CAP Talk

General Discussion => The Lobby => Topic started by: okeecap on December 02, 2012, 02:11:10 AM

Title: Squadron phone & internet
Post by: okeecap on December 02, 2012, 02:11:10 AM
Is there any thing out there preventing a CAP squadron from obtaining internet service from a service provider.  The reason I paired the question with phone service is phone companies offer reduced pricing if you get phone service as well.  I would assume this could be considered a reoccurring expense, but when I bring this up with other members they tend to want to find a Jerry rigged way to get free internet that probably has cost more over the years then just signing up for the service. :clap:
Title: Re: Squadron phone & internet
Post by: a2capt on December 02, 2012, 04:13:37 AM
Easy Peasy.
Someone order it, and pay the bill, or send the bill to Wing Banker with the form each month..
Title: Re: Squadron phone & internet
Post by: krnlpanick on December 02, 2012, 05:36:14 AM
If you have squadron funds to cover it then just order away - if you want to go to the group or wing then you will have to go through group/wing logistics I would think - at least that is where I would start.
Title: Re: Squadron phone & internet
Post by: arajca on December 02, 2012, 06:34:58 AM
Actually, you'd need to start with group/wing IT.

If the unit has the funds and the bill is the same each month, they can set up a recurring payment with wing finance so they don't have to send the bill in each month.
Title: Re: Squadron phone & internet
Post by: a2capt on December 02, 2012, 06:43:46 AM
Why would Group/Wing IT need to get involved?

Want service? Figure out how it's 'going to be paid for. Order it.

(Presuming that it's an option, with the units lease on the meeting place)
Title: Re: Squadron phone & internet
Post by: arajca on December 02, 2012, 07:11:09 AM
It was in response to contacting Logistics, not necessarily in general, although my wing IT has said they'll help any unit that wants internet at their meeting place.
Title: Re: Squadron phone & internet
Post by: okeecap on December 02, 2012, 02:19:27 PM
Thank you. ;D
Title: Re: Squadron phone & internet
Post by: A.Member on December 02, 2012, 03:35:44 PM
If you don't want to go through Wing, it will have to be set up as someone's individual account.  Only the Wing CC can enter into contracts for CAP.
Title: Re: Squadron phone & internet
Post by: SARDOC on December 02, 2012, 03:51:49 PM
I just changed the Squadron Phone number to a google voice number.  It's free and rings directly to my cell phone.

When I'm not available I can program it to ring to someone else's number if I need to.
Title: Re: Squadron phone & internet
Post by: wuzafuzz on December 02, 2012, 04:08:10 PM
Quote from: SARDOC on December 02, 2012, 03:51:49 PM
I just changed the Squadron Phone number to a google voice number.  It's free and rings directly to my cell phone.

When I'm not available I can program it to ring to someone else's number if I need to.
Google Voice rocks.  I use it to ring all my phones at once during the work week, and drop my work phone nights and weekends.  It's easy to add and drop additional numbers, so it could be useful for ICP's.  Don't have a hard phone?  No problem, make it ring the cell phones for appropriate mission base folks.  Remove them when needed.
Title: Re: Squadron phone & internet
Post by: JeffDG on December 02, 2012, 04:08:24 PM
Quote from: SARDOC on December 02, 2012, 03:51:49 PM
I just changed the Squadron Phone number to a google voice number.  It's free and rings directly to my cell phone.

When I'm not available I can program it to ring to someone else's number if I need to.
For that matter, set it to ring multiple people right away...CC/CD/etc.  Whoever answers first gets the call!
Title: Re: Squadron phone & internet
Post by: NIN on December 02, 2012, 04:14:49 PM
Except when GV isn't available in your area... :(
Title: Re: Squadron phone & internet
Post by: wuzafuzz on December 02, 2012, 04:42:09 PM
Quote from: NIN on December 02, 2012, 04:14:49 PM
Except when GV isn't available in your area... :(
Is it that GV doesn't have numbers in your area code, or is it completely unavailable for some reason?  I didn't realize it isn't available everywhere in the U.S.  Bummer.
Title: Re: Squadron phone & internet
Post by: wuzafuzz on December 02, 2012, 04:46:26 PM
Speaking of Internet, what are squadrons without permanent meeting places doing for Internet connectivity?  My squadron is one of the largest in the country, but without a permanent meeting place we depend on members' smart phones, air cards, etc for our connection to The Matrix.  That can be a real stinker at SAREX's and missions.
Title: Re: Squadron phone & internet
Post by: NIN on December 02, 2012, 04:52:56 PM
Quote from: wuzafuzz on December 02, 2012, 04:42:09 PM
Quote from: NIN on December 02, 2012, 04:14:49 PM
Except when GV isn't available in your area... :(
Is it that GV doesn't have numbers in your area code, or is it completely unavailable for some reason?  I didn't realize it isn't available everywhere in the U.S.  Bummer.

