Why are we cadets not allowed to wear the flight suit? I believe cadets should be alllowed to wear it if they wish to pay the cost.
Quote from: nathan88 on April 12, 2012, 08:06:57 PM
Why are we cadets not allowed to wear the flight suit? I believe cadets should be alllowed to wear it if they wish to pay the cost.
Outside of the odd flight academy and O rides, what flying activity do cadets participate in?
Not very many but it would be nice to look more USAF AUXILLARY like
I think you will find the answer to your question in the first part of your response.
Welcome to CAP Talk.
Quote from: nathan88 on April 12, 2012, 08:10:47 PM
Not very many but it would be nice to look more USAF AUXILLARY like
C'mon...just say it. You want to look like a pilot and strut around in a flight suit. Dont try to pass it off like its for the better of the program!
Very true Colonel however it would be a good recruiting tool
It would be nice to look like a pilot but I guess a flight suit really isnt needed for cadets yall senior members are lucky!
Quote from: nathan88 on April 12, 2012, 08:18:32 PM
It would be nice to look like a pilot but I guess a flight suit really isnt needed for cadets yall senior members are lucky!
Don't rush things. You will be old one day wondering where your youth went, too!
Quote from: Flying Pig on April 12, 2012, 08:15:37 PM
Quote from: nathan88 on April 12, 2012, 08:10:47 PM
Not very many but it would be nice to look more USAF AUXILLARY like
C'mon...just say it. You want to look like a pilot and strut around in a flight suit. Dont try to pass it off like its for the better of the program!
If this weren't a G-rated forum, I would tell you what my brigade commander asked us right after we were issued flight suits in flight school. It was funny.
Quote from: nathan88 on April 12, 2012, 08:18:32 PM
It would be nice to look like a pilot but I guess a flight suit really isnt isn't needed for cadets yall y'all (though, you all is better.) senior members are lucky!
First CapTalk lesson: proper grammar. I FTFY.
Quote from: nathan88 on April 12, 2012, 08:06:57 PM
Why are we cadets not allowed to wear the flight suit? I believe cadets should be alllowed to wear it if they wish to pay the cost.
Cadets
over 18 who are fight crew rated may wear the USAF-style flight suit.
Quote from: Eclipse on April 12, 2012, 08:26:31 PM
Quote from: nathan88 on April 12, 2012, 08:06:57 PM
Why are we cadets not allowed to wear the flight suit? I believe cadets should be alllowed to wear it if they wish to pay the cost.
Cadets over 18 who are fight crew rated may wear the USAF-style flight suit.
So cadets who are under 18 and undergoing flight training, have soloed, etc, can not? If that's what you're saying, can you site that please? If that's the case, then I know of a few problems that need to be corrected...
Quote from: Woodsy on April 12, 2012, 08:30:37 PM
Quote from: Eclipse on April 12, 2012, 08:26:31 PM
Quote from: nathan88 on April 12, 2012, 08:06:57 PM
Why are we cadets not allowed to wear the flight suit? I believe cadets should be alllowed to wear it if they wish to pay the cost.
Cadets over 18 who are fight crew rated may wear the USAF-style flight suit.
So cadets who are under 18 and undergoing flight training, have soloed, etc, can not? If that's what you're saying, can you site that please? If that's the case, then I know of a few problems that need to be corrected...
39-1 states that flight suits are for aircrew only. Since you have to be at least 18 to participate in aircrew training, only 18+ cadets can wear the flight suit.
Edit to add: With the above in mind, under the previous revision of 39-1 that, as I recall, did not have the flight crew limitation on the flight suit, non 18+ cadets who had soloed could wear the flight suit. At least in my squadron they could, as long as you had some form of aeronautical rating, even just solo wings. So there is certainly precedent for cadets under 18 wearing a flight suit.
Quote from: jeders on April 12, 2012, 08:46:15 PM
Quote from: Woodsy on April 12, 2012, 08:30:37 PM
Quote from: Eclipse on April 12, 2012, 08:26:31 PM
Quote from: nathan88 on April 12, 2012, 08:06:57 PM
Why are we cadets not allowed to wear the flight suit? I believe cadets should be alllowed to wear it if they wish to pay the cost.
