CAP Talk

Hey all...

I have a senior rating PAO and a master rating PDO...   I can wear the Master PDO pin and the Senior PAO pin on each side of the white aviator shirt... (you know, 1/2" above the ribbons and 1/2" above the gray name plate...   

my question is on the Leadership ribbon...  what do you wear?   i.e., what is YOUR preference?  1 silver star (representing the master rating)  or 2 bronze stars (representing 2 senior ratings)... 

and you guys who are going to say "ribbons mean nothing to me"... need not reply, tankyouverymuch!   :-* 

Quote from: CAPR 39-3SECTION D 15. b. Leadership Award. Successfully complete technician rating in a training specialty.
(1) Bronze Star Attachment - Successfully complete senior rating in a training specialty.
(2) Silver Star Attachment - Successfully complete master rating in a training specialty. A maximum of three silver star attachments may be worn in recognition of each master rating earned.

Doesn't seem to authorize more than one bronze star.

Quote from: acarlson on May 01, 2007, 01:50:06 AM
I have a senior rating PAO and a master rating PDO...   my question is on the Leadership ribbon...  what do you wear?   i.e., what is YOUR preference?  1 silver star (representing the master rating)  or 2 bronze stars (representing 2 senior ratings)... 

Looks like you get one silver and one bronze.

Quote from: Trung Si Ma on May 01, 2007, 02:18:32 AM

Quote from: acarlson on May 01, 2007, 01:50:06 AM
I have a senior rating PAO and a master rating PDO...   my question is on the Leadership ribbon...  what do you wear?   i.e., what is YOUR preference?  1 silver star (representing the master rating)  or 2 bronze stars (representing 2 senior ratings)... 

Looks like you get one silver and one bronze.

Yep, that's what I wear.

3 silvers (that's all I'm alllowed, and all there's room for!) but I'm rated Maste in cadet programs, professional development, safety and personnel.....senior in comm & ES....technician in AE & PAO....hey, I'm a member over 35 years, you end up wearing multiple hats at squadron or group, you'd better learn something in all that time!

Quote from: MIKE on May 01, 2007, 01:58:31 AM

Quote from: CAPR 39-3SECTION D 15. b. Leadership Award. Successfully complete technician rating in a training specialty.
(1) Bronze Star Attachment - Successfully complete senior rating in a training specialty.
(2) Silver Star Attachment - Successfully complete master rating in a training specialty. A maximum of three silver star attachments may be worn in recognition of each master rating earned.

Doesn't seem to authorize more than one bronze star.

Or by default, up to 4 bronze stars?   >:D  Doesn't specify, either way, does it?  So wear a couple of leadership ribbons and you're sure to get it right on at least one.  Personally, I am gonna move my leadership ribbon to the other side of the uniform cuz I'm running out of authorized height.   >:D  Then I'm gonna start wearing a sash.  I bet you the national commander wants one after I start wearing it.   :angel:

Quote from: acarlsonI can wear the Master PDO pin and the Senior PAO pin on each side of the white aviator shirt... (you know, 1/2" above the ribbons and 1/2" above the gray name plate...   

Nope, looks like you can only wear one specialty track badge on the aviator shirt - and on the left side.  Re: CAPM 39-1 Table 6-3 page 110.

Quote from: Camas on May 01, 2007, 05:45:38 AM

Quote from: acarlsonI can wear the Master PDO pin and the Senior PAO pin on each side of the white aviator shirt... (you know, 1/2" above the ribbons and 1/2" above the gray name plate...   

Nope, looks like you can only wear one specialty track badge on the aviator shirt - and on the left side.  Re: CAPM 39-1 Table 6-3 page 110.

Great discussion!   
however that wasn't my question... my question was the silver or bronze star on the leadership ribbon.

