Hello
I hope to get some feedback on my prospects for being accepted as a senior member of CAP.
I am an army Iraq vet, received the army Combat Infantry Badge and was discharged honorably. However 14 years ago I was arrested and charged with soliciting a prostitute by Los Angeles police. The charge was bogus and I was only convicted of trespassing. Later I had the conviction expunged. This means there is no longer a conviction but officially a dismissal of the charges; however the FBI check shows the charge in addition to the trespassing conviction and later disposition of dismissal.
This is the only record I have on my FBI rap sheet but the charge alone makes the rap sheet sound worse than it is. Will the charge without any conviction prevent me being accepted into CAP because of alleged moral turpitude that wasn't even proven?
Any feedback will be appreciated because I don't want to waste my time trying to join if this will clearly prevent it.
I look forward to hearing from you.
Thank you very much,
Wolfhound
When it shows up National will contact you (no one else) and ask for your version of the arrest. They handle it on a case to case basis. be honest and do answer the inquiry, If you don't respond they will deny the membership.
Pretty much what MSG Mac said, but honestly if the conviction was expunged I wouldn't worry about it. Even if it wasn't, I don't think a 14-year-old trespassing charge would disqualify you.
Be honest on your application (CAPF 12) where it states list all arrest or charges regardless of whether it was expunged. May not hurt to dig up the paperwork just in case. That way, if NHQ calls and asks, volunteer to send it their way. It will show you are not hiding anything. However, if that is the only thing and it was 14 years ago, probably won't hurt anything.
I haven't applied yet but if I apply I will include it. Hoping my army record will have some influence.
May I ask based on your user name, what unit you were with in the Army?
I was in the 69th infantry regiment NY Army National Guard.
From 'the book', a misdemeanor conviction is not an automatic disqualifier.
CAPR 39-2 27 DECEMBER 2012 13
3-2. Requirements for Membership. All applicants for senior membership in CAP must be
accepted by the unit and higher headquarters and must meet the following criteria: ...
d. Suitability. Subject to being waived by the Chief Operating Officer and/or National
Commander, as noted below, any one of the following may be the basis for rejection of membership.
(1) Conviction of a felony by any court of record whether federal, state or military.
(Requires both Chief Operating Officer and National Commander concurrence to accept as member.)
(2) A pattern of arrests and/or convictions including but not limited to sex offenses, child
abuse, DUIs, dishonesty and violence.
(3) Discharge from the armed services under other than honorable conditions.
(4) Falsification of information on the membership application.
(5) Previously terminated or nonrenewed for cause from membership in CAP. (Requires
both Chief Operating Officer and National Commander concurrence to accept as member.)
(6) Any other unfavorable information brought to the attention of CAP officials at any level.
An expunged conviction isn't a conviction (at least any more).
Quote from: tribalelder on February 26, 2014, 09:36:59 PM
An expunged conviction isn't a conviction (at least any more).
In this day and age, that term is all but meaningless.
From the new CAPF 12
C. Arrests/Charges (Write "NONE" if appropriate):
List on a separate sheet, all arrests or charges regardless of age or whether the record in your case has been sealed, expunged, or
otherwise stricken from the court records. You must also include all military courts-martial or non-judicial punishment (Article 15,
UCMJ or Captain's Mast). Failure to provide all required information may result in your membership application being denied. (Note:
You may exclude minor traffic violations unless drugs, alcohol or injury were involved.)
Quote from: Wolfhound63 on February 26, 2014, 08:07:32 PM
I was in the 69th infantry regiment NY Army National Guard.
I was 4th Bn/27th Infantry "Wolfhounds" from 88-92. Welcome to CT.
Thank you Sir for the welcome,
As part of the "Fighting 69th" of Civil War Irish Brigade fame, I was deployed to Iraq in 2004 as part of Task Force Wolfhound.
During my time in the NY ANG I was part of both the 27th Brigade and the 42nd ID.
I'm not a CAP member (just a prospect, lurking the forums), but I previously worked for the local Sheriff's Office until I decided criminal justice wasn't for me. If your charge was expunged the records should be removed, even from FBI databases. Your state law enforcement agency (SLED in SC, called something different in every state) will always keep records of charges, but will not share this information to pretty much anyone other than federal agencies in special circumstances. If this charge is still showing up for you on background checks, you should inquire into it.