Cadets over 18 who are fight crew rated may wear the USAF-style flight suit.
So cadets who are under 18 and undergoing flight training, have soloed, etc, can not? If that's what you're saying, can you site that please? If that's the case, then I know of a few problems that need to be corrected...
39-1 states that flight suits are for aircrew only. Since you have to be at least 18 to participate in aircrew training, only 18+ cadets can wear the flight suit.
Aren't the folks flying the plane "aircrew" regardless of ES vs. non-ES context?
That was my original reasoning, but that's not what 39-1 says.
CHAPTER 2 – USAF-STYLE UNIFORMS (SENIOR MEMBERS AND CADETS)
2-1. General Information.
d. Flight Crew members wearing the Air Force flight suit may make only essential stops en route to and from the duty performance site. If a stop is essential, members must meet the proper standards of neatness, cleanliness, and military image.
Also see Table 2-4. Men's and Women's Flight Suit
Figure 2-19. Men's and Women's Green Flight Suit and Green Flight Jacket (Flight Crews Only)
Notes: 7. Cadet members do not wear grade insignia or C.A.P. cutouts on the flight suit or jacket.
Figure 4-4. Men's and Women's CAP Blue Flight Suit and Blue Flight Jacket (Flight Crews Only)
Notes: 7. Cadet members do not wear grade insignia or C.A.P. cutouts on the flight suit.
A cadet undergoing flight training >is< flight crew, so I'd say they are authorized for any cadet who fits the above definition.
Whoever said you all is better than yall should take a visit to the great state of georgia and learn to talk like a southerner, although SOME yankees are pretty cool
Quote from: Spaceman3750 on April 12, 2012, 08:49:10 PM
Aren't the folks flying the plane "aircrew" regardless of ES vs. non-ES context?
Sorry, I miss quoted aircrew, it should have been flight crew. I was mostly just expanding on Eclipse's earlier statement in response to yours. In my mind, if you are training for or have earned a military, CAP, or FAA aeronautical rating, you are entitled to wear the flight suit in appropriate situations. To the OP, however, if you have earned the rating and the squadron leadership says everyone in BDUs, not flight suits, then you wear BDUs.
Quote from: nathan88 on April 12, 2012, 08:52:49 PM
Whoever said you all is better than yall should take a visit to the great state of georgia and learn to talk like a southerner, although SOME yankees are pretty cool
This isn't the great state of Georgia. It's CAPTalk. Welcome to the forum... from a non-southerner.
Quote from: nathan88 on April 12, 2012, 08:52:49 PM
Whoever said you all is better than yall should take a visit to the great state of georgia and learn to talk like a southerner, although SOME yankees are pretty cool
I've lived in the south the majority of my life. Where you are from is no excuse for bad grammar and slang. Using things like "Southerner," "Yankee," and any other term is crass. Not only that, it divids us from what we truly are; Americans.
Welcome to Captalk.
Edit: Accidently a word.
Flight suits should only be worn while going to, coming from, or participating in a flight, as a member of an AIRCREW. wearing it at any other time is inapropriate.
sorry guys didnt mean to offend anyone its just sometimes i feel pro southern sorry ill try to let my personal opinions not get the better of me and by the way GO USA!
Quote from: nathan88 on April 12, 2012, 09:35:42 PM
sorry guys didnt mean to offend anyone its just sometimes i feel pro southern sorry ill try to let my personal opinions not get the better of me and by the way GO USA!
I suppose there's nothing wrong with some Southern pride (as long as it's for normal reasons), but then wouldn't you capitalize 'Georgia'?
Quote from: Extremepredjudice on April 12, 2012, 09:09:59 PM
Edit: Accidently a word.
Ahem.
Accidentally, that is.
"Y'all" is no better than "you all." "You" works just fine in every context, y'all. And don't get me started on "yinz," that Pittsburgh colloquialism.
It pays not to criticize the language of others when professional editors are members of CAP and, for entertainment, sometimes enjoy tweaking others who correct others, then make mistakes themselves. Something about the pot and kettle, or maybe leadership by example, or maybe just a little humility.