Here's a second question:
CAPM 39-3 page 6: 
b. Leadership Award. Successfully complete technician rating in a training specialty.
(1) Bronze Star Attachment - Successfully complete senior rating in a training specialty.
(2) Silver Star Attachment - Successfully complete master rating in a training specialty. A
maximum of three silver star attachments may be worn in recognition of each master rating earned

q:  can you combine 1 silver star and 1 bronze star on the Leadership ribbon?

Yes

Not only can you combine bronze and silver stars on a Davis Leadership ribbon, you can actually wear more than one.  If you have ratings in four to six areas, you can wear two leadership ribbons with the proper stars on them.  (If you can't, somebody better tell GAWG CC Col. Lyle Letteer ... he wears 'em that way in his official photo!)

Jack

I know that this thread is regarding the devices worn on the Leadership ribbon.

That being said I have a question concerning the actual professional track rating badges. Since I currently don't wear wings of any sort, am I allowed two badges (ie. AE and CP)? And do those go on the pockets of the aviator shirt instead of above the ribbons?

Thanks for letting me take a little bit of a thread highjack here,

Quote from: carnold1836 on May 01, 2007, 01:23:20 PM
That being said I have a question concerning the actual professional track rating badges. Since I currently don't wear wings of any sort, am I allowed two badges (ie. AE and CP)?

For the Aviator shirt/grey slacks uniform:

From 39-1:
"Only the CAP aviation badge and one additional CAP badge are authorized on this uniform."

So you can wear one CAP badge, plus one set of wings.

Quote from: carnold1836 on May 01, 2007, 01:23:20 PMAnd do those go on the pockets of the aviator shirt instead of above the ribbons?

From 39-1:
"CAP Specialty Badges: Worn centered on left breast pocket."

Quote from: CAPM 39-1 Page 105 Sec. 6-5
6-5. Description and Proper Placement on the Aviator Shirt with Epaulets. When wearing the aviator shirt the gray nameplate must also be worn. CAP ribbons, CAP aviation badge and one additional CAP badge may be worn (specialty insignia, specialty badge or command badge). No other badges or patches are authorized with this combination. See Chapter 4 for more information. Figure 6-16 illustrates the CAP aviation badges and Figure 6-17 illustrates the specialty insignia. Table 6-3 outlines the placement of these items.

So no, you may only wear an aviation badge and 1 other badge.  Since you don't have an aviation badge, you may only wear one badge on it.

Thank y'all, now I get to lambast some of the members that are wearing these incorrectly (after I make the needed changes to my uniform ::))

Long/Short-Sleeved Blues -- just minature wings, no specialty badges or ribbons.

Service Dress -- Wings, ribbons, and Cadet Programs specialty badge.  Don't wear the other specialty badges, since I work primarily in CP; even though I may have other ratings it seems appropriate to wear the one for my primary duty assignment.    As for the leadership ribbon, I'm not going to go poking holes in it to add or change devices.  I plan on continuing to advance in my various specialty tracks... there's no sense in putting holes in ribbons and mini medal drapes when I only wear them a few times a year.  I'll wait until I get a few master ratings, and then update the leadership ribbon.

blues = mini wings & mini GBD badge
service coat = ribbons of course, full-size wings/GBD badge, CP badge on pocket. Got plenty other thigns I could wear on the right side, but don't like that look, also I choose the CP badge for two reasons: first of all it is my primary specialty & job, but secondly cause it & the AE badge look more like duty badges than the others.

Far as the rules on badge wear for the aviator... check that again real close. There are three categories of badges (excluding NB/NEC) all with slightly dif rules. And make sure you see the female rules also.

Quote from: davedove on May 01, 2007, 01:33:17 PM

Quote from: carnold1836 on May 01, 2007, 01:23:20 PMAnd do those go on the pockets of the aviator shirt instead of above the ribbons?

From 39-1:
"CAP Specialty Badges: Worn centered on left breast pocket."

From 39-1:
and for women... women can optionally wear the badge 1/2 " above the ribbons...
...otherwise ... ouch!   but I know you guys wouldn't appreciate that!

