Looking to get involved with CAP, on whatever level I can.
But I'm trying to select a specialty track, that doesn't require a mountain of time.
I know there are a few. But I'd like some input into this quiry.
Thanks...
Your best bet is to find out what the unit needs, and then look to that pool for a track and staff posting.
For the most part, active members can fulfill the requirements of Specialties, especially at the Tech level, through
basic participation.
Remember that you can do several specialty tracks at the same time.
So....pick something you are intrested in AND pick one that the unit needs....that way both the squadron and your needs are fulfilled.
P.S. Welcome to CAP and CAPTALK!
That's some really good advice.
Pick one where you can actually meet the requirements and progress.
There's no sense in having several open with a NONE rating.
If none of them jump right out at you...I'd say pick Personnel...it's a good way to learn the organization of Civil Air Patrol and support your unit all at the same time. You can advance pretty quickly and you can always change later. YMMV
Also give thought to becoming an "Assistant _____ Officer"
1. You won't have the learn the job on your own.
2. You can take some of the load off from the person who probably has several jobs already.
3. Having to teach someone else should encourage your mentor to go back and review the regs (keeping them up to date as well).
Quote from: wacapgh on November 16, 2011, 10:11:15 PM
Also give thought to becoming an "Assistant _____ Officer"
+1
Don't get the cart before the horse. Get a job (duty position) and then enter the specialty track to learn the job. My pet peeve is members who like to enroll in specialty tracks for the bling but don't bother to contribute to the squadron by working in the specialty.
Quote from: Short Field on November 16, 2011, 11:25:48 PM
Don't get the cart before the horse. Get a job (duty position) and then enter the specialty track to learn the job. My pet peeve is members who like to enroll in specialty tracks for the bling but don't bother to contribute to the squadron by working in the specialty.
How do they progress if they are not in a position helping the squadron. Most Specialty Tracks usually require that you serve in a position for a fixed period of time.
Right...
you are assumig that the squadron commander/pdo doesn't just pencil whipp it off
personally i like the suggestion of personnel...
unless your squadron already has someone in that position who doesn't want to leave it to do something else.
i would do a cartwheel if someone walked into my squadron right now and offered to pick up personnel for 6 months to a year.
Quote from: coudano on November 17, 2011, 03:54:55 AM
personally i like the suggestion of personnel...
unless your squadron already has someone in that position who doesn't want to leave it to do something else.
i would do a cartwheel if someone walked into my squadron right now and offered to pick up personnel for 6 months to a year.
Someone coming in willing to be a team player and help out and picks personnel quickly becomes an MVP in my book. I think its a great way to meet members and learn CAP organization.
I try very hard to chat with prospective seniors on meeting #2 or 3 to get an idea of what they want to do in CAP and what they want to get out of it. That gives me a very good insight into what specialty track they will probably head towards. After they join, I hand them the checklist for Level I and let them have at it and come back next week ready to do your summary conversations.
Once we get through the summary conversations I suggest a couple of specialty track/duty assignments they might be interested in. These are based on the pre-membership conversation and current squadron need. I have them review these and any other specialty track guide they are interested in on the national website while we wait for their LV1 to post in eServices. Usually, I recommend taking a six month track and a one year track - I tried to do the "hard road" of two 1-year tracks and I regretted it.
By the time LV1 has posted, they usually know what they want to do. I confirm this with my CC, we assign them, and I tell them how LV2 works and what they need to get it. I tell them to enroll in OBC immediately as it will quickly become relevant, and try to keep abreast of upcoming SLS dates so they can plan well in advance.
This makes the new member specialty track/duty position selection process seamless and gets seniors off the ground very quickly. It also quietly makes LV2 the rule rather than the exception and means neither I nor my commander have to "force" seniors to do things like SLS, OBC, etc. Then again, maybe I'm just blessed with good incoming seniors.
I've said it many times, but it's still true. Set the expectations as soon as a new member walks in the door, and you won't be chasing them down later.
Quote from: wacapgh on November 16, 2011, 10:11:15 PM
Also give thought to becoming an "Assistant _____ Officer"
1. You won't have the learn the job on your own.
+1
I like Personnel, I got a Master rating in it. But if you have no aptitude for it maybe Emergency Services or Cadet Programs will be a better choice plus those assignments you can use multiple assistants.
Greetings:
As I see it, and am attempting to do it, we should break things up into easily understood phases for new people.
CAP is such a complex organism that a new member will have trouble understanding all that is out there and may get discouraged if they try.
