In the city where I live and my squadron is located in, there is also a high school JROTC unit. This JROTC unit has entered into a never ending peeing match with the squadron, up to threatening the cadets who are in both programs. I wanted to know if anyone else had problems like this?
If they are threatening you, inform the next level commander (group/wing) AND local law enforcement.
Find out their chain of command and inform them that they are not acting the way they should, which in this case would more than likely cover grounds from being fired from the job. At no point is it acceptable for a JROTC instructor to threaten a cadet at all, and you cannot remove a cadet for what extracurricular activities they do. I'm a JROTC cadet also, and if my instructors ever tried this, I would file a complaint with the US Army Cadet Command.
Hang on with the generic "call law enforcement" line. Its generally not appropriate and ties up resources unnecessarily. These are things that need to be handled at the school admin level. Not calling the cops for some lame misplaced teen inter service rivalry nonsense. Nor am I getting the impression it is an adult instructor. I think its more cadet vs cadet. If it is an adult instructor, have your parents go to the school ASAP. Believe me, its much easier when its handled by the school. If something needs to be addressed by the police, it will be directed that way. School going to the police is much easier than a screaming parent or upset 15 year old calling dispatch at 830pm on a saturday night. Besides, you would probably be surprised at what the law considers a "threat".
Cadet on Cadet.......
Wow..... 20 years ago when I was a kid we had the same issues. Difference was, I was the commander of the JROTC unit AND the cadet commander of the CAP squadron. Funny when my non-CAP JROTC cadets found out what my bottom 3 ribbons were from >:D It ended pretty quick after that when I had some people demoted via a meeting with our CMSgt.
Since that is probably unlikely in your case, you need to bring it to the attention of the senior members, who will then notify the ROTC instructors ASAP and get it under control. I am positive the JROTC leadership will jump on this quick. Last thing a JROTC instructor wants is his kids fighting with the local CAP. Inter service rivalry is childish to begin with amongst military branches, inter service rivalry between CAP and JROTC is jus plain dumb.
I'd almost want to do some snooping myself, if possible, to see where the behavior is coming from. If the faculty is aware of it, the commander of the JROTC unit is on school staff, or if this is simply kids being stupid. Same for the CAP unit. Since you say peeing match, that implies peeing back. Both sides are guilty if so.
The programs are similar and there are even regulations supporting cadets in both, in each of the two. If the posturing is "condoned" by command, than -someone- is missing out on the core values. Never mind the rest, they simply don't get it. If a cadet is in both, and excelling in both especially, this is the kind of leader soon to be mentor that they want. Discouraging it? Give me a break.
Time for someone to move on and go somewhere else, let someone else run the program. At whatever level is harboring it.
Call the cops? Really? Once again, in a few years. Maybe you'll understand better.
JROTC has a Chain of Command just like CAP. Have your squadron commander talk to their SASI if it really is a big issue. Just make sure you follow the chain yourself.
Quote from: Pomegranate on December 21, 2012, 02:24:59 AM
JROTC has a Chain of Command just like CAP. Have your squadron commander talk to their SASI if it really is a big issue. Just make sure you follow the chain yourself.
If they insist on a uninating contest, make sure you provide a tape measure for the meeting.
And gloves and paper towels.
Rubber apron and a facemask too!
Gotta keep OSHA happy! >:D
It is there adult leaders against the entire squadron. The tell my cadets that if they choose CAP over JROTC it will have a negative impact on their grade, and they will be removed from what ever position they are in. And when both of our programs meet they try to pull rank on CAP members, and troll for salutes. One year it was so bad the group commander a LT.COL went to their major and said your retired and my cadet do not have to, and he was retired with more years and a higher rank, so its been an ongoing issue.
Major Dysfunction, if we go by just the one post, however - if it really is being lumped on from the JROTC side of things, and it really is a battle you want to wage, because perhaps there could be some fall out that you won't like from it, IOW, it could get worse before it gets better/it's over. It's obviously BS and wrong.
Start with regulations on both sides that make reference to each other, the core values of the program, and the mission statement. Right there you can probably point out that that there is no place for any animosity in any of it.
Then, where in the Air Force JROTC regulation does it regulate what the cadets do -outside- of the classroom?
Realize that your first "strike" needs to be firm and sound. Be it going to the school administration, or whomever, you don't want it to sound petty. It needs to be firm and swift, if you think it can't get settled by a discussion among parties.
Document. Document. Document. Ye who yields the most documentation builds a solid foundation, and if that documentation is un-challengeable and from the plaintiff, it usually has the desired result.
It may take some interviewing on your part, but get dates, events, individuals and their actions down clear and pat. Start with the most current and work your way backwards, allow a few more current incidents to take place with the absolute intention of documenting them and using those encounters to validate names / participation of the past so that the past incidents can be listed with more assertion.
Sting operation like, but not a baiting mission. You're not wanting to troll, egg on, enable, etc. Remember, if you are truly not participatory in the pissing match to this point, you don't want to change that just to gather 'evidence'. The more witnesses the better, on your end. Even if you have to shield them at first, because if the other end gets a copy of a written report and treats it like some kind of gag, names will be in it, and if the seniors in the class get it, they could give other kids hassle and further commit more "stupid".
But if this is as serious as it sounds, I'd definitely go on the ground that there is some malfunction within that particular implementation of the JROTC program.
Try this.....make an appointment with your squadron commander and the principle of the school and the leade ROTC instructor.
Lay out your concerns and let the school adminstration work the issue.
The best way to win a pissing contest is not to play.
..and attend that meeting with solid, thorough documentation.
Quote from: okeecap on December 21, 2012, 04:55:16 PM
It is there adult leaders against the entire squadron.
What you describe is
not "adult" behaviour or conduct.
Quote from: okeecap on December 21, 2012, 04:55:16 PM
The tell my cadets that if they choose CAP over JROTC it will have a negative impact on their grade, and they will be removed from what ever position they are in.
That's a load of Bull Durham. My first squadron had cadets who were dual CAP/JROTC and we got along just fine. Occasionally their commander, an AFRES (I think) Captain would drop by our unit just to chat and observe.
Quote from: okeecap on December 21, 2012, 04:55:16 PM
And when both of our programs meet they try to pull rank on CAP members, and troll for salutes. One year it was so bad the group commander a LT.COL went to their major and said your retired and my cadet do not have to, and he was retired with more years and a higher rank, so its been an ongoing issue.
These "adults" are forgetting the entire purpose of a salute, which goes back to ancient knighthood.
The salute is a courteous exchange of greetings, with the junior member always saluting first. When returning or rendering an individual salute, the head and eyes are turned toward the Colors or person saluted. When in ranks, the position of attention is maintained unless otherwise directed.http://usmilitary.about.com/cs/generalinfo/a/salute.htm (http://usmilitary.about.com/cs/generalinfo/a/salute.htm)
It is a
courtesy exchanged among military personnel, and, in our case, officers belonging to a volunteer auxiliary of a military service.
It is
not meant as an exercise in one-upmanship, nor is it a pissing contest.
Quote from: lordmonar on December 21, 2012, 06:04:40 PM
The best way to win a pissing contest is not to play.
Exactly the way I do things.