Oops, forgot to answer the intital question...

My leadership ribbon has 2 silver and 1 bronze on it.  One thing to be careful of is the attachments.  I've seen people with 1 silver and 2 bronze put the silver in the middle because "it looks better."  But it's just like the ribbons, the higher precedence attachment goes to your right.

I have also seen Wing CC's wearing specialties about the name plate...

Commanders can wear the "Commanders Badge" above the nameplate.

I haven't worn blues yet, but I have them set up with my Master Personnel badge, AF Maintenance badge, and my military ribbons. I'm currently slotted as an ES officer, and may wear the badge once I earn it. I haven't decided yet. Depends on whether or not I feel like making the order. :-\

On my shirt, I wear mini wings only.  I will probably buy a mini GT badge when I order more stuff from The Official Supplier, Whose Name Is So Sacred It Dare Not Be Spoken.

On my blue jacket, I wear all 20 ribbons (10 CAP, 8 Military, 2 Foreign) plus my full size GT badge and full size wings.  I skip wearing the silly qualification badges.  I have the Leaderhip Ribbon and a master rating in Public Affairs, but...

I'm a pilot, so that trumps all other badges!

(He stood there, holding a martini in his hand, and smiled.  He knew the tropical sun was gleaming off of his silver pilot wings.  His service cap, at a rakish angle, telegraphed to The Raven-Haired Beauty that this was no ordinary CAP officer.  She swung her hips seductively as she walked across the tile floor toward him.  "I see you're a pilot, she said.  I LOVE men who fly...")

Quote from: JohnKachenmeister on May 02, 2007, 04:53:03 AM[bits redacted] I'm a pilot, so that trumps all other badges!

(He stood there, holding a martini in his hand, and smiled.  He knew the tropical sun was gleaming off of his silver pilot wings.  His service cap, at a rakish angle, telegraphed to The Raven-Haired Beauty that this was no ordinary CAP officer.  She swung her hips seductively as she walked across the tile floor toward him.  "I see you're a pilot, she said.  I LOVE men who fly...")

My sweetie is officially pissed at you now. I woke her up laughing at that.

Don't have a rated specialty soooo... I don't wear a specialty track badge. I wear my rack, CIB, Senior Parachutist,  GT Badge.

The problem comes in when looking at the regulations. Parachutist wings are treated as an aviation badge. This puts them at the top. CAP GT badges are to be worn above the ribbons. CIB doesn't fit on the pocket. Therefore, I wear the GT on the pocket. CIB above the ribbons, Wings above that. I could be wrong but...

Quote from: Sgt. Savage on May 02, 2007, 12:16:49 PM
The problem comes in when looking at the regulations. Parachutist wings are treated as an aviation badge. This puts them at the top. CAP GT badges are to be worn above the ribbons. CIB doesn't fit on the pocket. Therefore, I wear the GT on the pocket. CIB above the ribbons, Wings above that. I could be wrong but...

Yep, you are really wrong. 

Quote from: CAPM 39-1
A maximum of four earned badges may be worn on all blue service uniforms. A maximum of two badges are worn on the left side of the uniform above ribbons, or welt of pocket if ribbons are not worn.

Quote from: CAPM 39-1Specialty Insignia (Chaplain, Legal, Medical, EMT, GroundTeam)
Men: centered 1/2 inch above the left breast pocket or 1/2 inch above ribbons.

So you have 3 "badges" above the ribbons instead of 2, and the one you wear on the pocket isn't supposed to be.

Just out of curiosity, what is the "but...?"

I wouldn't say REALLY wrong. I only wear a total of three badges. After reflecting on the specifics, my BDU's are ok, I need to take the GT off of my Blues. Minor.

The but was.... it can be changed, it isn't the end of the world, I've been wrong before, whatever it needs to mean.