Generally, yes, northerners are pretty cool. They're darned near frigid for a few months they call "winter," but they're not bad. Being one myself (northeast Ohio native), I should know. "Yankees," on the other hand, are a scourge that lands in Tampa for spring training every year. When they go back to Noo Yawk for the regular season, good riddance.
Yes, I'm in Florida, and no, I'm not a senior citizen. Tampa Bay area, right on the water (as opposed to inland with the native southerners). And if you're going to call me a Yankee, that's
Colonel Carpetbagger to you, bucko.
Quote from: MSG Mac on April 12, 2012, 09:10:14 PM
Flight suits should only be worn while going to, coming from, or participating in a flight, as a member of an AIRCREW. wearing it at any other time is inapropriate.
Okay....then BDU's should only be worn while going to, comming from,or particpaing in Ground Team Operatiions as a member of a GROUND TEAM. Wearing them at any other times is inapropriate.
Sounds silly doesn't.
Sorry to jump on you......but let's leave it up the respective chains of command to determine when a particular uniform is appropriate.
Quote from: lordmonar on April 13, 2012, 07:07:21 AM
Quote from: MSG Mac on April 12, 2012, 09:10:14 PM
Flight suits should only be worn while going to, coming from, or participating in a flight, as a member of an AIRCREW. wearing it at any other time is inapropriate.
Okay....then BDU's should only be worn while going to, comming from,or particpaing in Ground Team Operatiions as a member of a GROUND TEAM. Wearing them at any other times is inapropriate.
Sounds silly doesn't.
Sorry to jump on you......but let's leave it up the respective chains of command to determine when a particular uniform is appropriate.
It would, but for regs. I'll look up the cite tomorrow.
Eclipse already posted the cite.
Quote from: Eclipse on April 12, 2012, 08:50:16 PM
That was my original reasoning, but that's not what 39-1 says.
CHAPTER 2 – USAF-STYLE UNIFORMS (SENIOR MEMBERS AND CADETS)
2-1. General Information.
d. Flight Crew members wearing the Air Force flight suit may make only essential stops en route to and from the duty performance site. If a stop is essential, members must meet the proper standards of neatness, cleanliness, and military image.
Also see Table 2-4. Men's and Women's Flight Suit
Figure 2-19. Men's and Women's Green Flight Suit and Green Flight Jacket (Flight Crews Only)
Notes: 7. Cadet members do not wear grade insignia or C.A.P. cutouts on the flight suit or jacket.
Figure 4-4. Men's and Women's CAP Blue Flight Suit and Blue Flight Jacket (Flight Crews Only)
Notes: 7. Cadet members do not wear grade insignia or C.A.P. cutouts on the flight suit.
A cadet undergoing flight training >is< flight crew, so I'd say they are authorized for any cadet who fits the above definition.
Quote from: RogueLeader on April 13, 2012, 07:10:46 AM
Quote from: lordmonar on April 13, 2012, 07:07:21 AM
Quote from: MSG Mac on April 12, 2012, 09:10:14 PM
Flight suits should only be worn while going to, coming from, or participating in a flight, as a member of an AIRCREW. wearing it at any other time is inapropriate.
Okay....then BDU's should only be worn while going to, comming from,or particpaing in Ground Team Operatiions as a member of a GROUND TEAM. Wearing them at any other times is inapropriate.
Sounds silly doesn't.
Sorry to jump on you......but let's leave it up the respective chains of command to determine when a particular uniform is appropriate.
It would, but for regs. I'll look up the cite tomorrow.
It only says "aircrew only".......it does not say anything about "while going to/from and engaged in flight activities". So you can argue that you can only wear it while flying.....or you can argue that you have to be an aircrew member....and since that is not defined anywhere....it is up to interpetation.......ergo......up to the chain of command.
Quote from: lordmonar on April 13, 2012, 07:18:35 AM
It only says "aircrew only".......it does not say anything about "while going to/from and engaged in flight activities". So you can argue that you can only wear it while flying.....or you can argue that you have to be an aircrew member....and since that is not defined anywhere....it is up to interpetation.......ergo......up to the chain of command.
