I have a bit of time to kill before the next meeting of the squadron that I am joining. So I have been reading basically everything I can get my hands on- both in the general sense and the specialties that interest me which are primarily safety and operations tracks. I have a feeling that I will get tagged as a health services officer at least initially because of my background as a respiratory therapist and EMS provider.
This independent study is both to avoid just mindlessly watching TV for hours on end late at night and to try to hit the ground running once I am a member. Most of what I have been reading is pretty straightforward so far as the concepts go. That brings me to a few questions that I have.
So far as the Level I training, how long does the orientation course and the CPPT take? Can it just be done really quickly if someone is a quick study or is there a fixed time frame?
I am also planning on taking the Yeager knowledge test as soon as possible since it makes sense to get that hoop out of the way before other things come up.
How much of the hands on training is normally done at the squadron level versus say sending a person to the academy down at Atterbury etc? I ask because I am curious how much down time I should suspect so far as this process that is beyond my control.
It was mentioned to me that getting the FEMA ICS certifications out of the way would be helpful which is already done since they are required for my primary job.
Is there anything else I can do to speed things up? Any other advice?
Quote from: KASSRCrashResearch on April 26, 2016, 12:17:42 AM
So far as the Level I training, how long does the orientation course and the CPPT take? Can it just be done really quickly if someone is a quick study or is there a fixed time frame?
It can go pretty fast. Run through all the online courses, then set up a time with the professional development officer to do the in person portions.
Quote
I am also planning on taking the Yeager knowledge test as soon as possible since it makes sense to get that hoop out of the way before other things come up.
That, and the officer basic course will keep you pretty busy.
Quote
How much of the hands on training is normally done at the squadron level versus say sending a person to the academy down at Atterbury etc? I ask because I am curious how much down time I should suspect so far as this process that is beyond my control.
This is squadron dependent and schedule dependent. Things to get out of the way pretty quick would be the ICUT training. Scan a copy of your first aid card to upload into eservices as well.
You can do some of the training at the squadron, but it will take longer than just going to an academy. It is definitely worth building up the basic skills before going to the academy though (and necessary in the case of some things like having your equipment/uniform ready.)
Quote
It was mentioned to me that getting the FEMA ICS certifications out of the way would be helpful which is already done since they are required for my primary job.
Depending on what you want to do, there are more fema courses than just the IS100,IS200,IS700, and IS800 series. ICS 300/400, there are position specific items like:
IS-00029
IS-00120.a
IS-00523
IS-42
IS-242
IS-702
G-290
G-291
E-388
IS-230
IS-235
IS-240
IS-241
IS-242
IS-244
IS-775
IS-703
IS-271
(Note, there might be 1 or 2 courses on this list that I added that were interesting. But the majority are referenced in various professional development pamphlets.)
Quote
Is there anything else I can do to speed things up? Any other advice?
Don't burn out.
Quote from: KASSRCrashResearch on April 26, 2016, 12:17:42 AMI have a feeling that I will get tagged as a health services officer at least initially because of my background as a respiratory therapist and EMS provider.
Possibly, however do not depend on this as your primary involvement in CAP. Medical professionals are usually pretty frustrated when they find that
their ability to use their education and skills are basically limited to the same level of first aid training and advice that anyone with general knowledge can provide.
Quote from: KASSRCrashResearch on April 26, 2016, 12:17:42 AM
So far as the Level I training, how long does the orientation course and the CPPT take? Can it just be done really quickly if someone is a quick study or is there a fixed time frame?
Probably - it's about an hour or two of online reading and familiarization, then there are conversations and questions with the CC and Personnel officer in person. The length
of time depends on your responses and questions you might have. Don't rush it or gloss it, this early information is important.
Quote from: KASSRCrashResearch on April 26, 2016, 12:17:42 AM
I am also planning on taking the Yeager knowledge test as soon as possible since it makes sense to get that hoop out of the way before other things come up.
Yeager is online and open-book. It is great general Aviation history and knowledge as a basline for a member, but it isn't actually required for anything other then progression
in professional development. It is strongly encouraged, and you should be able to knock it out in an hour or so once you have access to it.
Quote from: KASSRCrashResearch on April 26, 2016, 12:17:42 AM
How much of the hands on training is normally done at the squadron level versus say sending a person to the academy down at Atterbury etc?
All of it.
There is no "academy" at Camp Atterbury. What you are probably referring to is "NESA", which is the National Emergency Services Academy, but despite the name,
this is actually limited to a 2-week specific activity, requiring application and advanced approval. It is focused on Ground, Air Crew, and Base Staff training and proficiency,
however space is limited and if you aren't already a member, it's not likely you'd get in this year. Not unheard of, but not likely. You'd have to be "LSCODE A", Level 1'd, and have your
baseline ES stuff finished, which is aggressive for a July activity in which the person isn't even a member in April.