This is where that 3 categories of badges comes in...
These can only be worn in the two slots over the ribbons, pick to the exclusion of the rest:
1) Aviation badges (CAP or mil)
2) Qualification badges (airbone, AF spec badges, CAP legal/medical, etc)

These can only be worn on the pocket & over above the name:
3) CAP specialty track badges, mil duty badges

NOTES:
a) by convention, combat badges can take precedent over air ratings, even if you got combat jumps.
b) These are the rules for the service coat. They are slightly different for the shirt, and slight different again for the white shirt. Any moron would tell you it makes sense to standardize that a bit.

Quote from: JohnKachenmeister on May 02, 2007, 04:53:03 AM
I'm a pilot, so that trumps all other badges!

You're still a good guy, in spite of this evident handicap!

Quote from: DNall on May 02, 2007, 06:55:14 PM
... pick to the exclusion of the rest:

I know this sounds crazy to throw this caveat in there, but I still run into people that believe it.

That's two badges to the exclusion of others, on each individual uniform.

Example: A member has an Air Force specialty badge, and jump wings; also the member has earned a Ground Team badge, and observer wings. The max he may wear on a uniform is any two. If he wears his AF badge and jump wings on one (say a blue shirt) , he may still wear the GT badge and observer badge on another (BDU's, for example). If the individual so desires, he could wear jump wings and observer badge on a uniform, or any combination of two from the four he is authorized.

I've run into people, for some reason, that think that an individual can only wear only certain badges (such as AF specialty badge and jump wings) on all uniforms. That they have to pick two, and can only wear those two on any uniform they wear ??? (some even think that if you have CAP badges you can't wear military ones :o). The exclusion means per uniform, not all uniforms. I know, it's crazy, but some people believe it.

That's certainly true, and very much what I intend to do. I'm not going to wear ribbons with the shirt, so at least one will be a mil badge, but will wear mil ribbons on the service coat, so maybe just the CAP badges there. And yeah, mix it up between varrious BDU sets depending on costs.

I would also think that if you have ratings in different specialties, you might wear the different badges on different occasions.  For instance, while performing your duties as Safety Officer you would wear your safety rating.  However, if you're teaching a class about Professional Development, you would wear that badge.

There are limits, but you have options within those limits.

One of the problems comes in when looking at the AFI regarding badges. On AF style uniforms , you can wear a third Misc. badge on the left pocket. This is reflected in 39-1 which says regarding table 6-5 "1. Badges are worn in the same position as they are worn on the Air Force uniform. If a CAP badge is
worn in the same position, the member must choose one to the exclusion of the other."

That having been said, I am compliant if I wear a military badge on my pocket, regardless of the uniform. I can't wear a CAP badge on my pocket.

Yet another contradiction from 39-1.

I'm not real sure about that on the AFI. It specifically states where to put certain types of badges (specialty & qual), which leaves duty badges & stuff like CC badge as misc. I don't think you can wear any mil badge you want on the pocket. I'm not going to go quoting regs at you though.

What I'd tell you is you should be proud of your accomplishments & it's fine to display them within professional limits. Just pick two appropriate for the situation & move on. Put the GT on your BDUs for mission identification, & leave it off the blues if you like. That's probably what I'd do.

I'd warn you also that if they ever update 39-1 then authorization for the CIB will go away, per the AFI. The only reason it's okay now is it's in that chart that's based off the old AFI.

Quote from: DNall on May 03, 2007, 06:02:53 PM
I'd warn you also that if they ever update 39-1 then authorization for the CIB will go away, per the AFI. The only reason it's okay now is it's in that chart that's based off the old AFI.

It seems to me (and I was never in military) that CIB (as well as any other insignia recognizing service in combat, from any of the armed services) ought to be permitted, and if necessary NB should enact a change to 39-1 to allow this..

I understand it strays from the AF style, but given the number of our members that are combat veterans, i strongly believe their service should be recognized by CAP, in uniform.