Is there a chain of command that has a need to control their volunteers to that extent? I would see that as a command failure...
Let me point out that you suggested it's only while flying....walking to the airplane isn't that different than driving to the airport, is it? You're not engaged in a flight activity.
Hmmm....reading more - I'll also note that the travel restriction mentioned above only applies to the AF green flight suit. There is no similar restriction for the CAP blue flight suit. Flight suits of either type are restricted to flight crews.
If a cadet were to wear one on an o-flight, I probably would not question it, but it would be a large expense to buy a uniform for just an occasional flight. I think it was $75 when I priced out a cotton blue flight suit with all the insignia and thats about the least expensive you can go.
Also, there is the never-resolved issue of what is a "flight suit" and what is a "utility suit" since the cut and colour are identical.
Cadet: Believe me, one day you'll be sitting around with grey hair (if you have any left!) and wondering where the time went. Don't push it.
Quote from: bflynn on April 13, 2012, 12:23:50 PM
Quote from: lordmonar on April 13, 2012, 07:18:35 AM
It only says "aircrew only".......it does not say anything about "while going to/from and engaged in flight activities". So you can argue that you can only wear it while flying.....or you can argue that you have to be an aircrew member....and since that is not defined anywhere....it is up to interpetation.......ergo......up to the chain of command.
Is there a chain of command that has a need to control their volunteers to that extent? I would see that as a command failure...
Let me point out that you suggested it's only while flying....walking to the airplane isn't that different than driving to the airport, is it? You're not engaged in a flight activity.
I think you misunderstood me.
I think that the chain of command can dictate or allow what the "duty" uniform should be.
I was simply pointing out that we here on this board should not be giving sweeping generlisations about what is "inappropriate" or not.
Secondly....if you reread my statement....I did say "going to/from" flight activities....that would cover the drive as well as the walk to the aircraft.
Quote from: CyBorg on April 13, 2012, 01:43:44 PM
Also, there is the never-resolved issue of what is a "flight suit" and what is a "utility suit" since the cut and colour are identical.
Cadet: Believe me, one day you'll be sitting around with grey hair (if you have any left!) and wondering where the time went. Don't push it.
Inside every middle-aged man, there is someone wondering where the time went!
I know this will cause a bunch of hate messages but I think it is silly wearing a flightsuit in a Cessna! You don't see very many general avation pilots dressing up like fighter jocks.
Quote from: 754837 on April 13, 2012, 02:46:34 PM
I know this will cause a bunch of hate messages but I think it is silly wearing a flightsuit in a Cessna! You don't see very many general avation pilots dressing up like fighter jocks.
The Real® Air Force wears flight suits when they fly Cessna aircraft. And you see plenty of general aviation pilots wearing flight suits; EMS helicopter aircrews, flight demonstration teams, and the USCG Auxiliary just to name three.
I will only add to this that those authorized to wear the flight suit cannot wear it as a uniform to functions other than flying. Wearing it to recruit woud only be allowed if manning a booth at a air show or something like that. Nobody can wear it to squadron meetings for example unless they were just flying or about to fly.
Quote from: 41839j on April 13, 2012, 04:28:31 PM
I will only add to this that those authorized to wear the flight suit cannot wear it as a uniform to functions other than flying. Wearing it to recruit woud only be allowed if manning a booth at a air show or something like that. Nobody can wear it to squadron meetings for example unless they were just flying or about to fly.
Says who? Certainly not any nationally published regulation.
Quote from: 41839j on April 13, 2012, 04:28:31 PM
I will only add to this that those authorized to wear the flight suit cannot wear it as a uniform to functions other than flying. Wearing it to recruit woud only be allowed if manning a booth at a air show or something like that. Nobody can wear it to squadron meetings for example unless they were just flying or about to fly.
Then you'd end up de-uniforming many of the senior squadrons in CAP.
I was a member of one of those
flying clubs units. When the members (mostly pilots) bothered to wear a uniform that was what was worn, flying or not.
For the green AF flight suit, CAP 39-1 says it, I suspect based on AF requirements. It's posted higher in the thread.