When I was employed, even if I ran a NCIC (National Crime Information Center) search on someone, an expunged charge should not show up on their record. State records should also return no hits. I'm not positive what credentials you'd need to dig up an expunged charge (this wasn't covered very well in my NCIC certification class), so I guess it's possible. But in general, this shouldn't be haunting you any more.
But, I'm not a CAP member and I don't know what kind of information the FBI digs up for them. Just sharing what I know.
That being said, I would still disclose it. If anything, just for piece of mind so you don't always have that picking at you in the back of your head, wondering if some day, they'll find it and kick you out.
Anyway, I would be really, really surprised if they denied your application for a 14-year-old expunged non-felony Trespass charge. Now, on the other hand, an expunged Involuntary Manslaughter charge might turn some heads. (Believe it or not, in PA, Involuntary Manslaughter is a Misdemeanor.)
Quote from: RNugget on February 27, 2014, 08:47:05 AM
I'm not a CAP member (just a prospect, lurking the forums), but I previously worked for the local Sheriff's Office until I decided criminal justice wasn't for me. If your charge was expunged the records should be removed, even from FBI databases. Your state law enforcement agency (SLED in SC, called something different in every state) will always keep records of charges, but will not share this information to pretty much anyone other than federal agencies in special circumstances. If this charge is still showing up for you on background checks, you should inquire into it.
When I was employed, even if I ran a NCIC (National Crime Information Center) search on someone, an expunged charge should not show up on their record. State records should also return no hits. I'm not positive what credentials you'd need to dig up an expunged charge (this wasn't covered very well in my NCIC certification class), so I guess it's possible. But in general, this shouldn't be haunting you any more.
But, I'm not a CAP member and I don't know what kind of information the FBI digs up for them. Just sharing what I know.
This, in my opinion, is bad advice. I speak as someone with 30 years in law enforcement, including considerable time in background investigations.
Criminal history records are like any other records. They are only as good (or as bad) as the people and systems that enter and/or remove data. Relying on "...should not show up on their record" is taking a big risk.
CAP wants what CAP wants. Give it to them. Don't play games by guessing what is important, what is there or not there.
As I used to tell police candidates - "We can forgive a lot that happened in people's past. But we can't and won't forgive lying about it. Don't guess - let us judge what meets our standards."
Quote from: RNugget on February 27, 2014, 08:47:05 AM
I'm not a CAP member (just a prospect, lurking the forums), but I previously worked for the local Sheriff's Office until I decided criminal justice wasn't for me. If your charge was expunged the records should be removed, even from FBI databases. Your state law enforcement agency (SLED in SC, called something different in every state) will always keep records of charges, but will not share this information to pretty much anyone other than federal agencies in special circumstances. If this charge is still showing up for you on background checks, you should inquire into it.
When I was employed, even if I ran a NCIC (National Crime Information Center) search on someone, an expunged charge should not show up on their record. State records should also return no hits. I'm not positive what credentials you'd need to dig up an expunged charge (this wasn't covered very well in my NCIC certification class), so I guess it's possible. But in general, this shouldn't be haunting you any more.
But, I'm not a CAP member and I don't know what kind of information the FBI digs up for them. Just sharing what I know.
I'm guessing you're also not a lawyer. Disclose it. When asked for supporting docs, provide them. It really is just that simple.
Criminal histories don't just appear in official criminal records any more.
In this day and age of "social" media, there's plenty of places people can look for information from public sources.
Something being expunged from the legal system won't expunge it from Facebook, newspapers, etc.
Integrity instills the value of doing the right thing even when nobody is looking. Be honest, disclose it on the proper forms. Let NHQ determine whether or not something that happened 14 years ago (with no continuing trend) is a factor for not allowing your entry into the Civil Air Patrol. Honesty and integrity are good core values. Hopefully in the near future your response on this thread will be that "Hey, I'm the newest member of CAP". If you don't disclose it, and do get in, you'll always be looking over your shoulder.
Best of luck !
I didn't mean to suggest that you should not disclose it. After all, the application specifically says to list all arrests and charges even if they were stricken from record and expunged. Like Eclipse said, even if it's "officially" off the record there is really no such thing as anything being off the record anymore.
All I wanted to share was that if the process of expungement were done correctly the case would be sealed and records of it shouldn't be available from federal or state record repositories. Mistakes also happen all the time with paperwork in the criminal justice system, so it could still be sitting out there.
Thanks for all the advice!
I planned to disclose it all along, just wanted to know how much of a problem it would be.