Quote from: DNall on May 03, 2007, 06:02:53 PM
I'd warn you also that if they ever update 39-1 then authorization for the CIB will go away, per the AFI. The only reason it's okay now is it's in that chart that's based off the old AFI.

If that happens, I'll lobby to bring it back. That's a slap in the face to the combat vets by the Air Force, unless they adopt the same policy the Marine Corps has with it's Combat Action ribbon. If they don't, and only award the Air Force ribbons to airmen that have seen combat, it's gonna raise some royal Hades (and I'll carry a banner myself, even though I don't have any combat awards.)

I wouldn't worry about mil badges going away. Our SMSGT just got his CAB approved by national as it is included in the AFI but not 39-1. All non- AF mil badges that they authorize fall under the MISC. category. It provides for wearing them IAW the AFI and in the positions they authorize. In reality, I don't worry about any of it too much. Makes for good conversaton and seems to motivate cadets to push themselves a little harder and be a little better.

Eventually, I hope to replace a badge with a specialty track.

I don't want to make a big deal out of this, but the newest AFI changed it from perm award to only while assigned to & on duty with Army units. That took stuff like CIBs off a lot of AF personnel (particularly TACP, PJs, CCT, etc) that earned it fair & square, plus of course prior-service. When 39-1 is updated, it will have to comply with that & CAP will have no say in the matter.

CAP doesn't have any choice but to follow the AFI as the AF interprets it. CAP is then allowed to add CAP-specific items as approved by the AF, and that's it. We don't have any control over what mil badges may or may not be worn on our uniforms, and never will.

DNall,

A question occurs to me: how is the AFI treating non-AF issue flight qualifications (i.e., wings?)

There is a fundamental philosophical question here: the USAF gives wings precedence over anything and everything else.

In reality (and I will grant you it is not exact equivaleency), a basic aeronautical rating is analogous to the Army "Expert Infantry Badge" (do they still have that badge?) -- which is to say, demonstrating competence in performing the fundamental functions of the individual's primary military role.

A CIB states that the individual has actually satisfactorily served in
that role in combat.

If the Combat Action Ribbon substitutes, so be it....but other posts seem to indicate that in USAF circles this award is available only for AF combat service.

This is an unacceptable answer.

I believe what you say; I simply agree with the poster (Hawk?) who said we'll simply have to advocate for a change.

CAP probably won't be able to bring this about alone....however, I bet we would have little difficulty getting veterans organizations' on board.

Quote from: ZigZag911 on May 04, 2007, 04:33:19 PM
A question occurs to me: how is the AFI treating non-AF issue flight qualifications (i.e., wings?)

I'm not sure what you mean exactly, but aeronautical ratings are covered in a whole seperate reg & that comes with it's own wierdness.

I doesn't really matter what you or I think, cause the AF decides & they were very clear when they specifically deauthorized this stuff in the newest reg (believe that's 2003). So they got a new ribbon now like the navy/marines that we can't trade in for as CAP members, that really doesn't effect us.

There is & will be no public outcry from vetrans groups or anyone else cause it impacts such a SMALL number of people. That's just the way it is. If you think you have some influence with the AF, be my guest. All CAP can do is NOT update the reg so that chart in the back remains the rule for now.

Dennis:

I live near a USAF base, and I see a handful of USAF folks who were former Army still wearing their CIB's.  It must either still be authorized as a prior service award, or there is an open rebellion going on.

Maybe they're in a weather flight or TACP assigned to the Army, or maybe they are just wearing it w/o authorization. It's not unheard of for people to do that. PJs aespecially man, they do whatever they want - who in the AF is going to tell them no? Anyway, the newer AFI is 2003, so I'm sure there are plenty of people that don't follow the tiny item that effects so few. All I know is what the AFI says & what Susie Parker has told others about it.

Quote from: ZigZag911 on May 04, 2007, 04:33:19 PM
A question occurs to me: how is the AFI treating non-AF issue flight qualifications (i.e., wings?)

