The article on cap.gov concerning the aircraft that NCWG just found has this at the bottom of it:
QuoteCivil Air Patrol, the official auxiliary of the U.S. Air Force and a division of the North Carolina Department of Crime Control and Pubic Safety
Either it is oddly worded or I am just not understanding what the relationship is here. Any insights?
Some wings are also considered part of state government or as a state agency.
Some wings I know of are: NCWG, AKWG, NHWG and, WVWG.
Wings like PAWG, are considered as a state agency during state emergencies. When "SARDA" plan is instituted PAWG/CC is deputy director of PA SARDA. The Lt. Gov. is the director.
This is one way wings get state funding.
Not a mystery at all.
CAP's Congressional charter establishes us as a dual-purpose agency. We are the Air Force Auxiliary, but we are also mandated to provide light aircraft and communications support to state and local governments. That is why we were re-organized as a corporation in 1948 versus remaining just a unit of the Air Force.
HOW that state and local support is provided is up to the individual states and the wings. NC apparently has established CAP under a state agency. Iowa, Colorado, and I think Kentucky place CAP at the disposal of the Adjutant General. A lot of other Wings establish MOU's with state Emergency Management Departments.
California, a state that never plays well with others, insists that CAP abandon the uniform of the United States and dress its members like the Scarlet Pimpernel in order to participate.
Such is the beauty of the corporate identity. It gives us flexibility in responding to different situations and conditions around the country. Its only when "Corporate" types take the corporation mentality too seriously that we get into trouble.
Missouri Wing is known as the Office of Air Search and Rescue within the state's Adjutant General's department when performing state-funded missions.
Dr. Dave
Quote from: JohnKachenmeister on May 14, 2008, 01:37:53 PM
California, a state that never plays well with others, insists that CAP abandon the uniform of the United States and dress its members like the Scarlet Pimpernel in order to participate.
I was a GTL in CAWG when we went to orange and blue, like the highway workers. It is/was more of a safety issue for team members, so that the "farmers" wouldn't think we were narcs (who wear/wore BDU's) and shoot at us!
Quote from: fireplug on May 14, 2008, 06:49:49 PM
Quote from: JohnKachenmeister on May 14, 2008, 01:37:53 PM
California, a state that never plays well with others, insists that CAP abandon the uniform of the United States and dress its members like the Scarlet Pimpernel in order to participate.
I was a GTL in CAWG when we went to orange and blue, like the highway workers. It is/was more of a safety issue for team members, so that the "farmers" wouldn't think we were narcs (who wear/wore BDU's) and shoot at us!
I still think that CAP ought to consider an orange shirt that could be worn with either BDU. Simply change your shirt to a bright orange, and leave the rest of the ensemble alone. Not many Narcs wear bright orange. It would be simple, practical and inexpensive.
It would also be inline with what a lot of SAR teams would be wearing. Pretty easy to identify the CAP folks with a search team when they're wearing something equally as bright as the other workers.
pretty sure this isn't a uniform thread... BDU/BBDU are for all around utility. In the field they're their to keep you from getting chopped up in the trees. That's the safety factor. The orange vest is for visibility, and is mandatory. Wgs do not have the authority to do their own thing. CAP should not be doing their own thing seperate from our parent service.
The way this usually seems to work is that the state has a CAP "department" that either consists of a state employee designated to work with CAP or has the Wing Commander appointed to that position as as staff position. In some states CAP members can get covered like they were state employees on state missions. The exact situation varies quite a bit.
But in no case does the state have any official command and control authority over that CAP wing so the phrasing in that press release is a little bit misleading.
Quote from: RiverAux on May 14, 2008, 07:07:15 PM
But in no case does the state have any official command and control authority over that CAP wing so the phrasing in that press release is a little bit misleading.
That was really my point, thanks for the wording. The way it is written it makes it sound as though CAP is a state entity. To me it sounds as though I could go down to the capital building and go to the North Carolina Department of Crime Control and Pubic Safety section and talk to the guy sitting at the CAP desk.
It just sounds weird to me.
Quote from: DNall on May 14, 2008, 06:59:21 PM
pretty sure this isn't a uniform thread... BDU/BBDU are for all around utility. In the field they're their to keep you from getting chopped up in the trees. That's the safety factor. The orange vest is for visibility, and is mandatory. Wgs do not have the authority to do their own thing. CAP should not be doing their own thing seperate from our parent service.
Agreed. But I don't think it's a bad idea to try to incorporate some of those other SAR team practices. I think we're doing the right thing by finally adopting NIMS, "talking the talk". We get the practice down, it's "walking the walk". The orange shirts would be "dressing the part".
Have I added enough cliches, or should I try some more? ;D
Various SaR teams around the country wear all kinds of stuff, usually not orange shirts.
What we're doing with NIMS now is equiv to GES. I'm glad we're doing it. It's a foundation for when they lay in finalized qual standards. That's going to rock CAP a bit, I think for the better.
Anyway, this whole "status" thing just got covered in another thread.
Quote from: DNall on May 14, 2008, 07:45:58 PM
Various SaR teams around the country wear all kinds of stuff, usually not orange shirts.
What we're doing with NIMS now is equiv to GES. I'm glad we're doing it. It's a foundation for when they lay in finalized qual standards. That's going to rock CAP a bit, I think for the better.
Anyway, this whole "status" thing just got covered in another thread.
What thread was that.
Quote from: jimmydeanno on May 14, 2008, 07:16:43 PM
Quote from: RiverAux on May 14, 2008, 07:07:15 PM
But in no case does the state have any official command and control authority over that CAP wing so the phrasing in that press release is a little bit misleading.
That was really my point, thanks for the wording. The way it is written it makes it sound as though CAP is a state entity. To me it sounds as though I could go down to the capital building and go to the North Carolina Department of Crime Control and Pubic Safety section and talk to the guy sitting at the CAP desk.
It just sounds weird to me.
I wrote the media advisory you are discussin with the mention of the NC Wing of CAP as an agency of NC Crime Control and Public Safety. We are indeed a constituent division of that agency and you really can talk to the CAP desk at NCCC&PS, but that state office is at NC Wing Headquarters. By NC General Statute, that agency defines our role with the State of North Carolina and its political subdivisions on state-approved, as opposed to AFAMs or corporate missions. We do not have an MOU with the State of NC because our relationship with the state is statutory. You are correct that the state has no command authority over CAP members and assets.
Awesome! Thanks for the reply - I appreciate it.