Logged in to do some research this morning for work and found this background as the Bing Main Page. That is a CAP aircraft (rust red color). I will find the info on it as well.
I think they are part of the ceiling display at the Steven F. Udvar-Hazy Center at Dulles.
How do you know it's a CAP aircraft? There are no markings on it at all.
Every time someone uses Bing, a kitten cries...
It's a Fairchild 24W the Museum of Flight, in Seattle.
http://www.museumofflight.org/aircraft/fairchild-24w (http://www.museumofflight.org/aircraft/fairchild-24w)
Quote from: capmaj on December 17, 2011, 12:33:49 PM
I think they are part of the ceiling display at the Steven F. Udvar-Hazy Center at Dulles.
Nope. Wrong ceiling. SFU-H has a metal roof. Glass won't handle the amount of snow that DC gets.
Again, how do we know this is a CAP plane?
This one in particular may not have been used by CAP, but Fairchild 24's were used by CAP.
http://www.cap-ny153.org/apps/photos/photo?photoid=72451608 (http://www.cap-ny153.org/apps/photos/photo?photoid=72451608)
Quote from: Chief2009 on December 18, 2011, 12:37:31 AM
This one in particular may not have been used by CAP, but Fairchild 24's were used by CAP.
http://www.cap-ny153.org/apps/photos/photo?photoid=72451608 (http://www.cap-ny153.org/apps/photos/photo?photoid=72451608)
Cessna 182s are being used. Random 182 doesn't equal CAP Plane. Ditto with the Fairchild.
I never said they weren't. While it is nice to see an aircraft in a museum, I want to know why CapHistorian characterized it is a "CAP aircraft"
Me thinks the young cadet should lose the attitude when addressing a highly accomplished CAP member such as Lt Col Shaw.
Quote from: Extremepredjudice on December 18, 2011, 12:46:40 AM
Quote from: Chief2009 on December 18, 2011, 12:37:31 AM
This one in particular may not have been used by CAP, but Fairchild 24's were used by CAP.
http://www.cap-ny153.org/apps/photos/photo?photoid=72451608 (http://www.cap-ny153.org/apps/photos/photo?photoid=72451608)
Cessna 182s are being used. Random 182 doesn't equal CAP Plane. Ditto with the Fairchild.
I never said they weren't. While it is nice to see an aircraft in a museum, I want to know why CapHistorian characterized it is a "CAP aircraft"
Here's the poop on that aricraft
QuoteThe Museum's F-24 was built in Hagerstown, Maryland in early 1941 and purchased by famous ventriloquist Edgar Bergan. Bergan sold the plane to the president of a Spokane radio station and it was acquired for Army use in 1943. After the war, it flew with many private owners until it was purchased and restored by Ragnar Pettersson in 1981. Pettersson donated the F-24 to the Museum in 1985.
Acquired for Army use could be CAP.
The linked article provided some provenance, and I'm sure LtCol Shaw will provide us with the results of any further research.
Quote from: Eclipse on December 17, 2011, 01:09:34 PM
Every time someone uses Bing, a kitten cries...
Hahaha
Quote from: EMT-83 on December 18, 2011, 01:21:09 AM
Me thinks the young cadet should lose the attitude when addressing a highly accomplished CAP member such as Lt Col Shaw.
I don't have attitude. I am just requesting his sources.
Army isn't CAP. Nowhere does the article mention CAP. I think they'd put that in there.
Quote from: Extremepredjudice on December 18, 2011, 01:56:49 AM
Quote from: EMT-83 on December 18, 2011, 01:21:09 AM
Me thinks the young cadet should lose the attitude when addressing a highly accomplished CAP member such as Lt Col Shaw.
I don't have attitude. I am just requesting his sources.
Army isn't CAP. Nowhere does the article mention CAP. I think they'd put that in there.
"Army isn't CAP" .... methinks that someone needs to look at the beginnings of our organization and see from whence we came ;)
Our parent organization was, for a while, the Army. We still weren't members of the army, as we aren't members of the air force. We are the USAF AUX. They'd drop the Auxiliary part if we were part of the air force.
Unless, sir, you want to say we are part of the Air Force, which means CAP officers can order around USAF personnel. I think it has been established we can't and rightly so.
Quote from: Extremepredjudice on December 18, 2011, 05:16:06 AM
Our parent organization was, for a while, the Army. We still weren't members of the army, as we aren't members of the air force. We are the USAF AUX. They'd drop the Auxiliary part if we were part of the air force.
Unless, sir, you want to say we are part of the Air Force, which means CAP officers can order around USAF personnel. I think it has been established we can't and rightly so.
I think you missed the point....the Civil Air Patrol was under the oversight of the US Army Air Corps. The Army could have bought the plane (s) for service in the Civil Air Patrol. Never intended to imply that Civil Air Patrol members were either considered to be Army and/or Air Force personnel. We have always been the Auxiliary. My comment was directed toward the source of the aircraft.
Quote from: Extremepredjudice on December 18, 2011, 12:46:40 AM
I want to know why CapHistorian characterized it is a "CAP aircraft"
Please see the attached photo of the caption of the picture source. You will also see the tail number of the aircraft listed on the museums description and a snapshot of the tailnumbers CAP has for those aircraft used in CAP during WWII.
Thanks for the challenge, and you really should look a little more into the founding of CAP. There is a link on CAPtalk to a pdf version of the Flying Minute Men.
Would you please post the entire list of CAP aircraft? Based on the limited records that I've found, I've always assumed that these were member-owned. Any records of Army Air Corps or Army Air Force aircraft used by CAP?
KJeep in mind that immediately following World War II, the Army Air Force "loaned" CAP a multitude of aircraft. These were L-4's, L-5's and a few L-21's and even fewer C-45's (twin Beech) These asircraft flown by CAP were still on the Air Force inventory, and the Air Force did all maintenance.. This was back in the days when cadets could qualify as what is now Mission Pilopt and Mission Observer. In fact as a cadet I flew several missions with a cadet observer. Really cool for a teenager to fly an Air Force aircraft carrying Air Force markings.
I'll wait until the good colonel does his research, but for now I think all of you are reaching. If it was used by the CAP in WW II, it would have been owned by a CAP member. For example, the one on display at the Air Force Museum was owned by CAP 1Lt. M.M. Wilder, who was awarded the Air Medal for his service at Coastal Patrol Base 2.
If this was truly an Army aircraft at one time, it's actually a C-61. The Army didn't purchase Fairchild 24s for CAP use in WW II. In 1941, the Army Air Force placed an initial order for 163 Fairchild C-61s, however via Lend-Lease, 161 of these were shipped abroad. Under the auspices of this program, the majority of the 525 Warner Scarab Fairchild 24s/C-61s went to Great Britain. Most of these aircraft saw service as Argus Is and improved Argus IIs and were allocated to a newly formed adjunct of the Royal Air Force (RAF), the Air Transport Auxiliary (ATA). An additional 306 Ranger powered Argus IIIs were also used by the ATA. In British service, the majority of the Argus type operated with the ATA ferrying their aircrew to collect or deliver aircraft to and from manufacturers, Maintenance Units (MU)s and operational bases.
I think this aircraft may have an interesting histior it's own....don't you think?