From what I've seen, the AF pretty much treats all wings as aeronautical ratings, regardless of branch of service. If you have an aeronautical rating of some type, from any branch of service (I've even seen a prior Coast Guard service member in the AF wearing Coastie wings, only one I've ever met), the AF usually permits its wear. The caveat is aeronautical rating, the Navy Air Warfare Badge doesn't fit the specifications.

Quote
There is a fundamental philosophical question here: the USAF gives wings precedence over anything and everything else.

In reality (and I will grant you it is not exact equivaleency), a basic aeronautical rating is analogous to the Army "Expert Infantry Badge" (do they still have that badge?) -- which is to say, demonstrating competence in performing the fundamental functions of the individual's primary military role.

Not as far as the Air Force is concerned. The EIB is not even permitted by prior service soldiers. I knew one Army Guardsmen that was going active AF, and was told he couldn't wear it. The Air Force would place it in his records, but would not permit wear.

To the Air Force, wings are wings, with no equivalencies to any other award. The EIB is a different award, showing proficiency in Infantry tasks, not Aircrew tasks.

Quote
If the Combat Action Ribbon substitutes, so be it....but other posts seem to indicate that in USAF circles this award is available only for AF combat service.

I don't know either way for a fact. It's just supposition at the moment. Having been active Air Force, I can say it wouldn't surprise me.

Quote
I believe what you say; I simply agree with the poster (Hawk?) who said we'll simply have to advocate for a change.

Agreed. I feel it's wrong to deny a member wear of a combat award from another branch of service, simply because it's another branch of service. But with every branch doing their own thing (the various utility uniforms demonstrate this), it's gonna be harder to make that happen. I'll lobby for it, personally, even if I don't have one. It may hold more weight if I do get one, but I don't know if that will happen.

What does the CIB have to do with the Leadership ribbon again?

Leadership ribbon question mentions questionable badge wear, gets into discussion of inconsistent rules, then slides to quirky rules about mil badges. That's the wondering life of any thread.

Quote from: ZigZag911 on May 03, 2007, 08:42:49 PM

Quote from: DNall on May 03, 2007, 06:02:53 PM
I'd warn you also that if they ever update 39-1 then authorization for the CIB will go away, per the AFI. The only reason it's okay now is it's in that chart that's based off the old AFI.

It seems to me (and I was never in military) that CIB (as well as any other insignia recognizing service in combat, from any of the armed services) ought to be permitted, and if necessary NB should enact a change to 39-1 to allow this..

I understand it strays from the AF style, but given the number of our members that are combat veterans, i strongly believe their service should be recognized by CAP, in uniform.

I agree.

As for badges. I have seen a SM who had only two badges on his blues... a few retired/former AD SMs in my unit leaned over and asked "what the heck is THAT?!" ... I took one look - the item was twice as big as any badge Id normally encountered-  and smiled... "well SarMajor, the Navy calls that the "Budwieser" .... 

I say, let them wear, what they earn.

Quote from: DNall on May 04, 2007, 08:29:33 PM
Maybe they're in a weather flight or TACP assigned to the Army, or maybe they are just wearing it w/o authorization. It's not unheard of for people to do that. PJs aespecially man, they do whatever they want - who in the AF is going to tell them no? Anyway, the newer AFI is 2003, so I'm sure there are plenty of people that don't follow the tiny item that effects so few. All I know is what the AFI says & what Susie Parker has told others about it.

A weather flight or a TACP, even if assigned to the Army, would not rate the CIB.  That badge requires Infantry qualification.  They might earn the CAB, which is the combat badge for everyone other than medics and grunts.  You are probably right about the fact that they are PJ's, and nobody will tell them they're in violation of an AFI because they are afraifd that the PJ will kill them.  It also possible that Suzy Parker makes stuff up as she goes along.  I asked about a discrepancy in the tables of ribbon precedence in 39-1, and I think she just made up an answer to blow me off.

