Title: Re: Vision 2009: What I hope CAP will accomplish
Post by: Eclipse on December 30, 2008, 04:21:00 AM
Quote from: Pylon on December 30, 2008, 03:56:25 AM
We still try our best, though. Even with 75% of the members in compliance with one standard, we're already better off than having 1,000 different standards and levels of quality.

!@#$%... I wish I could argue with that...  :'(
Title: Re: Vision 2009: What I hope CAP will accomplish
Post by: Duke Dillio on December 30, 2008, 05:36:21 AM
I vote that UK gets some new pictures and becomes the poster child for the new "CAP Values" lines of posters.  Each poster kit should come with a new UK action figure complete with every uniform combination in 39-1.  That should increase our recruiting and retention.   :angel:

I like all of Pylon's ideas.  I'd like to see some changes in ES specifically targeted in the ground teams but that would probably end up with a hijacking and a different thread.  I really like the idea of PD SQTR's but I think that they need to go through and upgrade quite a few of the specialty tracks.  I've never understood why we need an admin officer and a personnel officer.  I think that one person could probably handle both of those jobs.  JMHO.

In speaking of the Open Office stuff, why can't CAP do what my college did.  The school worked out some deal with MS to provide free software to each student.  If you quit the school, you have to delete the software.  If you graduate, you get to keep it all.  It just seems like that would make more sense.  Isn't there some sort of "organizational license" available for MS Office?  I'm just wondering...
Title: Re: Vision 2009: What I hope CAP will accomplish
Post by: Eclipse on December 30, 2008, 06:12:43 AM
Quote from: Sqn72DO on December 30, 2008, 05:36:21 AMI've never understood why we need an admin officer and a personnel officer.  I think that one person could probably handle both of those jobs.  JMHO.

In most units they are the same person, but in a large, fully-operational squadron, they are two important, seperate jobs.

Quote from: Sqn72DO on December 30, 2008, 05:36:21 AM
In speaking of the Open Office stuff, why can't CAP do what my college did.  The school worked out some deal with MS to provide free software to each student.  If you quit the school, you have to delete the software.  If you graduate, you get to keep it all.  It just seems like that would make more sense.  Isn't there some sort of "organizational license" available for MS Office?  I'm just wondering...

Those licenses are still HHUUGGEEE BUCKOs, and NHQ is already providing a notebook with MS Office to every unit. Even if you assume only 1/2 the members would tick a license, thats still ~25k, more than most schools and even a lot of companies ever look at.  Just not economically feasible, not to mention the management of the licenses, etc., which would be a full-time job for several people.


In addition to Open Office, which is the answer for everything but SIMs, there are freeware viewers, etc., for everything, so its really a non-issue.
Title: Re: Vision 2009: What I hope CAP will accomplish
Post by: FlexCoder on December 30, 2008, 09:04:55 AM
Quote from: Sqn72DO on December 30, 2008, 05:36:21 AM
I vote that UK gets some new pictures and becomes the poster child for the new "CAP Values" lines of posters.  Each poster kit should come with a new UK action figure complete with every uniform combination in 39-1.  That should increase our recruiting and retention.   :angel:

I vote that UK gets a new comrade, UB (Ultimate Barbie) with optional UT (Ultimate Toddler) or UP (Ultimate Pet) and becomes the poster couple for CAP Family Values......
Title: Re: Vision 2009: What I hope CAP will accomplish
Post by: arajca on December 30, 2008, 02:56:41 PM
Quote from: Eclipse on December 29, 2008, 11:45:51 PM
Quote from: arajca on December 29, 2008, 05:12:09 PM
3. Enter a national contract with Fedex/Kinko's or other major nation-wide copy shop to provide printing services for PD courses. The director sends in the form, designates the local shop, and national sends and pays for the print order. The director (or designee) picks up the materials a couple days before the class. Expand this to cover UCC and TLC in addition to SLS and CLC.

No thank you.  In this day and age, why anyone would be spending the exorbitant amounts these places charge for printing is beyond me.  I could literally buy a new printer and a ream of paper, and dispose of it afterward for less than they would charge. 
Which is why National needs to set up a contract. Corporations do not pay standard pricing.

QuoteFirst, the materials aren't really needed for the classes anyway, second, they are all available online.  Send participants the links, and print one or two to have on hand.  If they want them, they can print them, or bring them on their notebooks, PDA, or Kindle.

As of this minute, besides donuts or lunch, SLS/CLC/TLC, etc., should be held at ZERO MEMBER COST. 
Are you advocating the Check Box mentality toward PD courses? For a simple, 30 - 60 min class, you could probably get away without having student materials, as long as you do not expect them to actually learn anything. Your statement about not needing the materials shows the low regard you have for CAP training. When directed TLC, I did send the students the links to the materials. I still had about half who wanted a printed copy because they didn't have the time to spend printing averything out and babysitting their printers while doing so. Neither did I. I gave them the option and let them know what my providing the hardcopy materials would cost. Having students work on their notebooks during a class is very distracting to the instructor and other students. BTDT.

As for the zero member cost, that's why National pays for the printing, not the director or the member. See emphasized section.
Title: Re: Vision 2009: What I hope CAP will accomplish
Post by: Eclipse on December 30, 2008, 04:30:42 PM
Quote from: arajca on December 30, 2008, 02:56:41 PM
As of this minute, besides donuts or lunch, SLS/CLC/TLC, etc., should be held at ZERO MEMBER COST. 
Are you advocating the Check Box mentality toward PD courses? For a simple, 30 - 60 min class, you could probably get away without having student materials, as long as you do not expect them to actually learn anything. Your statement about not needing the materials shows the low regard you have for CAP training. When directed TLC, I did send the students the links to the materials. I still had about half who wanted a printed copy because they didn't have the time to spend printing averything out and babysitting their printers while doing so. Neither did I. I gave them the option and let them know what my providing the hardcopy materials would cost. Having students work on their notebooks during a class is very distracting to the instructor and other students. BTDT.[/quote]

No, it shows that I have a calendar, and my members have devices that allow them to view the materials without paper - last I checked this was 2008. 

Members who can't be bothered to "babysit a printer", especially when it saves them money?  You're reaching.

I stand by my statement that the materials are unnecessary for successful, rich sessions of the new SLS/CLC/TLC.   These are discussion based curriculum, not the old days of people standing in front of the room reading the slides they have never before seen in their lives until that moment.
Title: Re: Vision 2009: What I hope CAP will accomplish
Post by: Capt Rivera on January 02, 2009, 01:21:05 AM
I have to agree with Eclipse. All you need is a prepared instructor, & interested and active students. Those students should take the notes they need for future reference.

The materials I've received thus far at CAP courses only served as note paper and even then it was a waste. The notes I took could have easily fit on a few sheets of paper and I would reference them more. The courses where I received 50 pages and took a 1 or 2 line note here and there never get looked at. In fact they are on the list of things to go threw and recycle.

If materials are handed out they should be of specific need. Charts/graphs etc...  I don't need a print out of every slide or a fully expanded outline.
Title: Re: Vision 2009: What I hope CAP will accomplish
Post by: SarDragon on January 02, 2009, 03:29:08 AM
Not everybody is the same when it comes to retaining material. In many of the classes I've taught (primarily Level I, BCUT/ACUT/MRO, and SLS), the students have frequently thanked me for the printed materials. I've found it better to err on the side of providing more than less when it comes to providing printed matter. As as student, if you don't see a need to retain the stuff they give you, don't write in/on it, and return it to the instructor.