Seasoned members need to break it down into easily digested chunks and mentor new people.
Here is the program that I am putting together for the new people that come into my squadron. I have broken it down into phases:
Before CAPID Phase: Do the FEMA courses and part of Level 1
I put prospective members into this phase after they have indicated that they want to join. I have a pdf document that I email to them with links to all the sites to do this training and also recommend that they get a flash drive to devote to CAP and save all the certificates and the CAP library onto. Completion of this phase takes about 12 hours of work. Gives them something to do while getting the paperwork put together and sent to National. If they get done, or the paperwork gets derailed and has to go in again, they can start in on the Scanner study materials.
Got my CAPID Phase: Complete Level 1, GES, begin working on MRO, MSA, be assigned/select a Mentor.
The emphasis here is completion of Level 1, and getting started in the ES function of CAP. MSA and MRO are the two easiest Specialty qualifications which allow you to be useful on a mission base. They are springboards to future activities.
Ready to Participate Phase: Choose a specialty in consultation with Commander and Mentor, train for aircrew mission status depending on Squadron needs and your interests.
Rest of Life Phase: Look over the training pamphlet or SQTR and have fun doing the support specialty that you selected, participate in Squadron Meetings, weekend training missions and be ready for a real mission.
This is where we are at and it seems to be working. Teach them early and support them as they progress. Within a year or so, they are in position to mentor a new member.
Be careful not to overwork. CAP will suck all the spare time you have if you let it. Balance in your life is important if you want to play for many years.
Capt. Peterson
^ And if they didn't join for ES?
Then you could omit the FEMA Courses and their mentor could modify the career path.
I am trying to think of a member who would not have contact with cadets or ES and cannot come up with one, so Level 1 would stay on the list.
Our squadron is a composite squadron and we are trying to put together enough air crews to get a plane. Every mission needs a mission base. My thrust is to get *all* new members, no matter their specialty, prepared to assist on a mission base. My premise is that if there is a Mission Base set up at our airport to look for a pilot from our community, every member will want to help, including the non-es qualified member. If they took the time to do the FEMA courses, get GES and MSA, then they could help now, versus taking a day or two to get ready. Better to do the training when there is not an active search.
Capt. Peterson
What does having contact with cadets have to do with ES?
The priority for new senior members should be to complete Level One as soon as possible. Don't dilute their focus by adding other things into the training program until they finish Level One. There is plenty of time after Level One to complete other things. Without Level One, you can not assign them duty positions, specialty tracks, or award them ES qualifications.
Non-ES qualified members have no business being at a mission base. Get them qualified first.
Every mission does not need a mission base. I have ran several searches, some multi-state, from the comfort of my man cave.
Here's a checklist, in approx order of priority, on how to decide (then I will apply the checklist to the Comm Specialty):
1. (as stated before) what are you interested in learning and what does your squadron need?
2. (now for the meat) Does the specialty require written testing? How much?
3. Does the specialty require attending various conferences?
4. Does the specialty require attending other activities beyond usual sqd meetings?
5. How out of date is the Pamphlet for the specialty? (Has anyone bothered to update it since 199X?)
6. Run some specific scenarios on the requirements - see if you can even find the tests, etc that are referenced in the requirements.
Now for the example (and this is not slag the Comm Specialty, I simply am familiar with this specialty):
1. YMMV. For myself, I chose Comm because I like radio work and my Sqd needed it at the time of joining.
2. Comm Technician (ref CAPP 214E) requires CAP Form 119, Radio Operator's Test, and CAP Form 43, Technician Level Communicator's Test. You also need to obtain CAP Form 76 (Radio Operators Permit)
3. Comm Technician requires attending at least one communications meeting (Wing level in my case);
4. Comm Technician requires participation in one mission in a communications capacity; also need to participate in checkins on the local nets for >25% of the time; also have to participate in one comm-exercise sanctioned by the Wing Director of Comm.
5. The most current Comm Pamphlet CAPP 214E is from 1994, and this by itself means nothing in general. In the case of the Comm Specialty pamphlet, being old also means being out of date. For example there is no CAP Form 119, Radio Operator's Test, and no CAP Form 43, Technician Level Communicator's Test, and no CAP Form 76 (Radio Operators Permit). Not being available does not give you a 'Pass Go and Collect $200', however. You still gotta do stuff to meet the requirements.