Nope. My entire state is without GV due to having no GV #s in this area code.  I have a GV # from an adjoining state. 
Title: Re: Squadron phone & internet
Post by: Eclipse on December 02, 2012, 05:03:37 PM
Quote from: wuzafuzz on December 02, 2012, 04:46:26 PM
Speaking of Internet, what are squadrons without permanent meeting places doing for Internet connectivity?  My squadron is one of the largest in the country, but without a permanent meeting place we depend on members' smart phones, air cards, etc for our connection to The Matrix.  That can be a real stinker at SAREX's and missions.

I'm not sure I understand why a mission is different then a meeting in this regard, or why air cards and phones are a bad idea.  In a lot of cases the speeds are faster through a 4G phone then a wired DSL connection.  We've run the operations branches for the last several Evals from a single
Clearspot.

I agree GV rocks, but there are alternatives when its not available.  Does anyone even notice or care about area codes anymore?
Title: Re: Squadron phone & internet
Post by: JeffDG on December 02, 2012, 05:52:50 PM
Quote from: Eclipse on December 02, 2012, 05:03:37 PM
Does anyone even notice or care about area codes anymore?
(http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/cell_number.png)
Title: Re: Squadron phone & internet
Post by: a2capt on December 02, 2012, 06:52:15 PM
With all the bundling of features, the porting of numbers, area code overlays, suburbs having different area codes, the area code has just become another three digits.

"Long Distance" charges? Pah. Where there is no area code split or overlay, you may find no GV and similar services offering numbers, so what. Who actually pays long distance anymore? Very few. The few that do, I wouldn't even be surprised if statistically, they use the phone even less an are not involved in much dealing outside of their locality.

Hardly even that, it wouldn't be the first time they had to dial somewhere else to call someone.

It's also easier to publish a GV number and direct it where it needs to go, vs. putting ones own actual mobile number on a list. Granted, when you call outward the caller ID will reveal your number unless you take measures to call via the GV pipe or block your ID.  But.. when you're done with that activity, you can cancel the call routing and move on.

Like I setup for an encampment last year, a "vanity" number that included the wing abbreviation and that routed calls to us, on call, so that parents could get in contact with a cadet in an emergency, and we could share the duty much like CQ, and when it was done, it all goes away.

Even if you have a physical phone installed, or dedicated. Use a GV for the published number and you can be more flexible.

The only thing I really wish is that there was a way do distinquish the incoming calls on the GV number, so you know the source. You can make the caller ID show you either the caller or your GV #, but if you want to see who's actually calling..  Perhaps if the "name" part of it would show "Google Voice" and the the actual number...

Though most cell phones and fewer landline phones don't seem to support the name portion of the ID. Especially cordless handsets.
Title: Re: Squadron phone & internet
Post by: Eclipse on December 02, 2012, 06:56:23 PM
We have a fair number of units doing this for their "contact" number. 
The transcribed emails from voice messages are nice as well.  I use that as my main voice may on my cell phone, and my GV number.

I'll generally use my GV number for missions - that way, even if cell service is down, I still get an email notification that I missed a call,
and can even return it through my PC.  Its not uncommon to be in a hangar, 3rd floor basement, or rural area where the cell sites don't
connect, but the land-line internet is still working.
Title: Re: Squadron phone & internet
Post by: wuzafuzz on December 02, 2012, 11:30:13 PM
Quote from: Eclipse on December 02, 2012, 05:03:37 PM
Quote from: wuzafuzz on December 02, 2012, 04:46:26 PM
Speaking of Internet, what are squadrons without permanent meeting places doing for Internet connectivity?  My squadron is one of the largest in the country, but without a permanent meeting place we depend on members' smart phones, air cards, etc for our connection to The Matrix.  That can be a real stinker at SAREX's and missions.