NESA is a great way to jump-start ES training, or grow your baseline skills to the national CAP standard, but it isn't required by any means, and the vast majority of members do not attend,
instead getting their training and qualifications at either the home unit or at related activities throughout their wing.
Quote from: KASSRCrashResearch on April 26, 2016, 12:17:42 AM
It was mentioned to me that getting the FEMA ICS certifications out of the way would be helpful which is already done since they are required for my primary job.
Knocking out ICS 100/200/700/800 online is a good idea as they will be required for aircrew and / or ground team qualification. ICS 300 & 400 are in-residence
classes sponsored by FEMA that usually take 1-3 days and generally are run during the week, with the occasional weekend classes depending on your location.
These are required for more advanced base staff jobs such as Directors and Section Chiefs. You would not be able to reach for those until you have done some time in the field, but if you have the opportunity to get to them, take it. CAP is part of the national framework, therefore you should not have to pay for them if you take them from a provider such as local LEA, FD, or EMA. If you already have them from your professional life, you can upload the certs once your eservices account is opened.
Es qualifications are not considered "primary jobs" in CAP, those would be staff positions within the squadron or higher HQ. Assuming you were appointed as an HSO, ICS certifications
are not required for these roles. See CAPR 160-1 for details:
http://members.gocivilairpatrol.com/media/cms/R160_001_AA05CF4BF3FC5.pdf (http://members.gocivilairpatrol.com/media/cms/R160_001_AA05CF4BF3FC5.pdf)
Ops and SE might, you can find those pamphlets online as well, however be advised (heh), that these roles are not generally assigned to brand new members unless you have direct outside experience,
or the unit very small and looking to check a box. Both require a fair amount of experience in CAP to be successful.
Quote from: KASSRCrashResearch on April 26, 2016, 12:17:42 AM
Is there anything else I can do to speed things up? Any other advice?
Go slow, take things a little at a time as you get the CAP cadence. It's not a race.
Quote
I am also planning on taking the Yeager knowledge test as soon as possible since it makes sense to get that hoop out of the way before other things come up.
QuoteDepending on what you want to do, there are more fema courses than just the IS100,IS200,IS700, and IS800 series. ICS 300/400, there are position specific items like:
IS-00029
IS-00120.a
IS-00523
IS-42
IS-242
IS-702
G-290
G-291
E-388
IS-230
IS-235
IS-240
IS-241
IS-242
IS-244
IS-775
IS-703
IS-271
(Note, there might be 1 or 2 courses on this list that I added that were interesting. But the majority are referenced in various professional development pamphlets.)
The IS stuff, I know I have most of those because of work or joining the volunteer fire department simply because you know...boxes to check off. I'll add the ones that I don't already have to my list. Fifteen minutes on a test to get it out of the way isn't a huge hurdle and there's nothing terribly complicated about FEMA courses.
QuoteDon't burn out.
LOL Not a concern. Scheduling it all is my only concern.
Quote from: EclipseWhat you are probably referring to is "NESA", which is the National Emergency Services Academy, but despite the name,
this is actually limited to a 2-week specific activity, requiring application and advanced approval. It is focused on Ground, Air Crew, and Base Staff training and proficiency,
however space is limited and if you aren't already a member, it's not likely you'd get in this year. Not unheard of, but not likely. You'd have to be "LSCODE A", Level 1'd, and have your
baseline ES stuff finished, which is aggressive for a July activity in which the person isn't even a member in April.
Yeah, that's kind of what I meant. I don't want to sit around until next summer with my thumb up my rear waiting to get checked off on the basic stuff.
I just heard it mentioned by one of the officers I talked to as being a major thing here (which isn't surprising given that it's forty-five minutes or so down the road). It's a relief that the training is mostly local which should help to minimize the gaps in gaining qualifications.
QuotePossibly, however do not depend on this as your primary involvement in CAP. Medical professionals are usually pretty frustrated when they find that
their ability to use their education and skills are basically limited to the same level of first aid training and advice that anyone with general knowledge can provide.
I'm glad to know that I'm not the only one who goes "Why even have that as a position?" upon reading the restrictions. It's one of those "I'll do it if they ask me but there's no way I'm going to focus on it" (especially since there's no actual track for it).
QuoteOps and SE might, you can find those pamphlets online as well, however be advised (heh), that these roles are not generally assigned to brand new members unless you have direct outside experience,
or the unit very small and looking to check a box. Both require a fair amount of experience in CAP to be successful.
I do work in a weird corner where aviation safety and forensics meet. My focus is on crash survivability rather than prevention although I have the requisite knowledge of that side as well.
Plus I had ground SAR training years ago when people from several of the local VFDs back home tried to put together a quick response ground pounder unit because the only options available were a couple of teams based hours away or calling in CAP which, no offense of course, isn't a quick process either. Sadly, because of political squabbling, it never really went anything beyond maybe 20 or so of us taking the training. A few of us got tacked on to various search as adjunct members of this team or that for a search or two over the years but it really lay fallow since other than the occasional Alzheimer's case that wanders off ground SAR in most of Indiana isn't a common thing like it would be in an area with difficult terrain and lots of outdoor activities.