6. Run some scenarios - if these tests are no longer offered, what requirements have replaced the tests? Is it documented or is this knowledge word of mouth? In the Comm-specialty example, BCUT and ACUT tests have replaced some of the Comm-specialty requirements, but it's not well documented and a new CAP member will have to really dig to figure all that out. This can be a problem for a given specialty, because generally speaking, it will be up to you to figure out how to otherwise meet the requirements for tests and permits that are no longer offered. An up to date CAP Pamphlet will save you hours of frustration and research later, so in making your specialty selection, I recommend to look for a Specialty Pamphlet that is current, and lists requirements that actually correspond to what CAP offers at the present.
Again, before anyone sends me hate mail on how I am slagging my own specialty, I chose Comm because of reason #1 above, and would do it again for the same reason despite all my "learnings".
I hope this is helpful.
Quote from: smithwr2 on November 27, 2011, 05:25:21 PM
5. The most current Comm Pamphlet CAPP 214E is from 1994, and this by itself means nothing in general. In the case of the Comm Specialty pamphlet, being old also means being out of date. For example there is no CAP Form 119, Radio Operator's Test, and no CAP Form 43, Technician Level Communicator's Test, and no CAP Form 76 (Radio Operators Permit). Not being available does not give you a 'Pass Go and Collect $200', however. You still gotta do stuff to meet the requirements.
The 119 test still exists, but it is no longer assigned a number. It's the test you take for ACUT, as it always has been. I think the Tech Level test is online now, so it still exists, too. Form 76 is now tracked online (BCUT or ACUT , so that is still a valid requirement.
Quote6. Run some scenarios - if these tests are no longer offered, what requirements have replaced the tests? Is it documented or is this knowledge word of mouth? In the Comm-specialty example, BCUT and ACUT tests have replaced some of the Comm-specialty requirements, but it's not well documented and a new CAP member will have to really dig to figure all that out. This can be a problem for a given specialty, because generally speaking, it will be up to you to figure out how to otherwise meet the requirements for tests and permits that are no longer offered. An up to date CAP Pamphlet will save you hours of frustration and research later, so in making your specialty selection, I recommend to look for a Specialty Pamphlet that is current, and lists requirements that actually correspond to what CAP offers at the present.
There is no test for BCUT.
I suppose this is exactly my point. Some Specialty Tracks require you to obtain 'local knowledge' for success. Research before choosing, and good luck...
As an aside, I found the Historian Track to be straightforward in terms of meeting requirements.
Quote from: SarDragon on November 27, 2011, 07:54:19 PM
Quote from: smithwr2 on November 27, 2011, 05:25:21 PM
5. The most current Comm Pamphlet CAPP 214E is from 1994, and this by itself means nothing in general. In the case of the Comm Specialty pamphlet, being old also means being out of date. For example there is no CAP Form 119, Radio Operator's Test, and no CAP Form 43, Technician Level Communicator's Test, and no CAP Form 76 (Radio Operators Permit). Not being available does not give you a 'Pass Go and Collect $200', however. You still gotta do stuff to meet the requirements.
The 119 test still exists, but it is no longer assigned a number. It's the test you take for ACUT, as it always has been. I think the Tech Level test is online now, so it still exists, too. Form 76 is now tracked online (BCUT or ACUT , so that is still a valid requirement.
This is common info, that has, in my wing, trickled down to the units through the comm folks and the unit commanders.
I know I am looking at Cadet Programs myself and they have mentioned starting up an ES Program as well. I could teach some things ES related. Is it possible to carry two tracks and have one be the primary?
Quote from: abdsp51 on January 29, 2012, 07:24:04 PM
I know I am looking at Cadet Programs myself and they have mentioned starting up an ES Program as well. I could teach some things ES related. Is it possible to carry two tracks and have one be the primary?
Yes. I have three myself.
What did you go with?
Quote from: abdsp51 on January 29, 2012, 07:33:06 PM
What did you go with?
CP, AE, LG. I'm stuck at tech on the first two because I can't afford the hotel rooms it would take for the annual TLC class or the AE conferences. I'm master rated on LG for promotions.
Great info to know. I always taught my airmen to be flexible and rounded and our unofficial motto at NCOA was "Semper Gumby". I just do no want to get sidetracked into something that I wouldn't be happy with.
You never stated what you do outside of CAP. You could select a specialty that would help you outside of CAP and well as help you inside of CAP. Safety is a good specialty as well as AE, finance, personnel, administration, etc. Look them all over before you select one. Also discuss with your unit commander how you can best help the unit and yourself.
What outside of ES there is not much that what I do outside of CAP can relate to CAP. I spoke with the unit and let them know my wishes. I have a track that I would prefer but flexibiliy is also a key.