I'm not sure I understand why a mission is different then a meeting in this regard, or why air cards and phones are a bad idea.  In a lot of cases the speeds are faster through a 4G phone then a wired DSL connection.  We've run the operations branches for the last several Evals from a single
Clearspot.

In my case our meeting place is relatively stable, but is located on a university campus with no airport nearby.  Of course they mission planners prefer to run missions and exercises out of airports.  Being gypsies we sometimes discover we are running a mission or eval out of a facility with lousy cell service.  Then there are the times we run out of a loaned building on an AFB, only to discover the building is a Faraday cage.  Even if we operate in a place with good data coverage, the members with wireless hotspots don't always share.  Or they go home.  A more reliable solution is a goal of mine.

So, I'm curious if anyone runs squadron owned air cards. or even fancier connections.  I've thought of various solutions like running an air card on a mast feeding a router, a wipipe, or something similar.  Some folks might be running long distance WiFi shots.  Anything that helps in weak coverage areas.
Title: Re: Squadron phone & internet
Post by: Eclipse on December 03, 2012, 12:50:11 AM
Yes - we've run the encampment the last few years on on my personal Clearspot which is a 4G hotspot that supports either 5 or 8 users
our of the box (I can never remember).  It's a gen-1 WiPipe so it has the advantage / disadvantage of having a removable USG dongle
as its broadband connection.  The buildings are specifically hardened for EMI & RFI, so cell phone coverage is spotty at best.

To counter this the Clearspot is mounted to the wall (with 3M Command tapes) near a window on whatever side of the building has the strongest signal, and then we use a USB extension cord and mount the USB dongle on the outside of the building (usually wrapped in a Ziplock bag).  This has worked well in the past few years. 

I've used the same device for several SAREvals, and a number of other folks on staff have MiFi's, etc.  Most / alot of people have phones that turn in to access points as well.

The use limitation can be negated by either using another router that does wireless bridging, or one that has a USB slot for a cell dongle.
That of turn an old PC into a bridge and access point.
Title: Re: Squadron phone & internet
Post by: Spaceman3750 on December 03, 2012, 04:01:15 AM
Go talk to a Verizon Wireless corporate store and ask about setting up a government account. My unit recently did that and they cut us a really good deal given the current climate of mobile data...

Don't forget that the Wing King has to sign the contract, you can't do that on your own.
Title: Re: Squadron phone & internet
Post by: Майор Хаткевич on December 03, 2012, 04:12:32 AM
Aren't wing kings no longer corporate officers?
Title: Re: Squadron phone & internet
Post by: Eclipse on December 03, 2012, 04:26:50 AM
Quote from: usafaux2004 on December 03, 2012, 04:12:32 AM
Aren't wing kings no longer corporate officers?

I was going to say the same thing, AFAIK all contracts have to go to NHQ now.    I remember seeing some kind of clarification
letter that granted them interim rights for $X purchasing authority, and they just came out with a new contracting and acquisition
reg (but I didn't see anything in there about that).

Considering the long-term costs and potential cancellation fees that Verizon and others love so much, your best bet is probably either:
"Pay as you go / month to month." then just request reimbursement as it is used or monthly.

Or contract the phone yourself and just request reimbursement.
Title: Re: Squadron phone & internet
Post by: Eclipse on December 03, 2012, 11:57:25 PM
I just asked about hotspots and pay-as-you-go cellular services in regards to mission reimbursements.

The answer was that as long it could be clearly demonstrated that the service was specifically used for the respective mission,
then the cost would be eligible for reimbursement as mission communications cost.

Of course make sure you ask locally before spending any money.
Title: Re: Squadron phone & internet
Post by: SarDragon on December 04, 2012, 12:07:02 AM
Also, for exercises, make sure the comm costs are budgeted up front in the Ops Plan. I almost got burned earlier in the year because we used more ground resources than planned, and it wasn't in the budget. Since we didn't use all the allocated flight hours, there was enough money to pay for the ground ops.
Title: Re: Squadron phone & internet
Post by: Eclipse on December 04, 2012, 12:16:31 AM
Very important.  Money not budgeted is very likely to come out of the wing's corporate funds, which are in short supply these days, assuming
the member isn't just "stuck".

In fact we have to move away from the WAGs of years past.  A message was sent out recently to the ops folks in my Region that
108s in excess of budgeted dollars may not be reimbursed.