TACP would do IN skills with an IN unit & I've seen them regularly awarded CIB by the Army side by side with other troops. PJs mostly go to Ranger school if they want to, and that awards 11B as a secondary MOS, and then go work with the Ranger Bat or something. I don't know, I've seen it a few times, the only person I ever knew details on was TACP & earned it serving with the 82nd. I know PJs where ranger tabs from time to time, which isn't authorized, but no one's going to correct those that walk on water.

Far as Ms Parker, the way it's set up her word is pretty much law. However she interprets the regs is the answer, even if that changes from call to email. That's what command has delegated to her, so oh well.

Quote from: Camas on May 01, 2007, 05:45:38 AM

Quote from: acarlsonI can wear the Master PDO pin and the Senior PAO pin on each side of the white aviator shirt... (you know, 1/2" above the ribbons and 1/2" above the gray name plate...   

Nope, looks like you can only wear one specialty track badge on the aviator shirt - and on the left side.  Re: CAPM 39-1 Table 6-3 page 110.

Quote from: carnold1836 on May 01, 2007, 01:56:04 PM
Thank y'all, now I get to lambast some of the members that are wearing these incorrectly (after I make the needed changes to my uniform ::))

... not so fast junior ... before you go quoting scripture... the operative word is i-n-t-e-r-p-r-e-t-s... 

Here's one that'll heat up the flame!  ...  (sorry aviators!)
check out this NHQ reply to the same question posted (not by me, btw) on CAP Kowledgebase...   Answer ID  1708

http://capnhq.custhelp.com/cgi-bin/capnhq.cfg/php/enduser/std_adp.php?p_faqid=1708

Senior member wearing two specialty track badges

  Question
  What if a senior member has two specialty track badges? Can the senior member wear one specialty track badge on the left breast pocket and wear the second specialty track badge on the right side? 

  Answer
  Yes a member might wear two specialty badges if one specialty badge is worn on the left in the appropriate location and another is worn in the correct location on the right side of the uniform provided no more than the maximum of four badges/devices are worn on the AF-style uniform. Only one specialty badge may be worn in each location.  


as Linda Richman (Mike Myers) would've said...
          "discuss amongst yourselves"...

Quote from: acarlson on May 11, 2007, 01:11:04 PM

Quote from: Camas on May 01, 2007, 05:45:38 AM

Quote from: acarlsonI can wear the Master PDO pin and the Senior PAO pin on each side of the white aviator shirt... (you know, 1/2" above the ribbons and 1/2" above the gray name plate...   

Nope, looks like you can only wear one specialty track badge on the aviator shirt - and on the left side.  Re: CAPM 39-1 Table 6-3 page 110.

Quote from: carnold1836 on May 01, 2007, 01:56:04 PM
Thank y'all, now I get to lambast some of the members that are wearing these incorrectly (after I make the needed changes to my uniform ::))

... not so fast junior ... before you go quoting scripture... the operative word is i-n-t-e-r-p-r-e-t-s... 

Here's one that'll heat up the flame!  ...  (sorry aviators!)
check out this NHQ reply to the same question posted (not by me, btw) on CAP Kowledgebase...   Answer ID  1708

http://capnhq.custhelp.com/cgi-bin/capnhq.cfg/php/enduser/std_adp.php?p_faqid=1708

Senior member wearing two specialty track badges

  Question
  What if a senior member has two specialty track badges? Can the senior member wear one specialty track badge on the left breast pocket and wear the second specialty track badge on the right side? 

  Answer
  Yes a member might wear two specialty badges if one specialty badge is worn on the left in the appropriate location and another is worn in the correct location on the right side of the uniform provided no more than the maximum of four badges/devices are worn on the AF-style uniform. Only one specialty badge may be worn in each location.  


as Linda Richman (Mike Myers) would've said...
          "discuss amongst yourselves"...