For the blue CAP flight suit, there is no guidance that I know of. However, custom would dictate that it's only worn for flying. I would consider recruiting to be an acceptable extension of the custom, especially if you're going to talk up the flying aspect of CAP.
Quote from: bflynn on April 13, 2012, 05:16:29 PM
For the green AF flight suit, CAP 39-1 says it, I suspect based on AF requirements. It's posted higher in the thread.
For the blue CAP flight suit, there is no guidance that I know of. However, custom would dictate that it's only worn for flying. I would consider recruiting to be an acceptable extension of the custom, especially if you're going to talk up the flying aspect of CAP.
39-1 only says "aircrew only".....it does not say anything about "aircrew only while participating in aviation acitivities".
Quote from: lordmonar on April 13, 2012, 05:42:44 PM
Quote from: bflynn on April 13, 2012, 05:16:29 PM
For the green AF flight suit, CAP 39-1 says it, I suspect based on AF requirements. It's posted higher in the thread.
For the blue CAP flight suit, there is no guidance that I know of. However, custom would dictate that it's only worn for flying. I would consider recruiting to be an acceptable extension of the custom, especially if you're going to talk up the flying aspect of CAP.
39-1 only says "aircrew only".....it does not say anything about "aircrew only while participating in aviation acitivities".
Actually, nowhere in CAPM 39-1 does it say "aircrew only." What it says is "Flight Crew only." I know it is a subtle difference, but I think there is a difference. I know others disagree, but when I read it in context, especially with paragraph 2-1d, that the intent is that it is authorized for flight crew duties only.
Upon seeing a member in an AF style flight suit -
Citizen: "What kind of aircraft are you flying, Ace?"
Member: "Well, I am a crewman on a Skylane."
CAWG requires their aircrews to wear the Nomex flightsuit for burn protection. While it may seem silly to see a crew in flightsuits to you, as you may recall, the bulk of our ES flying is 1000 agl (with occasional pop-downs to 500 agl for a peek). Much more dangerous than your average plane cruising at the MEA.
I'll stick with the Nomex...
Quote from: CAPR 39-1
CHAPTER 2 – USAF-STYLE UNIFORMS (SENIOR MEMBERS AND CADETS)
2-1. General Information.
d. Flight Crew members wearing the Air Force flight suit may make only essential stops en route to and from the duty performance site. If a stop is essential, members must meet the proper standards of neatness, cleanliness, and military image.
Quote from: lordmonar on April 13, 2012, 05:42:44 PM
Quote from: bflynn on April 13, 2012, 05:16:29 PM
For the green AF flight suit, CAP 39-1 says it, I suspect based on AF requirements. It's posted higher in the thread.
For the blue CAP flight suit, there is no guidance that I know of. However, custom would dictate that it's only worn for flying. I would consider recruiting to be an acceptable extension of the custom, especially if you're going to talk up the flying aspect of CAP.
39-1 only says "aircrew only".....it does not say anything about "aircrew only while participating in aviation acitivities".
"It" is when wear is authorized. It was posted on an earlier page in this thread.
The AF green flight suit is authorized only for flying and traveling to/from the activity. A brief stop is permissible, but appearance standards apply. So, it is not authorized for recruiting.
There is no corresponding regulation for the Blue flight suit.
Quote from: CyBorg on April 13, 2012, 05:06:10 PM
Quote from: 41839j on April 13, 2012, 04:28:31 PM
I will only add to this that those authorized to wear the flight suit cannot wear it as a uniform to functions other than flying. Wearing it to recruit woud only be allowed if manning a booth at a air show or something like that. Nobody can wear it to squadron meetings for example unless they were just flying or about to fly.
Then you'd end up de-uniforming many of the senior squadrons in CAP.
I was a member of one of those flying clubs units. When the members (mostly pilots) bothered to wear a uniform that was what was worn, flying or not.
+1
While I may only be a cadet, I do know just how much seniors
love their flight suits. I have seen multiple senior members wear it at squadron meetings, no problem. I myself own one, but I can't really wear it. It is a good uniform for recruiting, and I feel as though it shouldn't be limited to flightcrew(Aircrew? Eh, whatever). ;D
Quote from: FlyTiger77 on April 13, 2012, 02:36:02 PM
Quote from: CyBorg on April 13, 2012, 01:43:44 PM
Also, there is the never-resolved issue of what is a "flight suit" and what is a "utility suit" since the cut and colour are identical.