What are the normal "Here you go newbie" tracks? I would figure they would try to shoehorn people into things like admin, personnel, logistics, etc since those are jobs most people are not going to get excited about. I do or have done all of that stuff for work anyhow even if they aren't my favorite activities nor what I consider to be my main job. Wearing multiple hats is kind of a given. Ever tried setting up a nonprofit? It's a great example of that and if you haven't had the chance to do so, take my advice and don't if you can avoid it. It's right above "Let's go teabag a fire ant colony!" on the Fun-O-Meter. LOL
I can find something that I would enjoy other than ops or safety even though those would be my first two choices. I just know that there are a few that I could not do. Aerospace education comes to mind. Likewise for IT and commo, both of those would bore me to tears and cause me to probably seek either a different unit or leave CAP all together. More power to those who can do them and I mean no disrespect or slight to those who have those interests.
QuoteAssuming you were appointed as an HSO, ICS certifications are not required for these roles.
Even if they assign me to that role, I will be pursuing another track alongside it so that I have an actual job to do. And besides, like I said, ICS is not the big of a headache from a training standpoint at least so far as the online stuff is concerned. When everything comes due for work, I can knock it all out within three nights if I am bored enough to work at it straight through.
Quote from: KASSRCrashResearch on April 26, 2016, 02:17:46 AMWhat are the normal "Here you go newbie" tracks?
There really aren't any, and frankly absent specific intent, I prefer to allow new members to "cook" a while and figure out what CAP is before assigning them
to anything. There is no requirement yo hold any staff job whatsoever, but then the reasonable expectation is that you are doing something of "value"
to the commander, whether that is an operator or ad-hoc resource, there is increasing pressure for members to be active on some subjective level, just putting thay
out there.
Some Struggling CCs will see every new member as a "savior", which isn't fair to the new guy, nor the way to run a horse show anyway.
You can't let new members flounder on their own, in fact NHQ now requires that the CC appoint a mentor, or act as one himself, for all new members
as part of the application process, but to a small degree, there needs to be some allowance to just "see what this is about" before dumping 2 yards of
binders on some poor guy who just wants to help once in a while.
In your case, NESA might be a good, objective goal to meet straight in, assuming it works out. After NESA, you'll know a lot of the players and
can get involved in mission work right away, which is not all that common for new people. That would probably give you a good insight into all
CAP is, and isn't.
If it doesn't work out, then wall-hugging some meetings and getting the lay of the land by discussing current ops with the members is a
good way to see where the real need and fun is vs. fulfilling an inspection checklist.
BTW - on the timeline, most CC's now require members to attend 1-3 meetings before being considered for membership, then regs require they
are approved by the membership committee before the app is accepted. From there, the app is processed at NHQ and submitted to the FBI
and that process is entirely in their court. I just had one clear in about a week, but there's never any way to tell for sure.
You can start some of the online training and L1 stuff the day your CAPID is assigned, but can't go to NESA w/o L1. So it'd be tight if you dropped the
check in the mail this week, let alone waiting any longer, and this all assumes you gel with the local unit.
QuoteIn your case, NESA might be a good, objective goal to meet straight in, assuming it works out. After NESA, you'll know a lot of the players and can get involved in mission work right away, which is not all that common for new people. That would probably give you a good insight into all CAP is, and isn't.
I'm going to operate off the assumption that it's not practical since getting all the paperwork lined up perfectly isn't very likely. As much as I would love to attend it, reality is a cold mistress in times like these. Between the behind the scenes delays and the stuff already on my plate for this summer, it is unlikely that it would work out.
QuoteSome Struggling CCs will see every new member as a "savior", which isn't fair to the new guy, nor the way to run a horse show anyway.
I've run screaming away from ambulance services that treat the new guy- especially one with an instruction background- in that way. To anyone who has been around professional operations for any amount of time, it's a huge red flag.
QuoteIf it doesn't work out, then wall-hugging some meetings and getting the lay of the land by discussing current ops with the members is a good way to see where the real need and fun is vs. fulfilling an inspection checklist.
That's kind of my plan and what I have been pursuing so far. I am treating that first meeting as largely a "see what's going on" approach. I've talked with the deputy squadron commander about needs and such.
Even though I have my interests as we all do, I still see the overarching missions as being important enough that if the need arises that I have no problem stepping into an administrative, finance, logistics or other support role that needs to be filled. After all, it's not about me or you or anyone in the unit.
I am secure enough in myself to not need to be out in the lead to feel like my efforts contribute. If I get put there at some point, awesome. If not, so be it. It's the Eisenhower approach to leadership: a person that many people consider to be one of the greatest military leaders we ever had was largely a paper pusher but he knew that it was important. He also realized that being in that position allows you to have a much broader impact than focusing on the high speed end of stuff often does.