Am I interpreting that you are talking about two different uniforms that have two different sets of rules? <Emphasis mine>

I think the real problem is that we have too many uniforms and too many rules. Where do I wear my GT badge on my service dress speedo?

exactly. consolidate as much as reasonable to one corp & one AF version of each thing, & make the rules on each the exact same, or as nearly so as we are allowed (can't control mil ribbons/badges on corp).

Quote from: DNall on May 11, 2007, 07:25:18 PM
exactly. consolidate as much as reasonable to one corp & one AF version of each thing, & make the rules on each the exact same, or as nearly so as we are allowed (can't control mil ribbons/badges on corp).

I second the notion. Absolutey, positively, wholeheartedly agree. (Just in case, there's in any question.)

So, whadda we gotta do to get this done?

I'd state it as a resolution with this as the goal & instruction to the uniform cmte for proposal. That's asomething you need to get a Wg CC to put forward, and or ask CAC to propose.

Quote from: DeputyDog on May 11, 2007, 02:43:22 PM

Quote from: acarlson on May 11, 2007, 01:11:04 PM
...
check out this NHQ reply to the same question posted (not by me, btw) on CAP Kowledgebase...   Answer ID  1708

http://capnhq.custhelp.com/cgi-bin/capnhq.cfg/php/enduser/std_adp.php?p_faqid=1708

Senior member wearing two specialty track badges

  Question
  What if a senior member has two specialty track badges? Can the senior member wear one specialty track badge on the left breast pocket and wear the second specialty track badge on the right side? 

  Answer
  Yes a member might wear two specialty badges if one specialty badge is worn on the left in the appropriate location and another is worn in the correct location on the right side of the uniform provided no more than the maximum of four badges/devices are worn on the AF-style uniform. Only one specialty badge may be worn in each location.  

Am I interpreting that you are talking about two different uniforms that have two different sets of rules? <Emphasis mine>

Oh man!   did I get that mixed up... or did the CAP-Knowledgebase-who-knows-all-and-keeps-it-all-confusing-guru just confuse the issue?

ok...  I was asking about the aviator shirt...  if this Answer ID  1708 isn't referring to that... then... nevermind.  and my apologies.

Quote from: Sgt. Savage on May 11, 2007, 03:01:09 PM
I think the real problem is that we have too many uniforms and too many rules.

Yes... I absolutely agree there...  every new commander, needs his/her own legacy!

Quote from: Sgt. Savage on May 11, 2007, 03:01:09 PM
Where do I wear my GT badge on my service dress speedo?

whaaho hey!   you got a service dress speedo?   WOW you must know what device goes where!!   I'm impressed!

Quote from: Sgt. Savage on May 11, 2007, 03:01:09 PM
Where do I wear my GT badge on my service dress speedo?

Your choice of two badges, left & right cheek. Now the the utility thong...  >:D

Quote from: DNall on May 11, 2007, 07:25:18 PM
exactly. consolidate as much as reasonable to one corp & one AF version of each thing, & make the rules on each the exact same, or as nearly so as we are allowed (can't control mil ribbons/badges on corp).

Not quite true. The AF controls what we wear on the AF uniforms but, much like other civilian organizations, and military regulations themselves, there are provisions for wearing awards on other than military uniforms. The general rule is that they are worn in good taste.

I figured out the GT badge on the "SDS(peedo)" Then there was the tie....

Almost forgot... We need to do something with NCO rank. How many of you have seen AF blue stripes on a BDU? Looks like Butt.

Yes, but we don't entirely control that. If the AF doesn't want them worn on teh corp combinations, then we shouldn't bite the hand that feeds us.

NCO stripes, some discussion here: http://captalk.net/index.php?topic=2033.20;topicseen (http://captalk.net/index.php?topic=2033.20;topicseen) There's been a few other discussions in the past but this one will give you the state of affairs.