Cadet: Believe me, one day you'll be sitting around with grey hair (if you have any left!) and wondering where the time went. Don't push it.
Inside every middle-aged man, there is someone wondering where the time went!
I just had an conversation where I made a comment about an incident at work. I told a guy "Last year or the year before.....yada yada" Ended up the even I was referring to was more than 7 yrs ago. Feels like it just happened. I just hit 15 yrs in police work and I still remember graduating from the academy like it was last weekend. The fun in life isnt getting to the goal. Youll find once you get there that the work it took to get there was actually the fun part but you were to busy to realize it.
Quote from: bflynn on April 13, 2012, 06:48:56 PM
Quote from: CAPR 39-1
CHAPTER 2 – USAF-STYLE UNIFORMS (SENIOR MEMBERS AND CADETS)
2-1. General Information.
d. Flight Crew members wearing the Air Force flight suit may make only essential stops en route to and from the duty performance site. If a stop is essential, members must meet the proper standards of neatness, cleanliness, and military image.
Quote from: lordmonar on April 13, 2012, 05:42:44 PM
Quote from: bflynn on April 13, 2012, 05:16:29 PM
For the green AF flight suit, CAP 39-1 says it, I suspect based on AF requirements. It's posted higher in the thread.
For the blue CAP flight suit, there is no guidance that I know of. However, custom would dictate that it's only worn for flying. I would consider recruiting to be an acceptable extension of the custom, especially if you're going to talk up the flying aspect of CAP.
39-1 only says "aircrew only".....it does not say anything about "aircrew only while participating in aviation acitivities".
"It" is when wear is authorized. It was posted on an earlier page in this thread.
The AF green flight suit is authorized only for flying and traveling to/from the activity. A brief stop is permissible, but appearance standards apply. So, it is not authorized for recruiting.
There is no corresponding regulation for the Blue flight suit.
This is my understanding of the issue. However, an exception was made last year at the EAA Convention/Airventure in Oshkosh where we had a recruiting booth. They did want at least one pilot on duty there to talk to the folks and they did want the pilots in the Nomex suit. That was a decision made at the wing level, but for the green nomex they were very picky about appearance with weight restrictions as well as haircuts. Nobody in this wing wears the nomex suits to any function outside of flying to the best of my knowledge.
Quote from: bflynn on April 13, 2012, 06:48:56 PM
Quote from: CAPR 39-1
CHAPTER 2 – USAF-STYLE UNIFORMS (SENIOR MEMBERS AND CADETS)
2-1. General Information.
d. Flight Crew members wearing the Air Force flight suit may make only essential stops en route to and from the duty performance site. If a stop is essential, members must meet the proper standards of neatness, cleanliness, and military image.
Quote from: lordmonar on April 13, 2012, 05:42:44 PM
Quote from: bflynn on April 13, 2012, 05:16:29 PM
For the green AF flight suit, CAP 39-1 says it, I suspect based on AF requirements. It's posted higher in the thread.
For the blue CAP flight suit, there is no guidance that I know of. However, custom would dictate that it's only worn for flying. I would consider recruiting to be an acceptable extension of the custom, especially if you're going to talk up the flying aspect of CAP.
39-1 only says "aircrew only".....it does not say anything about "aircrew only while participating in aviation acitivities".
"It" is when wear is authorized. It was posted on an earlier page in this thread.
The AF green flight suit is authorized only for flying and traveling to/from the activity. A brief stop is permissible, but appearance standards apply. So, it is not authorized for recruiting.
There is no corresponding regulation for the Blue flight suit.
KB article on the subject.
http://capnhq.custhelp.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/1551/kw/flight%20suit (http://capnhq.custhelp.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/1551/kw/flight%20suit)
and here:
http://capnhq.custhelp.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/990 (http://capnhq.custhelp.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/990)
Both clarify that the "duty performance site" does not necessarily imply "place at which you will operate/maintain an aircraft as part of a flight crew."
