I have read the AFMAN 36-2203 and I cannot find anything about how to carry rifles while marching in a Color Guard. I know you carry the rifles at shoulder arms. Here is where I get kind of fuzzy, in the Army being the left side rifle bearer you carry the rifle at the left shoulder, I want to know if this would be the same for USAF and CAP, I have never watched a USAF color guard do their thing, but I have seen plenty of CAP color guards doing their stuff. As a cadet we kept ours at right shoulder, and we saw others doing the same and plenty of others carrying at left shoulder arms for the left rifle. Does anyone know for sure how it is supposed to be done?
Navy JROTC did this as well- the USN, USMC, and USA all agree fairly well on how drill should be done
The USAF decided to make itself the red-headed stepchild even in this case. ::)
I know that I am taught by my AF retired AFJROTC instructors that both rifles carry at Right Shoulder- however, I cannot speak for CAP officially because it is too late for me to research the regs.
If someone doesn't beat me to it, I'll provide insight tomorrow. Usually CAP and USAF agree on drill, though...
AFIK the AF is the only branch that does not stipulate which shoulder the rifle is carried on.
If you can find where it says it I will award you 10 of my very valuable brownie points.
If it's relevant, in Honor Guard the left/rear rifle bearer carries at left shoulder.
Quote from: tsrup on December 07, 2010, 04:07:15 AM
AFIK the AF is the only branch that does not stipulate which shoulder the rifle is carried on.
If you can find where it says it I will award you 10 of my very valuable brownie points.
That is just the thing, I can't find anything stating which shoulder to carry the rifle on. Not even a single picture of a USAF Color Guard carrying rifles. The AFMAN only shows a color guard carrying pistols.
BTW being that I cannot find anything I am teaching my color guard to carry the left rifle at left shoulder in order to avoid getting the rifle caught in the flag.
Look here:
http://capmembers.com/media/cms/M524_BA28735E30531.pdf
This is taken from CAPM 52-4, National Cadet Competition. Both guards are carrying at right shoulder.
That is a nice start, thank you, I never noticed those pictures in the manual. I just wish it would state something in writing about it. Thank you.
Quote from: manfredvonrichthofen on December 07, 2010, 04:19:29 AM
BTW being that I cannot find anything I am teaching my color guard to carry the left rifle at left shoulder in order to avoid getting the rifle caught in the flag.
Never a problem in my 1.5 years of AFJROTC. AFAIK, never been a problem for this unit at all. Just so you know it does work.
I guess it doesn't matter since both commands are 3 counts. My color guard was right shoulder for everybody.
Quote from: nesagsar on December 07, 2010, 12:41:09 PM
I guess it doesn't matter since both commands are 3 counts. My color guard was right shoulder for everybody.
Left shoulder is 2 counts, both to Left shoulder, and back to Port. Right shoulder is 3 counts to right, 2 to port.
However they are both 4 counts from order.
Quote from: tsrup on December 07, 2010, 02:40:05 PM
Quote from: nesagsar on December 07, 2010, 12:41:09 PM
I guess it doesn't matter since both commands are 3 counts. My color guard was right shoulder for everybody.
Left shoulder is 2 counts, both to Left shoulder, and back to Port. Right shoulder is 3 counts to right, 2 to port.
However they are both 4 counts from order.
It's amazing what you can forget in 5 years. I used to be the go to guy for this stuff. Thanks for clarifying.
Quote from: nesagsar on December 07, 2010, 12:41:09 PM
I guess it doesn't matter since both commands are 3 counts.
In HG, yes. In CG, no.
Quote from: HGjunkie on December 07, 2010, 08:33:58 PM
Quote from: nesagsar on December 07, 2010, 12:41:09 PM
I guess it doesn't matter since both commands are 3 counts.
In HG, yes. In CG, no.
How if a command in HG has 3 counts does it change in CG? I know the number for the right shoulder arms is really four counts from order, and to left shoulder from order is 5 counts. From port right shoulder is 3 counts and port to left shoulder is 3 counts also, and they are both also the same number of counts from present (4). The drill commands for the rifles are no different between CG and HG.
Quote from: manfredvonrichthofen on December 07, 2010, 09:38:40 PM
Quote from: HGjunkie on December 07, 2010, 08:33:58 PM
Quote from: nesagsar on December 07, 2010, 12:41:09 PM
I guess it doesn't matter since both commands are 3 counts.
In HG, yes. In CG, no.
How if a command in HG has 3 counts does it change in CG? I know the number for the right shoulder arms is really four counts from order, and to left shoulder from order is 5 counts. From port right shoulder is 3 counts and port to left shoulder is 3 counts also, and they are both also the same number of counts from present (4). The drill commands for the rifles are no different between CG and HG.
at least in AF HG the movements are slightly modified.
For example, when moving from right shoulder arms to port normally, the rolling of the rifle from your shoulder and positioning it in front of your self is one movement, movement number two is moving your hand from the butt of the rifle, to the stock.
In HG movement number one is is to move the rifle off your shoulder and remain holding it with one hand, while count two is when you rotate the rifle and catch with the second hand, and count three is where you move your right hand from the butt to the stock.
there are other differences and nuances in HG D&C but that was just an example.
Note:, AF HG manual (found here: http://www.ushistory.org/betsy/images/hgguide.pdf ) does not stipulate how the maneuver is altered for Left shoulder arms, nor does it make reference to Left Shoulder.
Also, as per the OP's question, Honor Guard does NOT equal Color Guard so the above post is merely extraneous information.
Quote from: tsrup on December 07, 2010, 09:46:15 PM
Note:, AF HG manual (found here: http://www.ushistory.org/betsy/images/hgguide.pdf )
Thank you, that answered my question perfectly. If you refer to FIG 3.7. (Right Shoulder) it shows the left rifleman with his rifle on his left shoulder. Thank you tsrup.