If you are a flight crew member and your commander OK's the uniform it can be worn to CAP activities.
I still wish there would be a clarification as to why the flight cap can be worn with one set of blue coveralls but not another, when they are identical in everything but fabric.
I wear those quite frequently and wish I had a decent hat to wear with it.
As a Squadron Commander I encouraged the Cadets who had soloed (and earned the honor of wearing the flight suit) to wear them every time we were wearing BDUs at a regular meeting (of course, everyone wore the 'blues' together, and they wore BDUs with the rest of us when we were out serving the community). Wearing the flight suit was to serve as encouragement and inspiration to the younger Cadets, and it works very well. The caveat I would tell the 'flight suit' Cadet was that the first time I saw them acting arrogant or otherwise innapropriately, that would be the last time they were allowed to wear the suit around the Squadron. This also worked very well, and I have never had any problems with Cadets' flight suit wear.
P.S.>I had the same rules for the Blue Beret, and it worked equally as well.
Quote from: CyBorg on April 13, 2012, 05:06:10 PM
Then you'd end up de-uniforming many of the senior squadrons in CAP.
I was a member of one of those flying clubs units. When the members (mostly pilots) bothered to wear a uniform that was what was worn, flying or not.
Roger that. I am sure we could share some crazy stories about Senior Squadrons. 8)
I think getting the flightsuit solves the issue of getting ABU's, having really piss-poor uniforms, keeps us looking like the USAF while not looking like a special forces/boy scout program, and the replacement flight suit isn't expected to be created and authorized for wear until a few years from now.
Quote from: Littleguy on April 14, 2012, 09:39:04 PM
I think getting the flightsuit solves the issue of getting ABU's, having really piss-poor uniforms, keeps us looking like the USAF while not looking like a special forces/boy scout program, and the replacement flight suit isn't expected to be created and authorized for wear until a few years from now.
YGBSM!
Nomex flight suits are expensive! They run more than twice the cost of a set of BDUs or ABUs. They are not as comfortable, the pockets are in the wrong places for wear in a non-sitting environment, and they are not all that sturdy in a utility environment.
The cotton/poly-cotton coveralls have some of the same limitations (comfort and pockets), and the one piece "feature" makes other aspects of wear inconvenient, too.
Just say no!
Quote from: SarDragon on April 14, 2012, 11:14:25 PM
Quote from: Littleguy on April 14, 2012, 09:39:04 PM
I think getting the flightsuit solves the issue of getting ABU's, having really piss-poor uniforms, keeps us looking like the USAF while not looking like a special forces/boy scout program, and the replacement flight suit isn't expected to be created and authorized for wear until a few years from now.
YGBSM!
Nomex flight suits are expensive! They run more than twice the cost of a set of BDUs or ABUs. They are not as comfortable, the pockets are in the wrong places for wear in a non-sitting environment, and they are not all that sturdy in a utility environment.
The cotton/poly-cotton coveralls have some of the same limitations (comfort and pockets), and the one piece "feature" makes other aspects of wear inconvenient, too.
Just say no!
They are expensive, the pockets are not all that great on the lower section, and they may not be as sturdy, and using the head is a huge hassle, I'll give you that. They may also be impractical for young kids growing up, too. As a matter of fact, scratch the idea. The BDU's are practical for most things, I just hate full color patches on a camouflage uniform.
Quote from: nathan88 on April 12, 2012, 09:35:42 PM
sorry guys didnt mean to offend anyone its just sometimes i feel pro southern sorry ill try to let my personal opinions not get the better of me and by the way GO USA!
How about taking the idea to your commander and asking him. Justify why it would be important and you may be surprised...
Certainly flight suits are for flying activities, but your squadron could have a ground-based activity that could justify wearing flight suites as a special reward or incentive....say flight simulator training or some other aviation related thing that has the endorsement of your leadership.
I'm an AEO and I use the flight simulator a lot to reach cadets. I've also encouraged cadets to wear flight suits, with the commander's approval. When they wear flight suits during that training, it gives them a different sense of reality even though they never leave the ground.